|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772175
03/05/15 01:53 PM
03/05/15 01:53 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
PLEASE POST THIS INFO ON EVERY MOPAR SITE YOU KNOW OF !! and also dart machinerys facebook page, pass the word on to go to dartmachinery.com and give them your input on this.we need the numbers to show the true need......
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: Quicktree]
#1772179
03/05/15 02:32 PM
03/05/15 02:32 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
|
Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
|
the reason I sold out from the big block stuff was because I couldn't find a block like many others have posted.
now, I would like to see some 4.15+ 6.1 hemi blocks made now that I'm into the new hemi stuff. I'm sure BES and Arrington would buy them by the pallets
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: DusterDave]
#1772182
03/05/15 03:30 PM
03/05/15 03:30 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
|
I got the big block side covered so how about an aluminum copy of an R3 small block.
1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: JohnRR]
#1772183
03/05/15 04:03 PM
03/05/15 04:03 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
BradH
Taking time off to work on my car
|
Taking time off to work on my car
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
|
Quote:
Tell them to contact Koleno and see if they can work together , the tooling cost would be very low in this situation.
You'd think that could be a win-win collaboration, but it's hard to say how different companies (people) work together. 
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772184
03/05/15 04:09 PM
03/05/15 04:09 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
|
Dudes, it's going to be very hard to get anyone to build a block if nobody can agree on what they want.
Let's start out with a 4.80", 10.725 RB mains, then add a 4.80" 9.980 low deck with RB mains. It'd be great if they could go out to 4.500 bore, but even a 4.375 guaranteed would be better than nothing. Also on the wish list would be a stouter bottom end, possibly GII Hemi style main caps.
That'd be an enormous first step.
See how those sell, then if the market exists, add more styles. But, asking for everything at once is not going to get anything built.
If the potential manufacturer is seeing too many variations he'll do nothing because the fragmented nature of the market does not guarantee enough return or volume to pay for the initial investment.
Can't wait for the day of printing complete blocks.
R.
Then
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772186
03/05/15 04:16 PM
03/05/15 04:16 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,563
Janesville, WI
SpareParts
pro stock
|
pro stock
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,563
Janesville, WI
|
Quote:
I got the big block side covered so how about an aluminum copy of an R3 small block.
Hell even an iron block would be cool! Anything SB is a bonus to me
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: JohnRR]
#1772188
03/05/15 04:26 PM
03/05/15 04:26 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 369
Indy
496 A-body
enthusiast
|
enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 369
Indy
|
Quote:
Tell them to contact Koleno and see if they can work together , the tooling cost would be very low in this situation.
 get involved with Ritter and get the SB stuff moving along too...
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: 496 A-body]
#1772189
03/05/15 04:38 PM
03/05/15 04:38 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
think of it this way,they could easily offer an iron b,rb and a hemi replacement block good to 1000+ horsepower cheap,and i am sure the r3 replacement market is there.now the gen3 market is exploding also...they always give you options with a real out of the box USABLE block.no bs,no wait time and no off to the machine shop to add another grand just to use it.we really need to take this golden opportunity to the production level.i threw the bait out there and they bit !!!let them know....
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772190
03/05/15 04:43 PM
03/05/15 04:43 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
BradH
Taking time off to work on my car
|
Taking time off to work on my car
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
|
Quote:
So now you want then to do both a B and an RB block when there are already good options out there thru Indy, Keith Black, and others.
I don't really have a dog in this fight since I'm likely stuck in the OEM block band-aid approach, but I'd like to know the truth behind what you said about existing aftermarket B & RB blocks.
This is what I've been hearing (right or wrong):
1. Indy aluminum - Available product, but poor QC; pay for a "finished" block and still have to have someone else fix the machine work
2. Keith Black aluminum - Great block... once it finally shows up. Unless you're the only game in town, that's a business model headed for disaster (again).
3. Koleno - Nice iron block, but not currently in production, nor any expected time for when it will be
4. MP Mega iron (1st generation) - Decent block, but long since gone from inventory and replaced by the...
5. World / MP block - Not a well finished product to begin with, plus lack of availability (World no longer contracted by MP to produce them?)
So, even for the "bread and butter" B / RB replacement blocks, what's really out there today?
You need to consider what's THE product that will generate enough sales volume to entice a company like Dart to get into the Mopar block market. Everything else that are way more niche applications are simply too obscure to take on and expect to be profitable.
Otherwise, this will get the same response from Dart as David Vizard gave when someone asked about him doing a Mopar-specific performance book: "Sorry, not going to happen!"
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772191
03/05/15 04:52 PM
03/05/15 04:52 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
camastomcat
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
|
The reason to make any 4.800 BS blocks, would be to satisfy just a few. And a low deck, tall deck version, they are available in aluminum and the cast crowd would mostly use stock blocks IMO. If they were going to make something, a 5.0 or 5.3 BS is what's needed. If they were to make the block, there needs to be a head, crankshaft, etc. to fit the block. The GM designed stuff is already there and has been for a while. I have no idea why anyone with any business sense would do this for us.
As far as small block stuff, I haven't a clue as I moved away from that many years ago.
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: BradH]
#1772192
03/05/15 04:56 PM
03/05/15 04:56 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
|
Love my keith black and yes I ordered it before I needed it as I was told by other to do so that's s non issue. Indy makes a great block to and many of my friends have an race the heck out of them. On such friend running 8's would trash a block almost every race season with all the band aids till as he says. Wised up
1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: camastomcat]
#1772193
03/05/15 04:58 PM
03/05/15 04:58 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
simple math,count the number of people using stock 20 plus year old blocks,then count the guys using the high dollar aftermarket stuff.an aftermarket replacement block capable of 1000+ hp would far out sell the big boy toys.you got to walk before you run here.there is a market for the more exotic stuff too,but eventually the stock stuff will run out.there has been zero production for many moons and an affordable replacement that could be used for a higher output application cheap,would be the hot ticket right now...
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: Oyvind Mopar]
#1772195
03/05/15 05:16 PM
03/05/15 05:16 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
BradH
Taking time off to work on my car
|
Taking time off to work on my car
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
|
Quote:
Maybe a simpler solution is to have a GM block cast in such a way that Mopar heads can be adapted? With CNC machinery it should not be too difficult to machine? But, maybe even simpler to use GM heads.....
Oh, right: "Dart introduces the new Dale Eicke Signature Series 'Mopar'  Blocks & Heads!"
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: Oyvind Mopar]
#1772196
03/05/15 05:18 PM
03/05/15 05:18 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319
Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
master
|
master
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319
Puyallup, WA
|
Cant really figure out why you guys are encouraged by this.... when I read the OP, I hear Dart saying: "Show me the volume, and we'll be there". Do you think they haven't already done their own market research? The only reason they would say this is that its a polite way of placating your request, while also telling you between the lines exactly why you don't already see those products. They already know that the return on investment for the Mopar market is just not there. Simple question: Why do you think the other options that were mentioned above (Kieth Black, Koleno, MP, World/MP) have gone by the wayside or are impossible to get? Do you think Dart hasn't noticed what happened with those business ventures? 
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#1772197
03/05/15 05:23 PM
03/05/15 05:23 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
|
Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
|
Quote:
Cant really figure out why you guys are encouraged by this.... when I read the OP, I hear Dart saying: "Show me the volume, and we'll be there". Do you think they haven't already done their own market research? The only reason they would say this is that its a polite way of placating your request, while also telling you between the lines exactly why you don't already see those products. They already know that the return on investment for the Mopar market is just not there. Simple question: Why do you think the other options that were mentioned above (Kieth Black, Koleno, MP, World/MP) have gone by the wayside or are impossible to get? Do you think Dart hasn't noticed what happened with those business ventures?
the guys with with LX cars spend boat loads of money. If everyone was smart, everyone should get behind the new hemi stuff because it will be our future
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772199
03/05/15 05:34 PM
03/05/15 05:34 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
WO23Coronet
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Cant really figure out why you guys are encouraged by this.... when I read the OP, I hear Dart saying: "Show me the volume, and we'll be there". Do you think they haven't already done their own market research? The only reason they would say this is that its a polite way of placating your request, while also telling you between the lines exactly why you don't already see those products. They already know that the return on investment for the Mopar market is just not there. Simple question: Why do you think the other options that were mentioned above (Kieth Black, Koleno, MP, World/MP) have gone by the wayside or are impossible to get? Do you think Dart hasn't noticed what happened with those business ventures?
the guys with with LX cars spend boat loads of money. If everyone was smart, everyone should get behind the new hemi stuff because it will be our future
I keep hearing the new Hemi guys bragging on how good the blocks are so why make a better flyswatter. 
They are good blocks but still have limits, an aftermarket one would be nice. A Siamese block good for 4.25" bore and a similar stroke would be nice. A raised deck (9.5-9.75) would really open up a world of HP for a Gen III, you could finally get some cubes to take advantage of their awesome heads and package it with a reasonable rod/stroke ratio and CH
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772200
03/05/15 05:37 PM
03/05/15 05:37 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,776
Ontario Canada
MattW
master
|
master
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,776
Ontario Canada
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Cant really figure out why you guys are encouraged by this.... when I read the OP, I hear Dart saying: "Show me the volume, and we'll be there". Do you think they haven't already done their own market research? The only reason they would say this is that its a polite way of placating your request, while also telling you between the lines exactly why you don't already see those products. They already know that the return on investment for the Mopar market is just not there. Simple question: Why do you think the other options that were mentioned above (Kieth Black, Koleno, MP, World/MP) have gone by the wayside or are impossible to get? Do you think Dart hasn't noticed what happened with those business ventures?
the guys with with LX cars spend boat loads of money. If everyone was smart, everyone should get behind the new hemi stuff because it will be our future
I keep hearing the new Hemi guys bragging on how good the blocks are so why make a better flyswatter.
Your correct but we need a block that will appease the hard core racers.
Take the factory 6.4 block without the vvt cam and let it be able to go what 4.2 bore?
