Quote:

---

Check that the ball end on the pushrod and the lifter/rocker adjuster to make sure the radius matches and also check that the adjuster hasn't pushed the threads in the rocker.

---

Will take a good look at those items tomorrow.

Quote:

---

last time i had a loose rocker like that the cam lobe went flat

---

Quote:

---

Do you run rollers?

---

Quote:

---

Can't believe it ran as well as it did. As mentioned before, you're going to
Pick up substantial gains.

---

I really doubt it will pick up much at all... JMO

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Can't believe it ran as well as it did. As mentioned before, you're going to
Pick up substantial gains.

---

I really doubt it will pick up much at all... JMO

---

I agree,,if it picks up at all it will be negligable.

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Can't believe it ran as well as it did. As mentioned before, you're going to
Pick up substantial gains.

---

I really doubt it will pick up much at all... JMO

---

I agree,,if it picks up at all it will be negligable.

---

How could it NOT pick up when these issues are corrected???

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Can't believe it ran as well as it did. As mentioned before, you're going to
Pick up substantial gains.

---

I really doubt it will pick up much at all... JMO

---

I agree,,if it picks up at all it will be negligable.

---

How could it NOT pick up when these issues are corrected???

---

If he were to just correct the problem it wouldnt
change much at all... I've been there... but he is
regrinding the cam so we wont know for sure

Quote:

---

my dad(73yrs old)at the time, had a j headed headed 340 built,the @%#$ who built it,did dyno it and gave my pop 2 dyno sheets 1st was 459 2nd was 22hp less..i was pissed,he did it with us not there we live 2 miles away..put motor in the car heard some knocking under the stock valve covers and found pushrod tip broke and the cup on the rocker... there was the 20 or so hp! dont know why he the builder was never curiouse to know where the power went..well the guy who did it is close to workin for advanced auto parts now...shame his dad was a great machinist and builder.

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Can't believe it ran as well as it did. As mentioned before, you're going to
Pick up substantial gains.

---

I really doubt it will pick up much at all... JMO

---

I agree,,if it picks up at all it will be negligable.

---

How could it NOT pick up when these issues are corrected???

---

If he were to just correct the problem it wouldnt
change much at all... I've been there... but he is
regrinding the cam so we wont know for sure

---

if the heads are a restriction then no amount of more valve lift is going to make a profound improvement, my present heads are just that, I installed a cam with more lift and duration and didn't pick up anything, so I went back to the origional grind.

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Can't believe it ran as well as it did. As mentioned before, you're going to
Pick up substantial gains.

---

I really doubt it will pick up much at all... JMO

---

I agree,,if it picks up at all it will be negligable.

---

How could it NOT pick up when these issues are corrected???

---

If he were to just correct the problem it wouldnt
change much at all... I've been there... but he is
regrinding the cam so we wont know for sure

---

if the heads are a restriction then no amount of more valve lift is going to make a profound improvement, my present heads are just that, I installed a cam with more lift and duration and didn't pick up anything, so I went back to the origional grind.

---

Quote:

---

Found three rockers with so much lash that I am surprised I didn't loose the push rods or lash caps. I stopped with the feeler gauges when I was around .085" so they were real loose. I knew something was wrong when I pulled the intake and found three ports dark when the other five were clean. All three were intake rockers on those "dark" cylinders. I was well past the point where I should have run the valves, but this was a surprise since there was nothing to indicate anything was wrong. No noise, misfire, popping....nothing. I will be replacing the lifters anyway, but what else could have suffered? Can't believe this just went a mid 5.8 in this condition.

---

Quote:

---

"Usually" anything on to intake side will hurt the performance more than it will on the exhaust side. A friend of mine bent 8 exhaust pushrods in a stocker on a run a few years ago and the car still made a good pass. He loaded up took the car home to get and early start on repairs. He was so excited to see what it would run after the repairs. Well guess what, it ran almost the same. The only thing that baffles me is how someone didn't hear Brian's and say something. That had to be clicking pretty loud.

