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Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DemonDust] #1299242
09/13/12 02:35 AM
09/13/12 02:35 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
DemonDust Offline OP
master
DemonDust  Offline OP
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
OK, first off I don't know shi+ about turbo systems, hence the reason I started this post. I was reading on the turboforums but it seems when I had a question it took forever and a day to get an answer. I could come to moparts and have an answer in minutes to hours.

Second, I don't feel like 300 hp is a lot more hp. And E85 isn't for me? Seems it's been running pretty well the last few years. My rear has been holding up to almost 900 hp for 3 years now. Just did a ladder bar setup and the gears show no signs of wear.

Trendz, I had no intentions on buying anything at this point. I just wanted to get educated and find out what it would take to do. Btw, where are you in mke? I'm over in Waukesha. I finally found a shop to rent so I can bring my junk down here and work on it. I haven't really touched my car in almost a year now since I've been working here in mke.


SDG Motorsports
Hellcat Demon and Redeye Supercharger CNC Porting
https://www.sdgmotorsports.com/
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DemonDust] #1299243
09/13/12 02:28 PM
09/13/12 02:28 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 453
Holly, MI
JackGTX440 Offline
mopar
JackGTX440  Offline
mopar

Joined: May 2004
Posts: 453
Holly, MI
Quote:

OK, first off I don't know shi+ about turbo systems, hence the reason I started this post. I was reading on the turboforums but it seems when I had a question it took forever and a day to get an answer. I could come to moparts and have an answer in minutes to hours.




One thing you have to remember on theturboforums; it is a lot smaller site that moparts. Moparts is probably one of the biggest car forums on the net. Also, the mopar section on there is small. It is just a little subforum from the big one. Most of the very knowledgeable turbo guys on there with good info are mod motor guys and some LS guys. Those people don't browse the little mopar section. I would spend my time and research mostly in the general turbo tech section.

Also, it takes a lot of searching and reading on that site to get up to speed. The search features works well. I would search things like "1500 hp single turbo" and see what shows up. See what people are doing and how many cubes they have and what turbos they are running and specs on their heads. If you only visited te mopar section, you probably aren't going to te far. Remember, all engines work the same. The turbo system doesn't care if the engine says Mopar or Ford on it.


Jack Irons Jr. '67 GTX, turbo 6.1 HEMI
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DemonDust] #1299244
09/13/12 05:21 PM
09/13/12 05:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,540
Milwaukee WI
T
TRENDZ Offline
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TRENDZ  Offline
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Posts: 2,540
Milwaukee WI
In no way was I meaning to put you down. Having these discussions with many people with different experience and goals helps... even if it does "muddy the waters" some.
I was under the impression that this car is used in cold climates and what he said is true, the fuel's composition is not a stable platform for that situation. Hey if it's been working for you, don't stop on my account.
I am not against e85. I have a p7 turbo project that will be built to run on e85, but not in the conditions you subject yours to.
Im on the south west side of Milwaukee by the way.


"use it 'till it breaks, replace as needed"
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: TRENDZ] #1299245
09/14/12 11:55 AM
09/14/12 11:55 AM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,255
IL
furious70 Offline
top fuel
furious70  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,255
IL
Your absolute BEST next step is to take TRENDZ out for some beers and let him regale you with all that he's done with this stuff. You'd have a hard time paying someone for a better education and he's right there nearby!


70 Sport Fury
68 Charger
69 Coronet
72 RR
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: furious70] #1299246
09/14/12 12:07 PM
09/14/12 12:07 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
DemonDust Offline OP
master
DemonDust  Offline OP
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Menomonee Falls
That can most certainly be done. Beer and wings sounds like a plan.


SDG Motorsports
Hellcat Demon and Redeye Supercharger CNC Porting
https://www.sdgmotorsports.com/
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DemonDust] #1299247
10/05/12 07:56 AM
10/05/12 07:56 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 769
Europa, Estonia
Georg Offline
super stock
Georg  Offline
super stock

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 769
Europa, Estonia
what about useing Cummins turbocharger?


Outlaw Plymouth Valiant R5/P7 Powered by Liuzzo Racing COMP Performance Group dealer in Baltic Premium Performance
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: mokid] #1299248
10/05/12 08:29 AM
10/05/12 08:29 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 325
Greenville, WI
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Big B Offline
enthusiast
Big B  Offline
enthusiast
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 325
Greenville, WI
Quote:

Why don'y you talk to a turbo engine builder like Jensen, Bennet,guy who know a thing or two about combos and what works.