Then add some height to it
Matt
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: StealthWedge67]
#1772201
03/05/15 05:41 PM
03/05/15 05:41 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
BradH
Taking time off to work on my car
|
Taking time off to work on my car
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
|
Quote:
Cant really figure out why you guys are encouraged by this.... when I read the OP, I hear Dart saying: "Show me the volume, and we'll be there". Do you think they haven't already done their own market research? The only reason they would say this is that its a polite way of placating your request, while also telling you between the lines exactly why you don't already see those products. They already know that the return on investment for the Mopar market is just not there.
Same opinion, here. It's just a polite response from Dart re: an option they've already ruled out on their own.
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772203
03/05/15 05:52 PM
03/05/15 05:52 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
|
Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Cant really figure out why you guys are encouraged by this.... when I read the OP, I hear Dart saying: "Show me the volume, and we'll be there". Do you think they haven't already done their own market research? The only reason they would say this is that its a polite way of placating your request, while also telling you between the lines exactly why you don't already see those products. They already know that the return on investment for the Mopar market is just not there. Simple question: Why do you think the other options that were mentioned above (Kieth Black, Koleno, MP, World/MP) have gone by the wayside or are impossible to get? Do you think Dart hasn't noticed what happened with those business ventures?
the guys with with LX cars spend boat loads of money. If everyone was smart, everyone should get behind the new hemi stuff because it will be our future
I keep hearing the new Hemi guys bragging on how good the blocks are so why make a better flyswatter.
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: sixpackgut]
#1772206
03/05/15 06:07 PM
03/05/15 06:07 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
of course they are not going to do it if they cant sell them.its not rocket science.opinions as they are,there is a need and we all know it.only time will tell if they will do this.voice your opinion on their website and if they dont,well,sometimes even an angel has a stinky butt......
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: sixpackgut]
#1772207
03/05/15 06:12 PM
03/05/15 06:12 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,290
fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,290
fredericksburg,va
|
Quote:
Quote:
And therein lies the problem. Getting a pool of "buyers" together to buy the produced blocks. Seems everyone has their druthers but few agree what that should be. There are thousands of Chevy buyers to buy their stuff, do you think you could get 500 mopar buyers say for a cross bolted main RB aluminum block? The cost of producing a hundred of those would be astronomical causing most guys to pass.
I bet the sales of SB chevy and ford blocks have gone down the tubes since the aftermarket picked up and ran with the LS stuff
I agree, the only way is Chrysler making a taller aluminum block for the big trucks(3500 and bigger) to replace the diesel, which they are doing with the 392 now. They sell thousands ard we reap the benefits.
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: steve660]
#1772209
03/05/15 06:42 PM
03/05/15 06:42 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
josh king just posted that the world mopar blocks are back in production and that arrow racing engines is doing the machining.they should be available in the next couple months.thats good news ,but still doesnt address the need for good replacement b/rb and hemi blocks for the average joe racer.....
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: BradH]
#1772210
03/05/15 06:47 PM
03/05/15 06:47 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
Quote:
Quote:
So now you want then to do both a B and an RB block when there are already good options out there thru Indy, Keith Black, and others.
I don't really have a dog in this fight since I'm likely stuck in the OEM block band-aid approach, but I'd like to know the truth behind what you said about existing aftermarket B & RB blocks.
This is what I've been hearing (right or wrong):
1. Indy aluminum - Available product, but poor QC; pay for a "finished" block and still have to have someone else fix the machine work
2. Keith Black aluminum - Great block... once it finally shows up. Unless you're the only game in town, that's a business model headed for disaster (again).
3. Koleno - Nice iron block, but not currently in production, nor any expected time for when it will be
4. MP Mega iron (1st generation) - Decent block, but long since gone from inventory and replaced by the...
5. World / MP block - Not a well finished product to begin with, plus lack of availability (World no longer contracted by MP to produce them?)
So, even for the "bread and butter" B / RB replacement blocks, what's really out there today?
You need to consider what's THE product that will generate enough sales volume to entice a company like Dart to get into the Mopar block market. Everything else that are way more niche applications are simply too obscure to take on and expect to be profitable.
Otherwise, this will get the same response from Dart as David Vizard gave when someone asked about him doing a Mopar-specific performance book: "Sorry, not going to happen!"
Your forgetting HP Performance,Dave has the same problem as KB getting casting from the foundry.
If your only gripe about the Indy blocks is the machine work from Indy then you can choose to buy the block unfinished and have your choise of machinist finish it as some of our customers have done.
The only problem we see with lobbying Dart or anyone to build blocks is the initial proposed quanity needed to justify the cost of molding and casting the first run would have to exceed the investment.In other words a realization of profit before taking the risk.  
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: B G Racing]
#1772212
03/05/15 07:24 PM
03/05/15 07:24 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
There are a couple of things that come to mind when it comes to ANY new item.. yes they have to see the dollar on investment but usually they have a first run and they cost X based on the quantity but if you plan on long term(which in the case of blocks) you should be able to make a profit.. but many companies want to see that profit in short term.. but if the price is right then it shouldnt take long to get it.. I'm sure if its priced like GM stuff that the mopar crowd would buy(even as cheap as they are)but everyone doesnt need a block at this minute but over a couple of years they might.. supposedly there are a number of guys looking right now.... but this is JMO and I dont see Dart jumping in.. otherwise they would have 10 or 15 years ago if there was a buck to be made 
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772216
03/05/15 08:58 PM
03/05/15 08:58 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 632
MD-USA
Dodgeguy101
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 632
MD-USA
|
Quote:
Quote:
Question? Who makes replacement blocks for all the b/rb guys.........answer:NOBODY
I have a 440 shortblock with a forged crank for sale at 375 dollars and can't even get one hit. Who needs replacement blocks when you can't even sell original equipment.
Good price, but that block has the same flaws, not strong enough, as the one I have. Don't need another one.
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: cudaman1969]
#1772219
03/05/15 11:15 PM
03/05/15 11:15 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
If they had a decent crossbolted BB made they would probably sell 10 of them. 10 people are still dumb enough to throw wheel barrows of cash at something that on a good day MIGHT make 775hp with 14.1 CR and .800 lift cam because the ultimate cylinder head available flows 370 at .800 lift. HUGE market potential. W9/R3 stuff is sweet but you may as well build a fricken Cup engine.
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772222
03/05/15 11:35 PM
03/05/15 11:35 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
I just get frustrated by people thinking we need another Wedge block. We have PLENTY. The Gen III is where its at RIGHT NOW, you have drag racers loving them and an entire market of new Mopar gearheads with 2006 and newer hot rods that are putting blowers and turboes on by the 100's. One example, take ANY Charger RT from 68-71 and put it against my wifes 2012 Charger RT and I can promise you will see nothing but tail lights of my wifes car. Things are a changing guys.
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: sixpackgut]
#1772229
03/06/15 01:08 AM
03/06/15 01:08 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
|
If I knew the issues were fixed for sure I would have one. With the good small block heads avalible now I would take advance of the weights breaks given to the small block guys. I think it's a better platform
1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772230
03/06/15 01:23 AM
03/06/15 01:23 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
|
Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
|
This thread is making want to drop 4k on a g3 aluminum block just so I have one before they disappear
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: Spaceman Spiff]
#1772231
03/06/15 01:58 AM
03/06/15 01:58 AM
|
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,954
Blairsden, CA
Triggerfish
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,954
Blairsden, CA
|
Quote:
Quote:
I just get frustrated by people thinking we need another Wedge block. We have PLENTY. The Gen III is where its at RIGHT NOW, you have drag racers loving them and an entire market of new Mopar gearheads with 2006 and newer hot rods that are putting blowers and turboes on by the 100's. One example, take ANY Charger RT from 68-71 and put it against my wifes 2012 Charger RT and I can promise you will see nothing but tail lights of my wifes car. Things are a changing guys.
ANY charger from 68-71? Is your wife's car stock?
I understand what you're saying about the gen 3's. New technology, light
weight, strong blocks & great heads, but racing my bro's 08 6.1 Superbee against his 69 4 spd R/T (517 gen 2 Hemi), I was over 2 seconds & 13 mph behind at the stripe. Still, for under 400 cubes, the 6.1 is a street beast.
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: Triggerfish]
#1772232
03/06/15 02:15 AM
03/06/15 02:15 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
|
Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I just get frustrated by people thinking we need another Wedge block. We have PLENTY. The Gen III is where its at RIGHT NOW, you have drag racers loving them and an entire market of new Mopar gearheads with 2006 and newer hot rods that are putting blowers and turboes on by the 100's. One example, take ANY Charger RT from 68-71 and put it against my wifes 2012 Charger RT and I can promise you will see nothing but tail lights of my wifes car. Things are a changing guys.
ANY charger from 68-71? Is your wife's car stock?
I understand what you're saying about the gen 3's. New technology, light
weight, strong blocks & great heads, but racing my bro's 08 6.1 Superbee against his 69 4 spd R/T (517 gen 2 Hemi), I was over 2 seconds & 13 mph behind at the stripe. Still, for under 400 cubes, the 6.1 is a street beast.
Not really a fair comparrison
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: sixpackgut]
#1772233
03/06/15 02:50 AM
03/06/15 02:50 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,486
SoCal
Brian Hafliger
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,486
SoCal
|
I just talked with Richard Maskin about 3 weeks ago about this very thing...(and other things). He told me not a chance in hell! World can't at this time because Fiat won't sell the casting tooling...so? Sucks right now for the mopar world.... 
Brian Hafliger
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: Brian Hafliger]
#1772234
03/06/15 03:06 AM
03/06/15 03:06 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
I might have got a little excited, but I do stick behind this statement of ANY STOCK Charger RT ON THE STREET against a new RT. I think we all can say the aftermarket for us Mopar folks is stagnant and has been for a while. Im not saying the old stuff is junk because it is not at all, the old stuff is what got me hooked to begin with. I hope there is a future in this stuff SOMEWHERE that we can still own the crown other than Top Fuel. The LX/LC aftermarket is doing pretty damn good though all else considered.