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Found three rockers with so much lash that I am surprised I didn't loose the push rods or lash caps. I stopped with the feeler gauges when I was around .085" so they were real loose. I knew something was wrong when I pulled the intake and found three ports dark when the other five were clean. All three were intake rockers on those "dark" cylinders. I was well past the point where I should have run the valves, but this was a surprise since there was nothing to indicate anything was wrong. No noise, misfire, popping....nothing. I will be replacing the lifters anyway, but what else could have suffered? Can't believe this just went a mid 5.8 in this condition.

---

What is the definition of < dark cyls > & what would cause this from too much intake lash?

---

Quote:

---

Brian I forget what rockers you are running but some
of the adjusters are junk and will pull the threads
out and were soft so the push rods beat the cups...
also as said check the dia of the cup to the PR ball...
3/8 balls DONT FIT on any of the cups

---

Running 1.7 ratio Jesel.Never heard many bad stories about their adjusters.

Quote:

---

You going to do any racing this year? Didn't see you at all in 2011.

---

As soon as I get pieces back and the engine back together we will be out there. I hope to run a bunch this year. You are right though, only went out once last year for a quick test that resulted in some new bests but no data for the logger.

Quote:

---

---

There will be alot of changes made on this round. Heads are getting new ports that make them viable to 8400 RPM (current "original" Coleman port is all done at about 7300 RPM with my displacement). I am also only opening the intake valve a net amount after lash and deflection of just over .700". Cam will be re-ground to take the net lift over .800".

---

Now we're talkin'.

---

Gonna be radically different for sure.

Quote:

---

Overly rich... fuel pooling in the port... I think this is a interesting observation but not sure its the cause of a dark intake port... JMO... Dark intake tracts are usually from exhaust gasses , yes?... I am not trying to bust your chops on this one just trying to learn

---

I'm only taking guesses at the cause since they concided with the loose valve lash.I'm not sure what the actual cause is. I am open to suggestions as to the cause.

Quote:

---

Check your rocker arms. May be a broke bearing or more than likely your adjuster backed off. If you run the proper pushrod length you can only back the adjuster off 1/2 to 3/4 a turn and they bottom out in the rocker arm.

Then again maybe you have some bent valves. That would explain the black in the intake runners.

Leon

---

Quote:

---

When did you check the lash prior to discovering this?

---

Quote:

---

Sorry to hear that Brian. I hope you caught it before it did major damage.

---

Quote:

---

Sorry to hear about the damage. We have issues as well. I'm about to the point of selling it all.

---

Quote:

---

The culprit of the loose valves was destroyed lifters. One completely gone roller....found three pieces of it, no shaft and only five needle bearings up top. Number 1 cylinder is scored and I need to see how bad it is. I am dreading having to re-bore this and buy new pistons for an engine with so few passes.

---

Quote:

---

The culprit of the loose valves was destroyed lifters. One completely gone roller....found three pieces of it, no shaft and only five needle bearings up top. Number 1 cylinder is scored and I need to see how bad it is. I am dreading having to re-bore this and buy new pistons for an engine with so few passes.

---

I think I have a bad lifter on my W-2 engine... I
havent looked yet to see what the problem is... that'll
wait till I get that engine on the stand... I'll
put the W-9 back in

Quote:

---

Sorry to hear of the damage Brian! Hope it's nothing too serious!
What lifters are you thinking about dropping into there to replace these ones? You were running Crane Ultra Pro's?

---

They were Crane Ultra Pro's. Don't know what I will use next. Possibly Morel since they have a direct replacement for the Crane with the offset that I need. The offset narrows down my selection and I know the oil holes in the bushings work with the crane (pushrod oiled).

As far as serious, probably nothing $3-$4K won't fix.

Quote:

---

Brian sorry to hear about the problem. Hopefully you caught it before any of those little needles did any real damage to things. I am pretty religous about lash. Even once it is stable we still chack it at every race. That does not guarantee no problems but we rarely let it go more than 10 passes without checking it out.