Since you live in WI why don't you have Todd from Goodwincompetition racing engine build you a turbo motor. Just email him and He will answer all your questions. He's not cheap.

Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: Big B] #1299249
10/05/12 08:42 AM
10/05/12 08:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,243
Canada
Kam*Kuda Offline
master
Kam*Kuda  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,243
Canada
FYI My car is almost together Dyno testing within a month
The fuel system
fast xfi
aeromotive eliminator pump
aeromotive fuel pump controller to save the pump on the street
fast 90 mm throttle body
83 lb injectors

This would be good to about 1000 hp and you can step up to bigger injectors or 2 sets of injectors for more HP

This is a mock up pick

7408015-prochargerr.jpg (127 downloads)

1970 Barracuda Convertible
1968 Satellite Street Strip car
1654.5 Mustang
1955 Land Rover
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: Big B] #1299250
10/05/12 08:51 AM
10/05/12 08:51 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
DemonDust Offline OP
master
DemonDust  Offline OP
master

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
Quote:

Quote:

Why don'y you talk to a turbo engine builder like Jensen, Bennet,guy who know a thing or two about combos and what works.



Since you live in WI why don't you have Todd from Goodwincompetition racing engine build you a turbo motor. Just email him and He will answer all your questions. He's not cheap.




I can build my own engines, don't need to pay someone to do it. I would consider him as a reference. Thanks for the info.


SDG Motorsports
Hellcat Demon and Redeye Supercharger CNC Porting
https://www.sdgmotorsports.com/
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: Georg] #1299251
10/05/12 09:07 AM
10/05/12 09:07 AM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 453
Holly, MI
JackGTX440 Offline
mopar
JackGTX440  Offline
mopar

Joined: May 2004
Posts: 453
Holly, MI
Quote:

what about useing Cummins turbocharger?




None of the holset turbos that come on cummins powered pickup trucks (I'm assuming that's what you meant) flow enough air to come close. It would probably take four or five hx-35's to flow close to enough air to make the power that has been discussed.

On the other hand, twin hx-35's would be a great economical way to make a super simple, super street friendly, drive across the country 700fwhp 340.


Jack Irons Jr. '67 GTX, turbo 6.1 HEMI
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DemonDust] #1299252
10/05/12 09:50 AM
10/05/12 09:50 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 506
Texas Afghanistan Iraq etc.
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DakFink Offline
mopar
DakFink  Offline
mopar
D

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 506
Texas Afghanistan Iraq etc.
First off about the Blow Fish: It was originally a P5-Hemi head- they grenaded that. Since they had to build another motor they wanted to go faster and now they have the R5P7 in it.

As you said; you saw they had put slugs in between the block wall and Floating Cylinders, they have band-aided the issue that many have seen and told you over the years why they wouldn't build a Boost application for that motor. HONDAs were notorious for this same configuration and Issue in their early years. Those guys Pinned and Plated there's and run some insane Boost and HP through those engines.

Making 1200+ with boost is not going to be like making 1200hp NA. NA you usually see a Trq Number that is 25-40% lower than the HP number. With Boost your TRQ number is going to up there closer to your HP number. something like 1200hp and 700ft/lbs=NA and 1200hp and 980ft/lbs=boosted. This is what is going to cause issues. TRQ breaks parts NOT HP. And Boosted motors have plenty of it. Same reason people short fill race blocks especially for nitrous and Boosted applications. Which those blocks have a solid fire deck.

Far as selecting parts: I call on the Pros. I to this day couldn't tell you the difference in a T4 or a T6 based Turbo. I called Precision and Turbonetics when I was ready to order mine and spent 2hrs on the phone with them discussing what I had what I was after and what I needed. After they both gave me the exact same setup details I knew what I needed and found a supplier. Now tell me what AR you have on the exhaust side and what MM the compressor side is and I know what you're working with.

Far as the fuel Pump; I'm going to be using MagnaFuel myself. I went with them for the simple fact they had an EFI-Package that fit my needs. Now they do have a Mechanical Pump available as well. Weldon is also a damn good choice. That's pretty much the only 2 I would even think to use. Always get more pump than you think you'll need. TOO many times I have seen pumps crap out from working too hard or plain out just can't keep up.