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: 72Swinger]
#1772237
03/06/15 12:59 PM
03/06/15 12:59 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
DaveRS23
Special needs idiot
|
Special needs idiot
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
|
Quote:
The Gen III is where its at RIGHT NOW, you have drag racers loving them and an entire market of new Mopar gearheads with 2006 and newer hot rods that are putting blowers and turboes on by the 100's. One example, take ANY Charger RT from 68-71 and put it against my wifes 2012 Charger RT and I can promise you will see nothing but tail lights of my wifes car. Things are a changing guys.
While I admire your passion, you have let it run away with you on this one. You simply cannot support your conclusions in the real world.
The new generation of Hemis are a very good design and we are very fortunate to have them. BUT THEY CANNOT NOR WILL NOT REPLACE THE WEDGES AND 2ND GEN HEMIS AS THE "GO-TO" ENGINES FOR MOST MOPAR MUSCLE CAR GUYS!
And there are a ton of reasons for that. Here's a few:
For there to be enough sales volume to justify new development and production of pieces for the new Hemi, non-racers will be the bulk of the buyers. Just like it was 40 or 50 years ago. And most street car guys will not be looking for big hard parts like blocks, cams, stoker kits for these new Hemis like they have been and still are for our old engines. And this thread is about lack of blocks for our much more popular old stuff.
Park your new R/T next to a 2nd gen R/T and look which gets the most attention at a car show. Especially from Mopar guys.
After you spend the coin to build up your new Hemi, you will then need to spend that much again on the drive train to hold the additional power.
While we still get some very good parts at reasonable prices at the salvage yards for our dinosaurs, there will not be much of that going on with the new stuff.
Most muscle car guys still can't tune a carb after all these decades and now you expect them to deal with electronics and computers? Dream on. Then there's Chrysler's closed architecture.
If handled wisely, our dinosaurs are an investment, more likely to appreciate than depreciate. What do you think happens to your new R/T's value when throw that blower on it, beat on it a few years and then want to sell it? How much of your money will you get back?
It takes much, much more of our disposable income today to play with these new toys than it did with the old ones. And household budgets matter to most of us. Frankly, far fewer guys have the time or the money to throw at beefing up these newer toys today. Especially given the depreciation involved.
Master, again and still
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: DaveRS23]
#1772238
03/06/15 05:40 PM
03/06/15 05:40 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
Quote:
Quote:
The Gen III is where its at RIGHT NOW, you have drag racers loving them and an entire market of new Mopar gearheads with 2006 and newer hot rods that are putting blowers and turboes on by the 100's. One example, take ANY Charger RT from 68-71 and put it against my wifes 2012 Charger RT and I can promise you will see nothing but tail lights of my wifes car. Things are a changing guys.
While I admire your passion, you have let it run away with you on this one. You simply cannot support your conclusions in the real world.
The new generation of Hemis are a very good design and we are very fortunate to have them. BUT THEY CANNOT NOR WILL NOT REPLACE THE WEDGES AND 2ND GEN HEMIS AS THE "GO-TO" ENGINES FOR MOST MOPAR MUSCLE CAR GUYS!
And there are a ton of reasons for that. Here's a few:
For there to be enough sales volume to justify new development and production of pieces for the new Hemi, non-racers will be the bulk of the buyers. Just like it was 40 or 50 years ago. And most street car guys will not be looking for big hard parts like blocks, cams, stoker kits for these new Hemis like they have been and still are for our old engines. And this thread is about lack of blocks for our much more popular old stuff.
Park your new R/T next to a 2nd gen R/T and look which gets the most attention at a car show. Especially from Mopar guys.
After you spend the coin to build up your new Hemi, you will then need to spend that much again on the drive train to hold the additional power.
While we still get some very good parts at reasonable prices at the salvage yards for our dinosaurs, there will not be much of that going on with the new stuff.
Most muscle car guys still can't tune a carb after all these decades and now you expect them to deal with electronics and computers? Dream on. Then there's Chrysler's closed architecture.
If handled wisely, our dinosaurs are an investment, more likely to appreciate than depreciate. What do you think happens to your new R/T's value when throw that blower on it, beat on it a few years and then want to sell it? How much of your money will you get back?
It takes much, much more of our disposable income today to play with these new toys than it did with the old ones. And household budgets matter to most of us. Frankly, far fewer guys have the time or the money to throw at beefing up these newer toys today. Especially given the depreciation involved.
Looking at it like that, investment, why the need for new blocks? If a car is only there for its value, how hard does it get beat on? Enough to go through a block every 20 years? I have a slant 6 Dart that I built to drive the wheels off of, its already been through a 451 B engine. I was going to go to a 496" B motor then I started doing the math, for what a GOOD set of BB heads cost I built a solid 420" 6.1 short block that SHOULD out last a 500" BB and be right on par power wise for my street and race needs. It will also run on pump gas, has a 0 maintenance valvetrain and I would bet gets double the fuel mileage. Those are the reasons I went to the new stuff, efficiency. My car is worth the same with a slant 6 as it is with a BB at the end of the day so "period correct" means nothing to me.
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772239
03/06/15 05:53 PM
03/06/15 05:53 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,043
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
|
I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,043
U.S.S.A.
|
Quote:
josh king just posted that the world mopar blocks are back in production and that arrow racing engines is doing the machining.they should be available in the next couple months.thats good news ,but still doesnt address the need for good replacement b/rb and hemi blocks for the average joe racer.....
and the average joe racer is not going to see one because average joe racer is so cheap he squeaks when he walks.
I doubt you will ever see a B/RB/Hemi Mopar block at the same price level as chevy/ford. Sadly it's just not going to happen because it can't be done and make a profit in the amount of time required. Even when the [censored] claimed they could do it for $1500, almost everyone was salivating but guess what, never happened and it was more than likely tooling costs even going overseas ... it's easier to sell thousand or 2 sets of heads that look STOCK ... because that's what average joe racer wants ... for $899, but most guys won't pony up 1500 - 2k for a block when they can run a $400 stock block.
If there was money to be made Dart would have made them 15 yrs ago , when people actually had money ...
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: DaveRS23]
#1772240
03/06/15 06:26 PM
03/06/15 06:26 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
WO23Coronet
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
|
Quote:
Quote:
The Gen III is where its at RIGHT NOW, you have drag racers loving them and an entire market of new Mopar gearheads with 2006 and newer hot rods that are putting blowers and turboes on by the 100's. One example, take ANY Charger RT from 68-71 and put it against my wifes 2012 Charger RT and I can promise you will see nothing but tail lights of my wifes car. Things are a changing guys.
While I admire your passion, you have let it run away with you on this one. You simply cannot support your conclusions in the real world.
The new generation of Hemis are a very good design and we are very fortunate to have them. BUT THEY CANNOT NOR WILL NOT REPLACE THE WEDGES AND 2ND GEN HEMIS AS THE "GO-TO" ENGINES FOR MOST MOPAR MUSCLE CAR GUYS!
And there are a ton of reasons for that. Here's a few:
For there to be enough sales volume to justify new development and production of pieces for the new Hemi, non-racers will be the bulk of the buyers. Just like it was 40 or 50 years ago. And most street car guys will not be looking for big hard parts like blocks, cams, stoker kits for these new Hemis like they have been and still are for our old engines. And this thread is about lack of blocks for our much more popular old stuff.
Park your new R/T next to a 2nd gen R/T and look which gets the most attention at a car show. Especially from Mopar guys.
After you spend the coin to build up your new Hemi, you will then need to spend that much again on the drive train to hold the additional power.
While we still get some very good parts at reasonable prices at the salvage yards for our dinosaurs, there will not be much of that going on with the new stuff.
Most muscle car guys still can't tune a carb after all these decades and now you expect them to deal with electronics and computers? Dream on. Then there's Chrysler's closed architecture.
If handled wisely, our dinosaurs are an investment, more likely to appreciate than depreciate. What do you think happens to your new R/T's value when throw that blower on it, beat on it a few years and then want to sell it? How much of your money will you get back?
It takes much, much more of our disposable income today to play with these new toys than it did with the old ones. And household budgets matter to most of us. Frankly, far fewer guys have the time or the money to throw at beefing up these newer toys today. Especially given the depreciation involved.
You're missing the point, I don't think anyone is expecting a Gen III to replace the B/RB platform for "classic car" guys, it's a dying market as it is, hell we can't even get a decent aftermarket RB block, BUT the future is definitely the Gen III, young guys (you know, the future of this hobby) don't generally care about a platform that's been out of production for almost 40 yrs. they care about what can be bought cheaply now. It's this investment attitude (your own words) that are killing classics because no one can afford them. BTW, I've always been a BB guy, matter of fact the engine going into my 67 Coronet is a 400 w/a 440 crank, it's the cheapest way for me to get 450 HP (509 cam, 915 heads, M1 tunnel ram, etc), BUT if I had the $ it would be a Gen III, 400+ cfm out of factory heads with no bore shrouding just makes sense
Last edited by WO23Coronet; 03/06/15 07:21 PM.
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772242
03/06/15 08:16 PM
03/06/15 08:16 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
I have a cherry 73' 440 block and a just as nice 72' 630 400 block sitting under my bench. Im saving them as an investment....
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: WO23Coronet]
#1772245
03/06/15 10:08 PM
03/06/15 10:08 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
DaveRS23
Special needs idiot
|
Special needs idiot
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
The Gen III is where its at RIGHT NOW, you have drag racers loving them and an entire market of new Mopar gearheads with 2006 and newer hot rods that are putting blowers and turboes on by the 100's. One example, take ANY Charger RT from 68-71 and put it against my wifes 2012 Charger RT and I can promise you will see nothing but tail lights of my wifes car. Things are a changing guys.
While I admire your passion, you have let it run away with you on this one. You simply cannot support your conclusions in the real world.
