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TIG Welding Aluminum #545569
12/04/09 10:51 PM 12/04/09 10:51 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,595
On the south side of Nowhere
S
S/ST 3040 Offline OP
master
S/ST 3040  Offline OP
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On the south side of Nowhere
Knowing it has to be clean to weld properly, what works best
to clean a used intake manifold for welding?

Somebody ground through the roof of this port while "port matching" it.

It's too thin to glass bead and I don't want to use epoxy.

5647178-DSCN2824.JPG (118 downloads)
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545570
12/04/09 10:55 PM 12/04/09 10:55 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 383
Essex, Ont., Canada
Fishmarket Offline
enthusiast
Fishmarket  Offline
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Essex, Ont., Canada
A stainless steel wire brush is fine as long as it is clean...maybe some alcohol to remove oils. A little trick is to put a piece of copper behind the hole when welding. The filler won't stick to it.

1972 Plymouth Cuda 340 4 speed 1971 Plymouth Road Runner 383 Auto 1970 Plymouth Duster /6 Auto
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545571
12/04/09 10:57 PM 12/04/09 10:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 771
Btween a rock and a hard place
moparlulu Offline
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moparlulu  Offline
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Btween a rock and a hard place
I will run my tig across it and pull the crap to the top. Then I use a stainless wire wheel and go over it with that. I'll use the tig again and see if its still pulling junk. If not then I'll just fill the hole or crack.
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545572
12/04/09 10:59 PM 12/04/09 10:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 990
Vacherie, Louisiana
S
SuperStocker Offline
super gas
SuperStocker  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 990
Vacherie, Louisiana
Vic, bead-blast it lightly first both inside and out. An aluminum mig will do just fine too.

Raised ports eh?

Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: Fishmarket] #545573
12/04/09 10:59 PM 12/04/09 10:59 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
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Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Quote:

A stainless steel wire brush is fine as long as it is clean...maybe some alcohol to remove oils. A little trick is to put a piece of copper behind the hole when welding. The filler won't stick to it.



... has to be a stainless brush.... dont
sand blast it
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545574
12/04/09 11:01 PM 12/04/09 11:01 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
J
jcc Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
jcc  Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,696
Bitopia
Slightly diluted "simple Green" ( it's slightly caustic) seems to draw out oils, soak for a few minutes, your biggest problem, followed by acetone or MEK, then alum only SS brush.

Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: SuperStocker] #545575
12/04/09 11:13 PM 12/04/09 11:13 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,595
On the south side of Nowhere
S
S/ST 3040 Offline OP
master
S/ST 3040  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,595
On the south side of Nowhere
Quote:

Raised ports eh?



It was like that when I got it. Just a hack job. My sister
could have done a better job. They had just patched over
it with some flakey epoxy. There are several things that
need fixed on this un-cut intake.

Thanks for all the responses. Looks like cleaning it will be
cheap enough.
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545576
12/04/09 11:18 PM 12/04/09 11:18 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,257
acworth / N. georgia - south e...
cheapstreetdustr Offline
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cheapstreetdustr  Offline
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Posts: 6,257
acworth / N. georgia - south e...
put a penny behind it when you weld,,
it wont drip through or push out..a bigger hole.
and wont stick to the copper
cheapst

365" Iron J heads,,3480lbs best 1.39 60ft on SS springs.10.54,124 mph ...6.67 1/8th et.average 60fts 1.46 w/ small cam &.063 no2 pill tagged & insured
[image][/image]
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545577
12/04/09 11:19 PM 12/04/09 11:19 PM

A
Anonymous
Unregistered
Anonymous
Unregistered
A



don't ever glass bead aluminum if you plan to tig weld it. the glass can impregnate the aluminum and cause issues of porosity in the weld. MEK and then heat (after it evaporates) works well.
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum #545578
12/04/09 11:23 PM 12/04/09 11:23 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,595
On the south side of Nowhere
S
S/ST 3040 Offline OP
master
S/ST 3040  Offline OP
master
S

Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,595
On the south side of Nowhere
OK, somebody is going to have to tell me what MEK is.

Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545579
12/04/09 11:25 PM 12/04/09 11:25 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Quote:

OK, somebody is going to have to tell me what MEK is.



Methyl ethyl chloride(dont know on the spelling)
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545580
12/04/09 11:28 PM 12/04/09 11:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,228
Bend,OR USA
C
Cab_Burge Online work
I Win
Cab_Burge  Online Work
I Win
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,228
Bend,OR USA
Quote:

OK, somebody is going to have to tell me what MEK is.

Methel Ethel Keytone, you may have ahard time finding it now. Try a good paint or harware store that sells commercial paint products

Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545581
12/04/09 11:29 PM 12/04/09 11:29 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,771
St.Clair Shores MI.
tilt Offline
top fuel
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Quote:

OK, somebody is going to have to tell me what MEK is.



Methyl ehthel ketone.(MEK)Home Depot

I agree with Dram (clean and then heated)and the other posters about the copper.I've just used a piece of copper plumbing tube.

