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Borked another 904 tail
#148196
11/10/08 12:00 PM
11/10/08 12:00 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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Yesterday I had another 904 tail housing crack. It did it on Memorial day and I simply swapped the housing hoping it was a fluke. Guess it wasn't.
I plan to have the alum shaft checked for balance but I also want to check slip yoke engagement. What is the ideal distance from the end of the tail to shoulder of the slip yoke?? Could the slip yoke not be inserted enough cause my problem??
Anything else I should be looking into. The engine is on stock rubber biscuit mounts that aren't torn and has a stock rubber tranny mount.
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CJK440]
#148200
11/10/08 09:56 PM
11/10/08 09:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
DaveRS23
Special needs idiot
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Special needs idiot
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,153
Benton, IL.
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The last tail shaft I broke was due to excessive run-out on the tranny output shaft. Broke 2 tail shafts and could not figure out why, until I checked the tranny's output shaft with a dial indicator. Changed the output shaft and no more problems. To this day I don't know how the shaft got bent.
Master, again and still
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CJK440]
#148201
11/10/08 10:01 PM
11/10/08 10:01 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,715
closer to Canadian beer!
torkrules
I'm neurotic
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I'm neurotic
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,715
closer to Canadian beer!
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Quote:
Yesterday I had another 904 tail housing crack. It did it on Memorial day and I simply swapped the housing hoping it was a fluke. Guess it wasn't.
I plan to have the alum shaft checked for balance but I also want to check slip yoke engagement. What is the ideal distance from the end of the tail to shoulder of the slip yoke?? Could the slip yoke not be inserted enough cause my problem??
Anything else I should be looking into. The engine is on stock rubber biscuit mounts that aren't torn and has a stock rubber tranny mount.
Couple of causes:
Output shaft bend
drive shaft bent
drive shaft out of balance
U joint not located properly, incorrectly installed, or moving withing the yoke.
excessive front u joint angle.
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: turner]
#148203
11/11/08 08:42 AM
11/11/08 08:42 AM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 722
Hampstead, MD.
Troublemaker427
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 722
Hampstead, MD.
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I broke several C4 tailhousings years ago because of a bent pinion. It doesn't take much!!!
Jody Aberts
1966 Fairlane 427
Troublemaker2
AA/NSS
1964 Galaxie 500XL
390-4spd.
1966 F-100
390-C6
1967 Plymouth VIP
383-TF
2003 Roadking
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: Troublemaker427]
#148204
11/11/08 05:07 PM
11/11/08 05:07 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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Suspension is all stock with repop 340 springs. I am running the factory snubber. With the stock springs there is not enough room for an adjustable snubber and the way the car squats on launch I am not sure the pinion can rotate up much.
My housing broke thru the speedo hole, forward of the tranny mount, not like the pic above.
The tranny is coming out over the winter to get freshened up so I'll get the mainshaft out and indicate it.
I'll check the D-shaft too.
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CJK440]
#148205
11/11/08 05:08 PM
11/11/08 05:08 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,544
Syracuse,NY
CompWedgeEngines
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,544
Syracuse,NY
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What are you using for engine and tranny mounts?
RIP Monte Smith
Your work is a reflection of yourself, autograph it with quality.
WD for Diamond Pistons,Sidewinder cylinder heads, Wiseco, K1 rods and cranks,BAM lifters, Morel lifters, Molnar Technologies, Harland Sharp, Pro Gear, Cometic, King Engine Bearings and many others.
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CompWedgeEngines]
#148206
11/11/08 05:53 PM
11/11/08 05:53 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 189
Newark, OH
springers340dart
member
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member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 189
Newark, OH
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i had this problem but with the 727 2 years ago, brand new driveshaft and it was just .018 out of balance. broke in the same place as yours turner
Last edited by springers340dart; 11/11/08 05:55 PM.
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CompWedgeEngines]
#148207
11/11/08 06:23 PM
11/11/08 06:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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Stock rubber biscuit mounts in the front and stock rubber rear.
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CJK440]
#148210
11/12/08 09:51 AM
11/12/08 09:51 AM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,442
LOWELL IN
QWK_ENUF
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,442
LOWELL IN
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put a truck housing on as they are stronger
WAXER
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: QWK_ENUF]
#148211
11/12/08 10:42 AM
11/12/08 10:42 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,043
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,043
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
put a truck housing on as they are stronger
is there such a thing for a 904 ?
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: QWK_ENUF]
#148214
11/12/08 01:34 PM
11/12/08 01:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
put a truck housing on as they are stronger
is there such a thing for a 904 ?
Good question, if there is then I never knew about it. 
sorry , got 727 on the brain
That's ok, you are forgiven. 
Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: Quicktree]
#148218
11/13/08 10:42 AM
11/13/08 10:42 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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I checked the pinion angle relative to the tranny mainshaft centerline when I first broke it.