The new generation of Hemis are a very good design and we are very fortunate to have them. BUT THEY CANNOT NOR WILL NOT REPLACE THE WEDGES AND 2ND GEN HEMIS AS THE "GO-TO" ENGINES FOR MOST MOPAR MUSCLE CAR GUYS!
And there are a ton of reasons for that. Here's a few:
For there to be enough sales volume to justify new development and production of pieces for the new Hemi, non-racers will be the bulk of the buyers. Just like it was 40 or 50 years ago. And most street car guys will not be looking for big hard parts like blocks, cams, stoker kits for these new Hemis like they have been and still are for our old engines. And this thread is about lack of blocks for our much more popular old stuff.
Park your new R/T next to a 2nd gen R/T and look which gets the most attention at a car show. Especially from Mopar guys.
After you spend the coin to build up your new Hemi, you will then need to spend that much again on the drive train to hold the additional power.
While we still get some very good parts at reasonable prices at the salvage yards for our dinosaurs, there will not be much of that going on with the new stuff.
Most muscle car guys still can't tune a carb after all these decades and now you expect them to deal with electronics and computers? Dream on. Then there's Chrysler's closed architecture.
If handled wisely, our dinosaurs are an investment, more likely to appreciate than depreciate. What do you think happens to your new R/T's value when throw that blower on it, beat on it a few years and then want to sell it? How much of your money will you get back?
It takes much, much more of our disposable income today to play with these new toys than it did with the old ones. And household budgets matter to most of us. Frankly, far fewer guys have the time or the money to throw at beefing up these newer toys today. Especially given the depreciation involved.
You're missing the point, I don't think anyone is expecting a Gen III to replace the B/RB platform for "classic car" guys, it's a dying market as it is, hell we can't even get a decent aftermarket RB block, BUT the future is definitely the Gen III, young guys (you know, the future of this hobby) don't generally care about a platform that's been out of production for almost 40 yrs. they care about what can be bought cheaply now. It's this investment attitude (your own words) that are killing classics because no one can afford them. BTW, I've always been a BB guy, matter of fact the engine going into my 67 Coronet is a 400 w/a 440 crank, it's the cheapest way for me to get 450 HP (509 cam, 915 heads, M1 tunnel ram, etc), BUT if I had the $ it would be a Gen III, 400+ cfm out of factory heads with no bore shrouding just makes sense
I may be missing your point. But my point was that there has not been enough sales volume with the BB and Hemi blocks of old to warrant production. So it is hard to believe that there is enough sales demand for the new Hemi block production without major inroads into our classic cars as well as today's modern cars.
We are talking about engine blocks here. Not air induction systems or computer controllers. So while I could see an explosion in demand for bolt-on items for the new Hemis, there are fewer and fewer guys (young and old) that are willing to build an engine from scratch. So I would be shocked to see enough demand for aftermarket blocks to be produced.
As to investment value, most of us will want another car/project at some point and will need to recover enough money from our current car in order to move on to the next car/project. At least those of us that are not made of money, anyway. And that will be harder to do when depreciation is a big part of the picture.
A lot of the older guys will not move onto the new Hemis because they will be more expensive to build and because there is a lot that has to be learned. And it will take a certain number of older guys along with the younger guys to generate enough sales volume to justify an aftermarket block source.
Heck, there may be enough guys being syphoned off by the new Hemi, that there is even less demand for the older stuff and thereby helping to put the nails in it's coffin.
It does all come down to dollars and cents.
I am not debating the current or future popularity of the new Hemi vs our old iron. I am just laying out why I do not think there will ever be enough demand for aftermarket block production of the new Hemis. The already small pie can only be sliced into so many pieces.
Master, again and still
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: DaveRS23]
#1772246
03/06/15 11:36 PM
03/06/15 11:36 PM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Not enough sales volume because when you want one they have never been available-Think how many hundreds of sales were LOST for that reason forcing folks to band aid up a stocker and race--so when they are available again ( ha ha) those guys won't toss what they built just to do another with that new block. It has been a joke for over a decade now with zero signs of meaningful improvement in the near future. Tooling exist--tooling does not need to be created again at high cost--That tooling need to be transported to China and hand delivered to a real company that has the CNC equipment and the desire to make a profit by producing a quality product with reasonable price. China makes some crap and lots of it but--China also makes some darn good stuff--The new Sidewinder is produced by a modern company that IMO is second to NONE--IF you examine the alloy quality of the Sidewinder and the alloy quality of the guides and the perfect press fit of the seats and the perfection that is the CNC work you would see that it is World Class Quality Now...the Chevy head they are making and the SBF head as well as new FE Ford head will soon dominate the market--they are all AWESOME units!! The intelligent redesign of the water jackets in the Chevy head is astounding--those guys are smart! It is like Japan after WW2--stuff from there was crap--now it is among the best stuff produced anywhere in the world--China is making that happen even faster--they will be on the moon soon and we will look up and think WTH!! Quality and markets EVOLVE--they are getting better FAST. They HAVE to to keep on keeping on There already exists knock offs of Dart Chevy blocks--on Racejunk for cheap and ..Dart blocks are CHEAP over here already so there is room --it can be done men! I just have to ad for the small block guys I have been selling Mopar parts for over 25 years and over that time the one thing I know is that 90% of Mopar sales is big block so even as a Mopar guy I would not ever take a chance on anything small block Mopar--the market is so small it is unbelievable so you guys are screwed--I would bet my house you will not get another aftermarket block so better gather what is out there already--didn't say I don't love a small block--I do! But any parts dealer anywhere will tell you it is true.
Last edited by crabman173; 03/06/15 11:41 PM.
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: DaveRS23]
#1772247
03/07/15 12:34 AM
03/07/15 12:34 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
WO23Coronet
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
|
I see what you're saying but respectfully disagree, peruse LXForums or one of the many modern Mopar ones, plenty of $$$ builds going on, plenty of money being spent on new HEMIS. Proof is the numerous supercharger and turbocharger kits offered (6-10K), if there wasn't a market they wouldn't be there. If someone came out with a reasonably priced ($2500ish?) Gen III Hemi block with upgrades previously mentioned (4.2"ish bore, maybe a raised deck) they would sell. Like I said earlier I'm going old school because of cost and it'll make what I need,but it will be replaced by a Gen III in the future, probably with forced induction.
I'm not against an aftermarket BB again at all, more options the better, I just think we're putting ourselves further behind by not getting a Gen III option.
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: WO23Coronet]
#1772248
03/07/15 10:31 AM
03/07/15 10:31 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
DaveRS23
Special needs idiot
|
Special needs idiot
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
|
To be honest, I hope you're right on this one. Without it, there isn't as much future in this hobby.
Master, again and still
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: ]
#1772249
03/07/15 01:33 PM
03/07/15 01:33 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 220
Jerry Kathe
enthusiast
|
enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 220
|
Crabman173 is dead on with a zero. The market WILL and always has lend its self to areas of volume, and speaking only in terms Mopar, that is the bracket racer and muscle car combinations that use BB combos. Vehicles that have been built with the BB as the platform have the transmission pattern, motor/mid plate spacing and all the associated peripherals already established. I think it is fabulous the Gen III hemi has come along, but the burden and expense to convert would be impractical for the vast majority. Just like the GM LS platform, it’s a great new market, but in no way has affected the BB GM market. I also agree (sorry this may sting) in thinking it would be ludicrous to develop anything small block….why? There is no replacement for displacement and the current SB Mopar is a very small minority. If you are fortunate enough to throw huge $$ at your project or program….move on with the generic wide BS blocks and call it what you wish. I’m fortunate enough to have the money for the better existing BBM pieces, (ie. Predator) but simply refuse to pay 2X the realistic value. Additionally I have no interest in completely shelving all my current BB Mopar parts in favor of starting all over just to bracket race. But I would defiantly consider continuous upgrades to the components during maintenance intervals. Yet another contribution......
|
|
|
Re: new dart mopar blocks !
[Re: Jerry Kathe]
#1772250
03/07/15 04:36 PM
03/07/15 04:36 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
|
Personally I would love to see a new aftermarket SB or BB block. It does not make that much sense to develop right now financially, it would make about as much sense as it would have to come out with a new flat-head ford V8 block 20 years ago. If someone that already had the tools and know how to do one it would make sense for a stock but much stronger block. Stretched bore centers are going to eliminate tons and tons of buyers because of the expense of replacing EVERYTHING. A SB would make more sense with a 4.25 bore, I know if they were somewhat affordable I would build one for my R/T dakota with a 4.25 crank. Prefer AL but iron would do. In the grand scheme of things though the gen III would make most financial sense if you had to make one from scratch and it would need a bigger bore and more strength, that is the only thing the factory blocks lack in and it is only a problem in the very high end stuff. Of course lots of guys with the newer cars would buy one just to get more displacement for bragging rights
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772254
03/07/15 11:20 PM
03/07/15 11:20 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
|
How bout a poll, what would you build for yourself or your next customer in line if you have a shop?
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: HotRodDave]
#1772256
03/08/15 02:39 AM
03/08/15 02:39 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 577
Arkansas
Adrielp
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 577
Arkansas
|
4.5in Bore, 9.00 and 9.5in deck B block. 4 bolt mains w/ 2 45deg bolts in the direction of bore travel.
Last edited by Adrielp; 03/08/15 02:40 AM.
Adriel Paradise
Substation Design Engineer III
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: Adrielp]
#1772257
03/08/15 03:06 AM
03/08/15 03:06 AM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
world is now producing a new 409 w block ! i mean really? how many of those do you think they will sell? thats a massive stab in the dark compared to a new mopar block.if they can do the tooling to sell one of those a year then a mopar deal would be a walk in the park.donovan still sells 392 blocks.how many followers there under the age of 90? i mean truthfully thats a 60 year old design.if we all stand by and not say or do anything,in a few years we all will need to buy a 3d printer to go drag racing.not so crazy when u put this idea into real life perspective is it?
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772258
03/08/15 06:14 PM
03/08/15 06:14 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
|
And you can get an aluminum AMC block but no SB mopar, what the heck?