Believe me I feel your pain. Checking mine at a race after it was not running the number it should, and we are talking a few thou off is how we found the bad LSM cam. Cam apparently lost its heat treat and was peeling material off, found it by lash on two cylinders being off. Caught it before it did much damage but I always check it over if it falls off for any reason.

---

Quote:

---

Highly disappointed in the findings from tearing down this engine. Seems there are problems at every turn so far.

The heads are at a professional shop to get checked out. If you are reading this and missed the first part, the easy thing to check for me was the valve springs were set up with a installed height that was over .200" from coil bind. Further inspection is finding the following: wrong length valves for the heads, tips of intake valves beat up, intake valves with less than acceptable margin, valve guides with up to .007" clearance, several exhaust valves not even sealing to the seats, etc..

Remember this engine has only about 60 passes on it. I don't think it would have stayed together much longer (in the valvetrain) and it seems that it is a good thing that the improper spring set-up caused the lifter failure or I might have run this until a catastrophic failure occured. These problems didn't just happen in 60 passes....they were there from the start.

It will be put together right this time and should finally run to it's potential.

---

Quote:

---

I was wondering how long of a valve do you run? What is the installed height? And, you should check you lash more frequently, after every time out, don't be lazy and assume everything is ok.

---

Quote:

---

Brian,

If it helps any I feel your pain and frustration. As you probably know we have issues with our heads as well. I haven't even touched the shortblock yet.

Mike Gray

---

Yes. I know you are feeling the same pains. I didn't get the "complete" low down on your issues, but I got the jist of it.

We might be able to put our heads together and make one "good" set.

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

I was wondering how long of a valve do you run? What is the installed height? And, you should check you lash more frequently, after every time out, don't be lazy and assume everything is ok.

---

I don't know exact length of valve, but I do know they are longer than normal for this head. Spring installed height was around 2.100 (from the build sheet), but actual measurement was around 2.065. This was for a cam that had .737" lift before the .026" lash and rocker arm/push rod deflection, so you can do the math. It was a comp triple spring with about 330# on the seat.

I run lash about every 20 passes. This could easily be one race weekend. I ran lash more often when I ran Harland Sharp rockers. The Jesel's should be better.

---

Is that seat pressure really necessary? I am running only .688 lift and mine are set at 240# with a 2.00 installed height.

Quote:

---

Number 1 cylinder is scored and I need to see how bad it is. I am dreading having to re-bore this and buy new pistons for an engine with so few passes.

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Number 1 cylinder is scored and I need to see how bad it is. I am dreading having to re-bore this and buy new pistons for an engine with so few passes.

---

What about just sleeving that one hole if the piston is still ok ?

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

I was wondering how long of a valve do you run? What is the installed height? And, you should check you lash more frequently, after every time out, don't be lazy and assume everything is ok.

---

I don't know exact length of valve, but I do know they are longer than normal for this head. Spring installed height was around 2.100 (from the build sheet), but actual measurement was around 2.065. This was for a cam that had .737" lift before the .026" lash and rocker arm/push rod deflection, so you can do the math. It was a comp triple spring with about 330# on the seat.

I run lash about every 20 passes. This could easily be one race weekend. I ran lash more often when I ran Harland Sharp rockers. The Jesel's should be better.

---

Is that seat pressure really necessary? I am running only .688 lift and mine are set at 240# with a 2.00 installed height.

---

Quote:

---

No help to ya,Brian...But I wish ya the best of luck!

---

Thanks Ted. From what I'm finding and is being corrected, I have no doubt that we will find the 8 second zone this year. It might take near perfect conditions though.

Quote:

---

hey that s--ks sorry to her that hows your short block..

---

Quote:

---

If it's in the budget to spintron, do it.

I'll never do another engine without it again.

---

What has time on a spintron set you back?? It would be great info for those reading this post

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

If it's in the budget to spintron, do it.

I'll never do another engine without it again.

---

What has time on a spintron set you back?? It would be great info for those reading this post

---