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CJK440]
#148219
11/16/08 03:10 PM
11/16/08 03:10 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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Hmm, this looks less than ideal. Jackstands under rear axle.
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: 5126brl No more]
#148221
11/16/08 04:25 PM
11/16/08 04:25 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
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I wouldn't want the shaft any shorter than that, mine the boot is about a 1/4 inch away from the very beginning of the radius, from the point you are showing how far will the yoke slip into the housing till it bottom's out?
Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: dartman366]
#148222
11/23/08 11:30 AM
11/23/08 11:30 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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Got a chance to play in the garage today. Unbolted the shaft and drove it all the way in. Looks like I am 1.5" from bottomed out. 
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CJK440]
#148223
11/24/08 09:51 AM
11/24/08 09:51 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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The shaft is definately going in to check balance, think I should lengthen it .5-.75" while I'm there?
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: JohnRR]
#148225
11/24/08 10:06 AM
11/24/08 10:06 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,179
Atco NJ
DJVCuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,179
Atco NJ
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Quote:
it looks to me like it is sticking out too far though
I agree
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CJK440]
#148228
11/24/08 11:41 AM
11/24/08 11:41 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,179
Atco NJ
DJVCuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,179
Atco NJ
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Quote:
Quote:
how will they LENGTHEN it ???
it looks to me like it is sticking out too far though
I think they talk dirty to it.
I figure they would cut the ends off and weld them to an new tube?? Perhaps its better to just make a new one....
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: CJK440]
#148229
11/24/08 12:18 PM
11/24/08 12:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,043
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,043
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
Quote:
how will they LENGTHEN it ???
it looks to me like it is sticking out too far though
I think they talk dirty to it.
I figure they would cut the ends off and weld them to an new tube?? Perhaps its better to just make a new one....
Not very impressive if it will only GROW a 1/2 "
as long as the yokes are good they can just put them on a new tube
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: JohnRR]
#148230
03/23/09 02:06 PM
03/23/09 02:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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Let me wake this thread from the dead now that I got the rebuilt tranny/engine back in the car.
First off, the 2" measurement above is actually a little bit more. Maybe 2-1/8th. Its 2" when it was broken and must have had a gap.
Secondly, I verified the output shaft is straight on v blocks.
Third, I did find a truck tail and its very beefy but I still think I have a bad situation going on.
One thing that was really eating at me was why did I make a shaft that short?? I'm not that dumb, I wouldn't have ordered it like that. And why did it end up to be the OE length for my application but still be that far out??
One thing popped in my head. When I first ordered it I had an A body A833 in the car and now it has a 904. While the OAL of a 4 speed and a 904 is practically the same, I did have to buy a new slip yoke for the smaller 904 output.
Perhaps the aftermarket yoke is different than others???
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: Dodgem]
#148232
03/26/09 07:52 PM
03/26/09 07:52 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
Probably too late
In a drag car there is no way I would go to that
diamention, thats basically going 1.6" out, that
number is based on a production car that was ment
to have a ton of travel.... 3/4" - 1" is fine
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#148233
03/26/09 08:05 PM
03/26/09 08:05 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
CJK440
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,982
Ansonia, CT
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New shaft on its way. Should yeild 3/4-1" of pullout when all set.
I guess the stackup of differences of the 904 vs A833 coupled with the change in 29 to 26 spline yokes, plus swapping a stock mopar 7260 pinion yoke for a 1330 spicer yoke just didn't work in my favor.
2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: turner]
#148235
03/26/09 08:47 PM
03/26/09 08:47 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,394
Quicktree
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,394
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Quote:
Mine was due to an incorrect pinion angle
there you have it 
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: Quicktree]
#148236
03/27/09 12:51 PM
03/27/09 12:51 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 293
Kansas City Metro
mbogina
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 293
Kansas City Metro
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Another possible scenerio: IF the C-C dimensions for the shaft were stock length, and IF the replacement yoke was the same dimensions, and IF the Engine/Trans is in the stock location, then basically you only have 2 possible culprits for the shaft to be too short. The first would be the "stacking" of factory tolerances, the second would be that the rearend housing is not in stock location- perhaps the locating pin in the leaf springs has sheared. In the "olden days", we often redrilled the front spring hanger to shorten the wheelbase slightly, and flipped the front brackets upside down to lower the rear of the car and move the instant center up.
Be a Rebel- Break the Laws of Physics!
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Re: Borked another 904 tail
[Re: mbogina]
#148237
03/27/09 07:37 PM
03/27/09 07:37 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
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Also if the body is bent even slightly it will change the length between the trans and diff. If it is bowed down like a smiley face the way it would be inclined to do after sitting on the wheels for almost 40 years then it would need a longer driveshaft.
Production tollerances could stack up quite a bit, think about the perches could be a hair off the body seams could be a hair off.
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
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