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dogdays]
#1772260
03/09/15 10:18 PM
03/09/15 10:18 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
A lot of it is Mopar guys don't go through parts like toilet paper. Our expectations have always been durability to the 9's..
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: 72Swinger]
#1772261
03/10/15 03:07 AM
03/10/15 03:07 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,238
Nevada
dezduster
pro stock
|
pro stock
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,238
Nevada
|
The problem as I see it. There are likely 2000 people looking into 1 of 3 types of chevy after market blocks a year. 1500 people wanting 1 of 3 types of ford blocks per year. AND WAIT FOR IT MAYBE 300 MOPAR folks wanting 1 of 5 types of blocks per year. PLUS they want the ceramic graphite impregnated unobtaniom impacted awesomeness option for a 100 dollars more than the 1500$ they are willing to pay for one of the five blocks. So 3 variations of each block and that's fifteen variations. Yes I saw the pole results I voted small block why because I have 6 440 long blocks,1 400 complete,000 spare 340 blocks and mine is at 4.100 bore. Could care less about gen II Hemi can barely afford to type it. But what I really wanted to vote for is a Gen III Hemi. BUT THE FACTORY Fn ENGINERS SCREWED THAT UP ALSO, HOW YOU SAY? 5.7&5.7mds 6.1 ?mds also? 6.4 ? mds dunno probly 6.2 FIVE FRICKING BLOCKS AGAIN? Ok maybe not. Or maybe including aluminum. Parts for GEN III are not coming at an LS pace or price. Expensive GEN III stuff equals me and many using old ancient less than race worthy parts as Hard core race parts. For the record you Mopar folks are who I would choose to be stuck with in an apocalypse. Why you do more with so little I am certain you could do anything with what is laying around at the moment. Good luck with the blocks
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dezduster]
#1772262
03/10/15 08:49 AM
03/10/15 08:49 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,229
In The Hills
jughed
pro stock
|
pro stock
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,229
In The Hills
|
Quote:
Quote:
josh king just posted that the world mopar blocks are back in production and that arrow racing engines is doing the machining.they should be available in the next couple months.thats good news ,but still doesnt address the need for good replacement b/rb and hemi blocks for the average joe racer.....
and the average joe racer is not going to see one because average joe racer is so cheap he squeaks when he walks.
I doubt you will ever see a B/RB/Hemi Mopar block at the same price level as chevy/ford. Sadly it's just not going to happen because it can't be done and make a profit in the amount of time required. Even when the [censored] claimed they could do it for $1500, almost everyone was salivating but guess what, never happened and it was more than likely tooling costs even going overseas ... it's easier to sell thousand or 2 sets of heads that look STOCK ... because that's what average joe racer wants ... for $899, but most guys won't pony up 1500 - 2k for a block when they can run a $400 stock block.
If there was money to be made Dart would have made them 15 yrs ago , when people actually had money ...
Exactly right. What company would risk losing money to cater to only a few non-cheapskate MoPar racers?? Why didn't aftermarket blocks sell like hotcakes while they were available before?? Because 95% of the old school MoPar racing crowd wants cheap factory blocks, and they're drying up. I consider myself lucky to own a Megablock, but if it ever cracks, gets windowed, or whatever else turns it into a boat anchor, that will be it for me.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dezduster]
#1772264
03/10/15 12:47 PM
03/10/15 12:47 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,290
fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,290
fredericksburg,va
|
Quote:
The problem as I see it. There are likely 2000 people looking into 1 of 3 types of chevy after market blocks a year. 1500 people wanting 1 of 3 types of ford blocks per year. AND WAIT FOR IT MAYBE 300 MOPAR folks wanting 1 of 5 types of blocks per year. PLUS they want the ceramic graphite impregnated unobtaniom impacted awesomeness option for a 100 dollars more than the 1500$ they are willing to pay for one of the five blocks. So 3 variations of each block and that's fifteen variations.
Yes I saw the pole results I voted small block why because I have 6 440 long blocks,1 400 complete,000 spare 340 blocks and mine is at 4.100 bore. Could care less about gen II Hemi can barely afford to type it. But what I really wanted to vote for is a Gen III Hemi. BUT THE FACTORY Fn ENGINERS SCREWED THAT UP ALSO, HOW YOU SAY?
5.7&5.7mds
6.1 ?mds also?
6.4 ? mds dunno probly
6.2
FIVE FRICKING BLOCKS AGAIN? Ok maybe not. Or maybe including aluminum. Parts for GEN III are not coming at an LS pace or price. Expensive GEN III stuff equals me and many using old ancient less than race worthy parts as Hard core race parts. For the record you Mopar folks are who I would choose to be stuck with in an apocalypse. Why you do more with so little I am certain you could do anything with what is laying around at the moment. Good luck with the blocks
I agree on the different GEN III blocks, pure stupid. 1!! 4.0 bore, then different stroke cranks if more cubes needed. I guess they want "the new and improved" idea to sell cars, then you could just go buy a crank then you got the same thing in your older car.
Make one block for the Hemi-wedge crowd 4.375 bore, interchangeable top stud
Make one block for the small block crowd 4.0 bore 4-bolt mains. This would be the only things on the table,eat it or go hungry!
Let Chrysler make the GEN III blocks and stuff.
Last edited by cudaman1969; 03/10/15 12:49 PM.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: B G Racing]
#1772266
03/10/15 04:03 PM
03/10/15 04:03 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
|
How come someone can make duplicates of whatever part they want and sell them at autozone. oreilleys, NAPA... seems they have no issue getting permission from mopar weather they say it is OEM or some new improved doo-dad  As far as the pole goes it seems on here there is a nearly direct/proportionatly, corelation of people wanting blocks to the number of parts in the for sale/wanted sections could some one just look at the for sale parts in all the mopar boards and deduce what would be the best selling block? This is an old-fashion board so naturaly the oldest desighn most antiquated engine is the one most people want 
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: A727Tflite]
#1772269
03/10/15 07:44 PM
03/10/15 07:44 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
no part number i do not believe would be an issue with most of us.as long as it is accepted by the majority of the classes which would utilize the block....
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: Adobedude]
#1772272
03/10/15 08:23 PM
03/10/15 08:23 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
at this point in the game all we are doing is lobbying,so all input to them is VALUABLE for both sides.we get noticed,and they see that theres a market need.it appears that word is growing and they are taking notice.where that goes from here is in richards hands.if dart drops the ball there are others.bill mitchell already makes a hemi block,which is now back in production according to josh king.maybe they can be convinced to expand their offerings.....
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: ademon]
#1772275
03/11/15 01:09 AM
03/11/15 01:09 AM
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 684
toronto
6PAK70CUDA
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 684
toronto
|
This thread is hilarious.
It is the equivalent of herding cats. Maybe the OP should have said "Big Blocks ONLY". I think if we really wanted another aftermarket block that is how it would have to go down. THAT is why there aren't any blocks. It has become just too fragmented in our camp for engine choices. I used to think that's what made MOPAR cool, the variety of it all. In cases like this, it's obviously a detriment.
Last edited by 6PAK70CUDA; 03/11/15 01:14 AM.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: 6PAK70CUDA]
#1772276
03/11/15 01:26 AM
03/11/15 01:26 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
|
Ford has waaaay more variety... FE/sideoiler, Windsor, Cleveland, boss, CJ/SCJ, 385, M, MEL, Romeo and Windsor versions of the SAME 4.6 engine just different enough to not interchange anything  cobra 4 valve, coyote... If you ran that same pole on other mopar websites you will get very different results. Like I said this is an old web site with old people stuck in their ways (if it was not in the 77 DC catalog it don't count) so the oldest engine wins even with terrible valve placement, terrible plug placement and a horrible rear main seal
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: 6PAK70CUDA]
#1772277
03/11/15 02:12 AM
03/11/15 02:12 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,290
fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,290
fredericksburg,va
|
Quote:
This thread is hilarious.
It is the equivalent of herding cats. Maybe the OP should have said "Big Blocks ONLY". I think if we really wanted another aftermarket block that is how it would have to go down. THAT is why there aren't any blocks. It has become just too fragmented in our camp for engine choices. I used to think that's what made MOPAR cool, the variety of it all. In cases like this, it's obviously a detriment.
Maybe they could make a new alluminum Dana 60
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: HotRodDave]
#1772278
03/11/15 09:04 AM
03/11/15 09:04 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
Quote:
How come someone can make duplicates of whatever part they want and sell them at autozone. oreilleys, NAPA... seems they have no issue getting permission from mopar weather they say it is OEM or some new improved doo-dad
As far as the pole goes it seems on here there is a nearly direct/proportionatly, corelation of people wanting blocks to the number of parts in the for sale/wanted sections could some one just look at the for sale parts in all the mopar boards and deduce what would be the best selling block? This is an old-fashion board so naturaly the oldest desighn most antiquated engine is the one most people want [/quot
My comments were based on if a mfg want to produce a block identical to Chryslers and under the Chrysler brand for the purist that wouldn't by an aftermarket brand.If you look at all the Autozone and other suppliers of parts you will see vast differences in the apperence compared to the ones specifically produces for and under the Mopar brand name.Also in cost.Price a aluminium water pump and housing with mopar logo and part number and then price a aftermarket one. 
With the cost of aftermarket aluminium or iron blocks we may as well buy KB,HPP or Indy and World if they become available.We don't see any other Mfg jumping in and slashing the price.We don't think anyone is anxious to produce a block that would only net them 50% of the existing market pricing.Just the cost of raw materials and labor will not allow that to happen.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772281
03/11/15 07:22 PM
03/11/15 07:22 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 6,906
IL, Aurora
ademon
master
|
master
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 6,906
IL, Aurora
|
Quote:
like the poll says,b/rb rules the roost,far more big block racers.no antiquated racers here,well,maybe a few,its just simple numbers not rocket science.at the next bracket race you attend count the big blocks and the small blocks and the hemis gen 2,3 and see the results.all great engines,but majority rules.look just how easy and cheap it is to make 500 or so hp with a big block even using stock type heads.the expense of the gen 3 conversion is way above that alone.nobody should truthfully be surprised unless they were living in a bomb shelter for the last 3 decades.... 