68 CORONET R/T BEST MACHINE BUILT EFI'd TWIN TURBO(UP and RUNNING !!) 03 Mach1
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: MR_P_BODY] #545582
12/04/09 11:31 PM 12/04/09 11:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,048
Richmond, Tx. (Houston)
GTSDave Offline
master
GTSDave  Offline
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Richmond, Tx. (Houston)
I have used a few things, but a new or clean stainless wire brush is the ticket. I also purchased some aluminum cleaner from the local welding shop expensive but it works great. It eats off the oxidation. But Easy off in the yellow can works just as good, and it is much cheaper. Make sure you buy the one that doesn't need you to preheat the oven. Oh and the stainless wire brush is a must. Aluminum will start oxidizing within a couple of hours. I always clean it off really well, then clean it again just before I do the welding.

-Dave

-Dave

PLEASE Pray for our brothers and sisters in harms way.

If you are the owner of a GTS us at the GTS Registry www.gtsregistry.com
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: Cab_Burge] #545583
12/04/09 11:33 PM 12/04/09 11:33 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,185
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
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Posts: 20,185
PA.
acetone and a brand new stainless wire brush. make sure you wear rubber gloves while applying the acetone. Some of that stuff will KILL you.

1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: Cab_Burge] #545584
12/04/09 11:34 PM 12/04/09 11:34 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,981
SE Michigan
TS3303 Offline
top fuel
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SE Michigan
after your normal degreasing I have always found that soaking in the laundry tube with powdered tide and super hot water will bring all the oils out of the pores. let it soak for an hour and you will see the oil slick on the surface of the water. Rinse after and then do another soak in just plain hot water. Rinse, heat, SS wire brush, then weld.
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: S/ST 3040] #545585
12/05/09 12:01 AM 12/05/09 12:01 AM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 81
langley b.c. canada
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don miller Offline
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langley b.c. canada
what ever you do, DO NOT use brakleen anywhere within about ten miles of where you are going to weld that.
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: Cab_Burge] #545586
12/05/09 12:03 AM 12/05/09 12:03 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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MR_P_BODY  Offline
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Romeo MI
Quote:

Quote:

OK, somebody is going to have to tell me what MEK is.

Methel Ethel Keytone, you may have ahard time finding it now. Try a good paint or harware store that sells commercial paint products



Thats the stuff.... couldnt remember the last word
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: don miller] #545587
12/05/09 12:06 AM 12/05/09 12:06 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,882
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Offline
Don't question me!
Stanton  Offline
Don't question me!
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,882
Ontario, Canada
Quote:

what ever you do, DO NOT use brakleen anywhere within about ten miles of where you are going to weld that.



Thanks, but you're a week late with that advice. Anyhow, tell me why. I'm guessing I was fortunate that nothing happened as a result.
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: tilt] #545588
12/05/09 12:09 AM 12/05/09 12:09 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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MR_P_BODY  Offline
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Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
I've just used a piece of copper plumbing tube.



I make up what we call a welders helper... a piece
of brass brazed to a rod with a file handle on the
end... the brass part is sorta pie shaped but I have
a few different shaped ones
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: Stanton] #545589
12/05/09 12:09 AM 12/05/09 12:09 AM

A
Anonymous
Unregistered
Anonymous
Unregistered
A



Quote:

Quote:

what ever you do, DO NOT use brakleen anywhere within about ten miles of where you are going to weld that.



Thanks, but you're a week late with that advice. Anyhow, tell me why. I'm guessing I was fortunate that nothing happened as a result.



oh, nothing too serious, only that the fumes could KILL you.
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: Stanton] #545590
12/05/09 12:14 AM 12/05/09 12:14 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,048
Richmond, Tx. (Houston)
GTSDave Offline
master
GTSDave  Offline
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Posts: 3,048
Richmond, Tx. (Houston)
It's not so much about getting the oil out folks. Aluminum oxidizes and forms a thin layer of aluminum oxide. It melts at 2 to 3 times the temperature of aluminum.

Even if it looks shiny and brand new, it still has a layer on it. Cleaning it off is done with chemicals and the stainless wire brush. If you dont clean it off, once you have the heat high enough to melt it, the aluminum underneath will just run out like water.

Think of it like breaking the crust on a pie, once you get through the top layer everything underneath will be goo.

If you get that thin little layer off aluminum oxide off first, then you only need enough heat to form your puddle in the aluminum. And wont have the danger of melting away the good stuff.

If that makes any sense.

-Dave

PLEASE Pray for our brothers and sisters in harms way.

If you are the owner of a GTS us at the GTS Registry www.gtsregistry.com
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: GTSDave] #545591
12/05/09 12:34 AM 12/05/09 12:34 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
Bob_Coomer Offline
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Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
IMO
Just use a stainless wire brush and some heat...
No matter what type of chemicals you put on it, when you hit it with some heat those impurities will boil to the top...Just apply a little heat and wire brush it.

Also you can fill the intake runner with some air arch gouging rods and weld away...They will back up the puddle and the weld wont
stick to it at all.