With 55 or so votes for the BB, and how long this post has been out there, I don't see anyone making anything. I'm guessing DART would want to see 5,500 votes for a new block to even probe further into the subject. It's obvious in this post that there isn't any money to be made.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: ademon]
#1772282
03/11/15 07:36 PM
03/11/15 07:36 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
|
Quote:
Quote:
like the poll says,b/rb rules the roost,far more big block racers.no antiquated racers here,well,maybe a few,its just simple numbers not rocket science.at the next bracket race you attend count the big blocks and the small blocks and the hemis gen 2,3 and see the results.all great engines,but majority rules.look just how easy and cheap it is to make 500 or so hp with a big block even using stock type heads.the expense of the gen 3 conversion is way above that alone.nobody should truthfully be surprised unless they were living in a bomb shelter for the last 3 decades....
With 55 or so votes for the BB, and how long this post has been out there, I don't see anyone making anything. I'm guessing DART would want to see 5,500 votes for a new block to even probe further into the subject. It's obvious in this post that there isn't any money to be made.
And I'm betting a couple of those guys voted two or more times. 
1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772283
03/11/15 08:27 PM
03/11/15 08:27 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,267
North, Alabama
D-50
pro stock
|
pro stock
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,267
North, Alabama
|
Quote:
like the poll says,b/rb rules the roost,far more big block racers.no antiquated racers here,well,maybe a few,its just simple numbers not rocket science.at the next bracket race you attend count the big blocks and the small blocks and the hemis gen 2,3 and see the results.all great engines,but majority rules.look just how easy and cheap it is to make 500 or so hp with a big block even using stock type heads.the expense of the gen 3 conversion is way above that alone.nobody should truthfully be surprised unless they were living in a bomb shelter for the last 3 decades....
Almost every time I go to the drag strip there is only small block mopars there. That is because I am the only person there that races a mopar.
1.33 60 ft,6.21 at 110.59 in the 1/8, pump gas small block,2950lbs,drag radials,mufflers and driven to track ...
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: D-50]
#1772285
03/11/15 10:27 PM
03/11/15 10:27 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
slammedR/T
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
|
Quote:
Almost every time I go to the drag strip there is only small block mopars there. That is because I am the only person there that races a mopar.
^^This for me also 
2000 Dakota R/T, 408 magnum, 727, Indy heads 1000cfm 4150 carb, 93 octane fuel. motor; 10.258 @ 132.78 200 shot; 9.262 @ 144.69 racemagnum
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: slammedR/T]
#1772286
03/11/15 10:43 PM
03/11/15 10:43 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
|
Very nice collection of both small blocks and big blocks at Pittsburgh raceway park but a lot of the big blocks are already upgraded to mega blocks, Indy, and keith blocks. The small blocks guys are stuck in the 9's and 10's with stock blocks
1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: justinp61]
#1772289
03/12/15 03:10 AM
03/12/15 03:10 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
Post this on MMF and LXForum and I bet the votes would at least triple. Won't be BB though, those have dumb stuff like distributors and plug wires.
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: 72Swinger]
#1772290
03/12/15 09:14 AM
03/12/15 09:14 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,528
Mansfield, Tx
Jacob Pitt
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,528
Mansfield, Tx
|
I've got four cars sitting in my shop right now. 2 big block RB cars, and 2 360 based cars. I would just like to see some quality parts being made for us for as many applications as we can get!
2013 NHRA D4 Stock Champ
#4 in the World IHRA Stock
2x IHRA Div.4 Stock Champ
14x Track Champ
All using a Ultimate Converter Concepts converter. Call Lenny today 704-892-6837
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: slammedR/T]
#1772291
03/12/15 11:00 AM
03/12/15 11:00 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,369
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,369
Marion, South Carolina [><]
|
Quote:
Quote:
Almost every time I go to the drag strip there is only small block mopars there. That is because I am the only person there that races a mopar.
^^This for me also
Nothing but hemis at my local track. Because I'm also the only old Mopar there. Occasionally there will be a few newer challengers/chargers.
CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: Eric]
#1772293
03/12/15 02:52 PM
03/12/15 02:52 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
|
What is tight about paying twice as much for EVERYTHING?
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: HotRodDave]
#1772294
03/12/15 03:13 PM
03/12/15 03:13 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
the mopar factory actually produced an aluminum smallblock for testing.herb mccandless had one,its now at the wellborn museum.you can google it.only problem was the few they produced refused to hold water...
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: Eric]
#1772295
03/12/15 03:22 PM
03/12/15 03:22 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
Quote:
Quote:
IMO we as Mopar guys are our own worst enemy. How many times have we read "it doesn't look like a (insert head)" so I won't buy it. How can we evolve like Ford and Chevy guys if we expect our parts to look like 60's engineered factory parts? Yes, Mopar guys are the tightest ($$$) of any enthusiast I've ever met. We have held on too long, it's time to move on.
X2
This is also a concern of the block manufactures we spoke to.We at BGR have been trying to find a source for reasonable production style blocks.We already have sources for aluminium aftermarket style blocks at Indy and others.When a iron production and iron aftermarket block nears or exceeds the price of an aluminium Indy block,it's time to move on.Having spoke with a manufacture recently,he said" quote"After reading what was posted on Moparts,hell these people can't agree on anything and all have their own opinions and agendas.Ask 100 people on the site to agree on a block style and ask each to invest $100,000 and we can start tommarrow.When the dust settles you see like a 100 ballless cows or what is called steers walking in line to the slaughter house heads hanging down,tails swinging and the mournful bellowing,"Mooooveeing along".
Please don't take offence to this post,we have been trying to support this effort now and before but we just had to share the comment both for the serious efforts and the humorous content as relayed.We have talked to others but there has been no promising results reflected back.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: B G Racing]
#1772296
03/12/15 03:34 PM
03/12/15 03:34 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 760
Canada
CTD5.9
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 760
Canada
|
Quote:
After reading what was posted on Moparts,hell these people can't agree on anything and all have their own opinions and agendas.
They should read every other post about building a big block over 500hp that says "it's cheaper to just start with an after market block then bandaid a stock one" everyone recommends it still even though nobody makes them. By the time I got my aluminum caps and studs in and everything machined up I was almost at the old world block price which I would of gladly ordered from my dealer for extra insurance.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: CTD5.9]
#1772297
03/12/15 03:47 PM
03/12/15 03:47 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
Quote:
Quote:
After reading what was posted on Moparts,hell these people can't agree on anything and all have their own opinions and agendas.
They should read every other post about building a big block over 500hp that says "it's cheaper to just start with an after market block then bandaid a stock one" everyone recommends it still even though nobody makes them. By the time I got my aluminum caps and studs in and everything machined up I was almost at the old world block price which I would of gladly ordered from my dealer for extra insurance.
We understand,but look at how many people use stock blocks and the latest "trick" parts".Recently we were at a near by machine shop and saw a lowdeck that was machined for.sleeves, a girdle,crossbolts and aluminium caps/studs.We were informed the owner passed up a used aluminium Indy Maxx block for about $800 cheaper than the "choise 1971 block" and parts and machine work cost.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772299
03/12/15 04:09 PM
03/12/15 04:09 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
After reading what was posted on Moparts,hell these people can't agree on anything and all have their own opinions and agendas.
They should read every other post about building a big block over 500hp that says "it's cheaper to just start with an after market block then bandaid a stock one" everyone recommends it still even though nobody makes them. By the time I got my aluminum caps and studs in and everything machined up I was almost at the old world block price which I would of gladly ordered from my dealer for extra insurance.
We understand,but look at how many people use stock blocks and the latest "trick" parts".Recently we were at a near by machine shop and saw a lowdeck that was machined for.sleeves, a girdle,crossbolts and aluminium caps/studs.We were informed the owner passed up a used aluminium Indy Maxx block for about $800 cheaper than the "choise 1971 block" and parts and machine work cost.
Some people are just plain CRAZY. Or dumb.
OR it goes back to the mentality of... it doesnt look
like a stock mopar
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1772300
03/12/15 04:23 PM
03/12/15 04:23 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 760
Canada
CTD5.9
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 760
Canada
|
Quote:
OR it goes back to the mentality of... it doesnt look
like a stock mopar
maybe I am blind but the indy aluminums don't even look that out of line. Grind the name off the front of the block and have your machinist put in some brass freeze plugs since people like paying them lots, hemi orange paint and call it a day.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: CTD5.9]
#1772301
03/12/15 05:32 PM
03/12/15 05:32 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
justinp61
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
|
Quote:
Quote:
OR it goes back to the mentality of... it doesnt look
like a stock mopar
maybe I am blind but the indy aluminums don't even look that out of line. Grind the name off the front of the block and have your machinist put in some brass freeze plugs since people like paying them lots, hemi orange paint and call it a day.
I'm going to have "Indy" milled of my 360-1 heads, and they will be painted orange too.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: justinp61]
#1772302
03/12/15 11:34 PM
03/12/15 11:34 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
thats the point in a nutshell,way too many wishfull thinkers to convince anybody into a major investment to produce blocks.like bob said the b/rb platform would be the best way to start simply because it is the most needed.i started this post to be helpfull to the manufacturer in seeing the real time actual need.but it blossomed into an expresssion of everybodys needs.and thats ok too. as far as a block goes,the b/rb has never been reproduced or a replacement version offered period.and there are far more versions of almost everything else or have been at one time.i will still do everything i can to keep lobbying possible manufacturers until the day i take a dirt nap.the more of us that follow suit the better.they may have made millions but like us old farts they drop like flys....
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772303
03/13/15 01:21 AM
03/13/15 01:21 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,464
Sydney,Australia
tex013
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,464
Sydney,Australia
|
dakotawilly,
I think you are doing the right thing but maybe instead of asking maybe you should just say this is needed .
Try doing a motor down here if you don't have a block,most are asking $1200 plus for a 440RB block.
I would be happy with a return of the World/Megablock type replacement - but at a somewhat comparable price to a BB Chev.Maybe just not quite as heavy as the last lot were .
As said - too many choices will mean nothing will get done.
Tex
New best ET 10.259@129.65 .
New best MPH 130.32
Finally fitted a solid cam,
stepped it up a bit more
3690lbs through the mufflers
New World block 3780lbs 10.278@130.80 . Wowser 10.253@130.24 footbraking from 1500rpm
Power by Tex's Automotive
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: CTD5.9]
#1772305
03/13/15 01:22 PM
03/13/15 01:22 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
josh king posted that world blocks are back in production and arrow racing engines will be doing the machining and that they will be available again in a few months.not cheap im sure of,as far as lobbying for blocks,i do what i can as an ordinary little guy to help the sport.many engine shops and "more respected" people are,and have been doing the same.maybe the right door hasnt been knocked on yet,and many have "bloody knuckles" from trying.it really need to be a full on group effort to get this done,and thats all there is to it.as an industrial electrician i have worked in many casting foundries myself.honestly,if i had the financial means,i would do it myself.i know there is a market and a profit potential there......
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1772306
03/13/15 01:59 PM
03/13/15 01:59 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
camastomcat
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
|
Quote:
josh king posted that world blocks are back in production and arrow racing engines will be doing the machining and that they will be available again in a few months.not cheap im sure of,as far as lobbying for blocks,i do what i can as an ordinary little guy to help the sport.many engine shops and "more respected" people are,and have been doing the same.maybe the right door hasnt been knocked on yet,and many have "bloody knuckles" from trying.it really need to be a full on group effort to get this done,and thats all there is to it.as an industrial electrician i have worked in many casting foundries myself.honestly,if i had the financial means,i would do it myself.i know there is a market and a profit potential there......
I'm glad someone (you) is trying. I'm at the point where I can't afford to go any faster with Mopar stuff, but will always have one B1/MC or something. I wonder if there are any plans for the raised cam option. I guess it doesn't matter, I'll just buy aluminum, if not.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: CTD5.9]
#1772307
03/13/15 03:49 PM
03/13/15 03:49 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
Quote:
Quote:
OR it goes back to the mentality of... it doesnt look
like a stock mopar
maybe I am blind but the indy aluminums don't even look that out of line. Grind the name off the front of the block and have your machinist put in some brass freeze plugs since people like paying them lots, hemi orange paint and call it a day.
Indy Maxx has no fuel pump mounting provisions and has external oil port at the oil pump housing as well as rounded hump casting at the distributer mounting area.Don't forget the screw in core plugs.We have many customers refuse to buy the block for these reasons. 
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: B G Racing]
#1772308
03/13/15 04:15 PM
03/13/15 04:15 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 760
Canada
CTD5.9
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 760
Canada
|
Quote:
Indy Maxx has no fuel pump mounting provisions and has external oil port at the oil pump housing as well as rounded hump casting at the distributer mounting area.Don't forget the screw in core plugs.We have many customers refuse to buy the block for these reasons.
My hat is off to everyone like yourself doing this kind of work. Those excuses make me have a nervous twitch and make me want to call the person dumb without ever meeting them.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: B G Racing]
#1772310
03/13/15 07:17 PM
03/13/15 07:17 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
OR it goes back to the mentality of... it doesnt look
like a stock mopar
maybe I am blind but the indy aluminums don't even look that out of line. Grind the name off the front of the block and have your machinist put in some brass freeze plugs since people like paying them lots, hemi orange paint and call it a day.
Indy Maxx has no fuel pump mounting provisions and has external oil port at the oil pump housing as well as rounded hump casting at the distributer mounting area.Don't forget the screw in core plugs.We have many customers refuse to buy the block for these reasons.
Bob.. that really doesnt surprise me... some of the
Mopar crowd seem WEIRD to me.. sure I can understand
the FAST guys not wanting it.. but that would be it
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: B G Racing]
#1772311
03/13/15 09:05 PM
03/13/15 09:05 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
WO23Coronet
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
OR it goes back to the mentality of... it doesnt look
like a stock mopar
maybe I am blind but the indy aluminums don't even look that out of line. Grind the name off the front of the block and have your machinist put in some brass freeze plugs since people like paying them lots, hemi orange paint and call it a day.
Indy Maxx has no fuel pump mounting provisions and has external oil port at the oil pump housing as well as rounded hump casting at the distributer mounting area.Don't forget the screw in core plugs.We have many customers refuse to buy the block for these reasons.
That's pretty ridiculous, if you're at the point of needing a block like an Indy Maxx stock appearing shouldn't be in the equation. What the FAST guys are doing is really cool and I get it, and I could see them wanting/needing a stock look but that's about it
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: WO23Coronet]
#1772312
03/13/15 09:49 PM
03/13/15 09:49 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
DaveRS23
Special needs idiot
|
Special needs idiot
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
|
I tried to make this point in an earlier post. We are just too fractured up to have any real shot at enough volume to support the development and production of anything. Which is a big part of why we haven't had any consistent block production up to this point.
And the new Gen 3 stuff just splits the pie further. Sure, the new Hemi stuff is bringing some new guys to the party. But not in enough numbers to justify new blocks I suspect. And it does pull some support from previous offerings.
If most of us ran small blocks or ran big blocks/Gen 2 Hemis or ran Gen 3 Hemis we still would still have the divide between race blocks that look different vs stock appearing blocks. By and large, the street guys are a different market than the racers. Heck, there were guys that complained about the weight of the World BB/Hemi blocks. (I was one of them)
Even if there is enough of a letter campaign to get a new batch of blocks into production, there has to be enough sales to make it a success. If not, everyone will know it and there will never be anyone to take the gamble on us again.
As always, we just need more Mopar guys.
Master, again and still
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: DaveRS23]
#1772314
03/13/15 10:09 PM
03/13/15 10:09 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
slammedR/T
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
|
Quote:
I tried to make this point in an earlier post. We are just too fractured up to have any real shot at enough volume to support the development and production of anything. Which is a big part of why we haven't had any consistent block production up to this point.
And the new Gen 3 stuff just splits the pie further. Sure, the new Hemi stuff is bringing some new guys to the party. But not in enough numbers to justify new blocks I suspect. And it does pull some support from previous offerings.
If most of us ran small blocks or ran big blocks/Gen 2 Hemis or ran Gen 3 Hemis we still would still have the divide between race blocks that look different vs stock appearing blocks. By and large, the street guys are a different market than the racers. Heck, there were guys that complained about the weight of the World BB/Hemi blocks. (I was one of them)
Even if there is enough of a letter campaign to get a new batch of blocks into production, there has to be enough sales to make it a success. If not, everyone will know it and there will never be anyone to take the gamble on us again.
As always, we just need more Mopar guys.
I would like to see some serious big block mopars but also some serious heads to go with it. Why have a block good to 3000+ hp but have a head that is still conventional big block mopar valve placement!
2000 Dakota R/T, 408 magnum, 727, Indy heads 1000cfm 4150 carb, 93 octane fuel. motor; 10.258 @ 132.78 200 shot; 9.262 @ 144.69 racemagnum
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: slammedR/T]
#1772315
03/13/15 10:42 PM
03/13/15 10:42 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
justinp61
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
|
Quote:
Why have a block good to 3000+ hp but have a head that is still conventional big block mopar valve placement!
Because too many guys won't buy it if it doesn't look like a 906 or it has symmetrical intake and exhaust ports. As a whole we are dinosaurs.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: justinp61]
#1772316
03/13/15 11:05 PM
03/13/15 11:05 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
slammedR/T
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 733
jacksonville,FLORIDA
|
Quote:
Quote:
Why have a block good to 3000+ hp but have a head that is still conventional big block mopar valve placement!
Because too many guys won't buy it if it doesn't look like a 906 or it has symmetrical intake and exhaust ports. As a whole we are dinosaurs.
I know, Mopar guys are wierd, and don't even get me started on turbo dodge guys 
I went small block because it is what i played with, what I had, and the small blocks handle same power as the big blocks with out all the expensive "tricks" to make them live.
2000 Dakota R/T, 408 magnum, 727, Indy heads 1000cfm 4150 carb, 93 octane fuel. motor; 10.258 @ 132.78 200 shot; 9.262 @ 144.69 racemagnum
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: DaveRS23]
#1772318
03/14/15 03:20 AM
03/14/15 03:20 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,218
Someplace you aren't
SomeCarGuy
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,218
Someplace you aren't
|
Quote:
I tried to make this point in an earlier post. We are just too fractured up to have any real shot at enough volume to support the development and production of anything. Which is a big part of why we haven't had any consistent block production up to this point.
And the new Gen 3 stuff just splits the pie further. Sure, the new Hemi stuff is bringing some new guys to the party. But not in enough numbers to justify new blocks I suspect. And it does pull some support from previous offerings.
If most of us ran small blocks or ran big blocks/Gen 2 Hemis or ran Gen 3 Hemis we still would still have the divide between race blocks that look different vs stock appearing blocks. By and large, the street guys are a different market than the racers. Heck, there were guys that complained about the weight of the World BB/Hemi blocks. (I was one of them)
Even if there is enough of a letter campaign to get a new batch of blocks into production, there has to be enough sales to make it a success. If not, everyone will know it and there will never be anyone to take the gamble on us again.
As always, we just need more Mopar guys.
I agree with all you said there. The last line has troubled me for a long time. We have few in our ranks, but damn our cars generate some big bucks. Its like we have 5000 guys who each have 6 cars and are willing to buy junkers for 8k all day long. That puts a crimp on the funds to buy parts like aftermarket blocks. Non-car people say things like "oh that is a good cheap way to have fun. You can still get those old Dodges for 200 bucks, right?" Its like nobody has a concept that an old dodge is worth more than well an old dodge.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772321
03/14/15 08:11 PM
03/14/15 08:11 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
wow,was not aware of that,have not spoke with him in many moons,i know he was aggrevated with the block and head situation also a while back.i still believe a good replacement block that addresses all the issues we face with nothing exotic could easily be priced affordably.maybe not as cheap as a cheby block,but well under what is available now....