Check this stuff out
http://www.aluminumrepair.com/video_new.asp

Last edited by Bob_Coomer; 12/05/09 12:35 AM.
[color:"red"]65 Hemi Belvedere coming soon [/color]
[color:"#00FF00"]557" Indy engine 1.07 60ft 144mph in the 8th 2100 lbs package [/color]
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: GTSDave] #545592
12/05/09 12:35 AM 12/05/09 12:35 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 951
Temperance, MI
P
prochargedhemi Offline
super stock
prochargedhemi  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 951
Temperance, MI
Basically what everyone else has said, i have a few different aerosols that i use daily but the best for aluminum seems to be "NO FLASH" its made by LPS and works awesome. On thicker aluminum i use a heat plate to preheat everything (this also aids in getting oils out of the casting) spray and wire brush off and then weld. you will tell as soon as you strike an arc if its clean or not
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum #545593
12/05/09 02:17 AM 12/05/09 02:17 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 871
WA 98043
thecarfarmer Offline
super stock
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 871
WA 98043
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

what ever you do, DO NOT use brakleen anywhere within about ten miles of where you are going to weld that.



Thanks, but you're a week late with that advice. Anyhow, tell me why. I'm guessing I was fortunate that nothing happened as a result.



oh, nothing too serious, only that the fumes could KILL you.


Depending on the formulation of brake cleaner you use, it can make phosgene gas when hit w/ a flame.

And it only takes the tiniest whiff of that to mess you up (seizure, nerve/brain damage, pancreas damage, erc) or kill you. Really, really bad stuff.

Maybe one of the few things that makes hydrazine look safe.

-Bill

Seduce the attractive, and charm the rest. ****** 489 C.I.D., roller cam, aftermarket heads, tunnel ram, stock '54 Dodge rear axle assembly: which of these doesn't belong?
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: thecarfarmer] #545594
12/05/09 11:43 AM 12/05/09 11:43 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 916
MB,CAN
PC-CHARGER Offline
super stock
PC-CHARGER  Offline
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Posts: 916
MB,CAN
Here's a link to a story about brake clean.

http://www.brewracingframes.com/id75.htm
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: PC-CHARGER] #545595
12/05/09 04:38 PM 12/05/09 04:38 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,682
Philadelphia
R
radar Offline
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Posts: 1,682
Philadelphia
Also- watch out pennies aren't copper anymore. They're copper plated pot metal or something. I often use coins to dress up the hardware when I make tattoo machines. I braze them onto the ends of screws to make handles so you don't need to get a wrench to tighten the tube vise etc.

Anyway, the new ones have a 'creamy center' and if you heat one up with an ox/a torch it will pop sending molten pot metal all over. To make a short story long, don't use new pennies as copper!
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: radar] #545596
12/05/09 05:52 PM 12/05/09 05:52 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing Offline
master
B G Racing  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
As Mr Coomer says heat it,clean it with a ss brush and preheat before welding.On a repair like that I would drill it out cut a aluminum dowel or slug,tap it in the hole and weld it.If you can weld it on the inside also,then grind it smooth with a diegrinder and tootsie roll it.

[IMG]http://i430.photobucket.com/albums/qq21/ajcasini/max_zpsdppwd9km.jpg[/IMG]
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum #545597
12/06/09 12:24 AM 12/06/09 12:24 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,257
acworth / N. georgia - south e...
cheapstreetdustr Offline
master
cheapstreetdustr  Offline
master

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,257
acworth / N. georgia - south e...
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

what ever you do, DO NOT use brakleen anywhere within about ten miles of where you are going to weld that.



Thanks, but you're a week late with that advice. Anyhow, tell me why. I'm guessing I was fortunate that nothing happened as a result.



oh, nothing too serious, only that the fumes could KILL you.



or worse..youll be a walking Zombie...with no lung capacity..

365" Iron J heads,,3480lbs best 1.39 60ft on SS springs.10.54,124 mph ...6.67 1/8th et.average 60fts 1.46 w/ small cam &.063 no2 pill tagged & insured
[image][/image]
Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: MR_P_BODY] #545598
12/06/09 01:05 AM 12/06/09 01:05 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,013
Finally a HUSKER again
Moparnut426 Offline
I Live Here
Moparnut426  Offline
I Live Here

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Posts: 12,013
Finally a HUSKER again
Quote:

Quote:

A stainless steel wire brush is fine as long as it is clean...maybe some alcohol to remove oils. A little trick is to put a piece of copper behind the hole when welding. The filler won't stick to it.



... has to be a stainless brush.... dont
sand blast it



I agree dont blast it, it can imbed any impurities deeper in the aluminum. One thing that works great to clean it is John Deere 80% either, let it sit to completely dry out, Either will completely evaporate without leaving any residues. I have done this for many years on aluminum, cast iron, copper, and stainless. Use the brass behind it and it will fill up easier.

Kasey

Re: TIG Welding Aluminum [Re: radar] #545599
12/07/09 04:31 AM 12/07/09 04:31 AM
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 494
IL
E
EchoSixMike Offline
mopar
EchoSixMike  Offline
mopar
E

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 494
IL
Pennies have been zinc core for several decades. S/F...Ken M
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