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772323
03/15/15 04:16 PM
03/15/15 04:16 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 81
Sweden
MikeN
member
|
member
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 81
Sweden
|
It was earlier said that the World RB type block would find most buyers. If production resumes I would ask the maker to consider two things:
1. The use of the factory type hydraulic roller lifter while keeping the existing oil system. Todays engine oil isn´t designed for flat tappet cams.
2. Use of the small block bellhousing bolt pattern. Most buyers want to use the overdrive auto transmission without the complexity of an adapter.
Last edited by MikeN; 03/15/15 04:19 PM.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: MikeN]
#1772324
03/15/15 04:23 PM
03/15/15 04:23 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,486
SoCal
Brian Hafliger
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,486
SoCal
|
Nobody including World is casting blocks right now...Fiat is not at all concerned with aftermarket support...I wonder if they started getting phone calls, letters, and emails if someone over there would even notice?
Brian Hafliger
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: Twostick]
#1772326
03/15/15 08:12 PM
03/15/15 08:12 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
the problem with lobbying the factory is getting the letters,e-mails or whatever to the right desk,been that route already also,and its a huge corporation with endless paper trails.inside information would be the best,as in exactly who has the horsepower to start the process.the factory generic customer support is useless.mopar performance does not have any real help desk so to speak of and trying to get dept information is highly impossible without insider knowledge.that kind of information is generally not available to the public and no access is available to the company executive directory.if anybody knows who runs the program post that information so that another e-mail attack campaign can begin.any body that can rattle some cages in the right places would be positive....on a side note,all this block talk seems to have brought used blocks out of the woodwork lately for sale.all at a bend over price.i guess the new motto is "grandma needs a new wheel chair,lets charge her double"......... 
Last edited by dakotawilly; 03/15/15 11:58 PM.
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: SomeCarGuy]
#1772328
03/16/15 09:24 PM
03/16/15 09:24 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 764
NW Pa.
KD800X
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 764
NW Pa.
|
Quote:
David Hakim used to post here and he worked for MP. maybe the best bet for any company would be to attempt to buy the tooling from Fiat. FCA might not care and certainly this isn't in their main scope. A foundry might be able to service a niche market profitably. A lot of the problem with MP seems to just be a lack of focus and that has hurt their image with the core customer. The megablocks were the one item people were willing to source from them, but they never have made a consistent effort to get them in the streets.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: KD800X]
#1772329
03/16/15 09:45 PM
03/16/15 09:45 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
|
This is the guy running it now, full blooded Italian. I get the feeling he would like to see more "body kits" on new Darts than a Race block that you would have to be on a creeper under the car to see what "brand" it is. http://media.chrysler.com/newsrelease.do...795&mid=361
Last edited by 72Swinger; 03/16/15 09:45 PM.
Mopar to the bone!!!
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1772333
03/29/15 10:42 PM
03/29/15 10:42 PM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Quote:
Quote:
even hemphill doesnt run a mopar motor anymore,and he builds mopars !!!
Tom H. gave up racing several years ago. Still has the car but he's on a LONG break and helping others.
I have a view from the other side to throw in this conversation
I have built and race Mopars only for 25 years or more--I came home from the hospital in a 50 Plymouth and I LOVE me some Mopars but...
I recently started racing and playing with a front engine dragster nostalgia car that happens to sport a 350 sbc I built the engine that is in the car from Craigslist parts, some nice new rockers and valve springs etc--a new set of rods and some nice machine work --I bet I don't have $2000 in it less the stack fuel injection Hilborn unit which I did buy at the flea market with a fuel pump for a mere $600! It is running mid five second range and I have to say....I can stop on the way home from work for milk and they have dome pistons for it on the shelf! It is easy as can be to score quality parts.
Now...I am serious about building some real power and started shopping for real race parts and it is an EYE OPENER--My local warehouse has 6 different blocks in stock--dozens of rod choices and cranks, etc It is always in stock.
The crazy amount of quality used parts is simply stunning!
It is refreshing and has made building a good race piece reasonable $$$
We as Mopar Guys have been paying a "Mopar Tax" on everything we have ever bought--- and even though we now enjoy more parts than ever in the aftermarket--we are light years behind on heads alone--
I run my cars for the love of speed and competition--not because I support some brand that has never cared about little ole me.
A good look from the other bench can be an eye opener and good learning experience.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: OUTLAW MOPAR]
#1772334
03/29/15 10:53 PM
03/29/15 10:53 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
justinp61
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
|
Quote:
Well as far as i have reserched a company called motor castings actually cast the R3 blocks. And if you google them the pics on thier site have some bbc blocks that have dart cast onto them. And if you look at a little M chivvy block it has thier foundry mark on it just like the R3. So that tells me Motor castings casts dart stuff. So why not try to let dart buy those castings and bring the R3 back. Under a new name of course. 
A new R block would be great but I'd rather have a 4.25" bore Gen III block.
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: ]
#1772335
03/29/15 11:25 PM
03/29/15 11:25 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
even hemphill doesnt run a mopar motor anymore,and he builds mopars !!!
Tom H. gave up racing several years ago. Still has the car but he's on a LONG break and helping others.
I have a view from the other side to throw in this conversation
I have built and race Mopars only for 25 years or more--I came home from the hospital in a 50 Plymouth and I LOVE me some Mopars but...
I recently started racing and playing with a front engine dragster nostalgia car that happens to sport a 350 sbc I built the engine that is in the car from Craigslist parts, some nice new rockers and valve springs etc--a new set of rods and some nice machine work --I bet I don't have $2000 in it less the stack fuel injection Hilborn unit which I did buy at the flea market with a fuel pump for a mere $600! It is running mid five second range and I have to say....I can stop on the way home from work for milk and they have dome pistons for it on the shelf! It is easy as can be to score quality parts.
Now...I am serious about building some real power and started shopping for real race parts and it is an EYE OPENER--My local warehouse has 6 different blocks in stock--dozens of rod choices and cranks, etc It is always in stock.
The crazy amount of quality used parts is simply stunning!
It is refreshing and has made building a good race piece reasonable $$$
We as Mopar Guys have been paying a "Mopar Tax" on everything we have ever bought--- and even though we now enjoy more parts than ever in the aftermarket--we are light years behind on heads alone--
I run my cars for the love of speed and competition--not because I support some brand that has never cared about little ole me.
A good look from the other bench can be an eye opener and good learning experience.
.............thats the exact truth,you can source and build a bowtie from used parts for next to nothing.but,as we get more and more parts,the prices will go down when the market is full on used stuff.except blocks.somehow,somewhere,someday it will happen.a factory will be squirting out mopar blocks,especially for all the new heads falling from trees.........i am still emailing and talking to anybody i can about getting this done...
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: OUTLAW MOPAR]
#1772337
04/02/15 09:11 PM
04/02/15 09:11 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
OP
mopar
|
OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
|
motor castings would surely do it,its a state of the art facility.only problem is they cast for others.they are only a manufacturer and the financial part and retail end of it would fall to somebody else.my checking account balance does not have quite enough zeros at the end.if it did i would be at their door tomorrow morning.maybe we can crowd fund a block project...
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
|
|
|
Re: NEW DART MOPAR BLOCKS !!!!!
[Re: dakotawilly]
#1804843
04/16/15 11:30 AM
04/16/15 11:30 AM
|
crabman173
Unregistered
|
crabman173
Unregistered
|
Last edited by crabman173; 04/16/15 01:13 PM.
|
|
|
Re: MOPAR BLOCKS
[Re: SomeCarGuy]
#1892272
08/15/15 07:37 AM
08/15/15 07:37 AM
|
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 3
Melbourne
rain man
member
|
member
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 3
Melbourne
|
David Hakim used to post here and he worked for MP. maybe the best bet for any company would be to attempt to buy the tooling from Fiat. FCA might not care and certainly this isn't in their main scope. A foundry might be able to service a niche market profitably. Seems Fiat dont seem to want to know (or worse, they dont want the blocks around) There are mega blocks out there, kolenos, and even the thicker mains early 70's 400's also, perhaps they need to be used as a starting point in getting any B/RB happening. And even though the SBM is a good platform in theory (bore space, cam height etc better than SBC) The greater demand seems to be for B/RB, and something along the lines of what world/MP and Koleno were doing... iron, reasonable price, siamesed, 4 bolt, and the majority of applications would see it wanting to hold under 1500 HP without it breaking. It would probably have to be out of china to be viable. Thats my 2c. I have absolutely no experience in foundry stuff so wouldnt know where to start myself, i know there are people out there who'd be decades ahead of a newbie with knowledge of whats involved. Ive read something from a certain SOURCE who said why the 440 sauce blocks never happened, the upfront order and hence investment that was requested from the USA based foundry was in the millions, with alot of blocks needed to be ordered and paid for up front. Most people, just about all really, wouldnt want or need to take that chance. Perhaps it might not be like that out of china regarding initial investment and order quantities, and tech is improving re. scanning pre-existing blocks, its not like much needs to be designed from scratch if a mega block is profiled for example. Anyway ive stumbled across these pages in my travels, one seems to be the dart knock offs which are speedmaster / procomp. 1.We are a professional factory that produce many kinds of cylinder blocks,such as Ford 351 blocks,chevy 350 blocks, V8 6.5L blocks and so on. 4. Material: Casting iron; the brinell hardness :HB170-220   We would like to hear from you. Please feel free to get in touch with us by using the address, phone, fax,and email contacts we've provided as below. http://www.weiku.com/products/15384845/350_Chevy_casting_iron_small_block.html
Last edited by rain man; 08/15/15 07:40 AM.
|
|
|
|
|