EFI: that's a whole another ball game in itself. I personally went with BS3 (Big Stuff 3) for the simple fact I could get all the things that were OPTIONS for FAST at the time were all included with BS3. And by the time I paid the Higher price for the BS3 it was still cheaper than the Fast if I added all the extras to Fast to make it equal to BS3. That was 2006. NOW?! Do your own homework and see what suits you best. I always hear guys say to get something that you know someone that can tune it for you. That used to be true. Not so much any more. Any of the good tuners worth a flip today can tuner either one. Same with getting help at the track. BS3 has become more dominant in recent years. But most that run BS3 have ran Fast in the past and know both systems. The same guy that owns BS3 developed the original Fast systems (Speedpro EFI) So they maintain a lot of similarities. There are other systems out there But they are usually more expensive or not up to the task.

Precision turbo has some basic info on wastegates and BlowOffValves on their website in a PDF file. IIRC it's under their FAQ link or something close to that.

Far as your Intake: Wilson Manifolds!!
They have about the best price I have seen for adding Injector bungs and Fuel rails to an Intake. They also have Throttle Bodies all the way up to 105mm for single blade and 2300cfm for a Dominator Style 4-bbl.

I don't know how well you know BondoBob (Bob Leeth) Bob's Pro Fab: But he was considering doing the same thing to his R5P7. He knows some Turbo experts local to him and they told him Boost would be no problem on that engine. The guys he knows deal more with Diesels and Tractor Pulls but they also run some diesels that have that same floating piston block configuration and Diesels Poor way more boost into them than a Gas engine would. 80-120psi

So all in all!!! Yes it can be built to do what you want and More. BUT your going to have to work with someone that knows what they are doing.

You might even look at bringing your RPMs out of the stratosphere to make the HP numbers your looking for.

Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DakFink] #1299253
10/05/12 10:37 AM
10/05/12 10:37 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 506
Texas Afghanistan Iraq etc.
D
DakFink Offline
mopar
DakFink  Offline
mopar
D

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 506
Texas Afghanistan Iraq etc.
Looking through that Blowfish Build. If you could get a set of those Spacers they use around the cylinders YOU would be GOLDEN!!!

Throw all the boost at it you want.

Call them and see if and how Much???

Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DakFink] #1299254
10/05/12 10:42 AM
10/05/12 10:42 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
DemonDust Offline OP
master
DemonDust  Offline OP
master

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
Thanks for all the info Kenny

I'd need their cnc program to machine the block to fit those in. I doubt they'd send it out and I really don't feel like shipping a block across the country to have it done


SDG Motorsports
Hellcat Demon and Redeye Supercharger CNC Porting
https://www.sdgmotorsports.com/
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DemonDust] #1299255
10/05/12 12:35 PM
10/05/12 12:35 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 506
Texas Afghanistan Iraq etc.
D
DakFink Offline
mopar
DakFink  Offline
mopar
D

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 506
Texas Afghanistan Iraq etc.
Quote:

Thanks for all the info Kenny

I'd need their cnc program to machine the block to fit those in. I doubt they'd send it out and I really don't feel like shipping a block across the country to have it done




Never hurts to give them a call and see what they say? They may surprise you. In a good way?!

Shipping your block to them may be a PITA but may be well worth it?

Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DemonDust] #1299256
10/05/12 02:01 PM
10/05/12 02:01 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 769
Europa, Estonia
Georg Offline
super stock
Georg  Offline
super stock

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 769
Europa, Estonia
Quote:

Thanks for all the info Kenny

I'd need their cnc program to machine the block to fit those in. I doubt they'd send it out and I really don't feel like shipping a block across the country to have it done




I`v sended three or four e-mails to them askeing their help and tips about my R5/P7 motor build and got back almost nothing. Just very shallow information. To my last mail they never answered Seems like I ask top secret information
So I really doubt they give out any info about those CNC programs. If they are avaible I also would be interested to have them even if I need to pay for that some normal price

Last edited by Georg; 10/05/12 02:02 PM.

Outlaw Plymouth Valiant R5/P7 Powered by Liuzzo Racing COMP Performance Group dealer in Baltic Premium Performance
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: Georg] #1299257
10/05/12 04:32 PM
10/05/12 04:32 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 159
Vidor Texas
O
onyxba Offline
member
onyxba  Offline
member
O

Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 159
Vidor Texas
Bob Sweeney from FX engines built the engine for the Blowfish. Nice guy to talk too with a lot of information on that engine.

Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: onyxba] #1299258
10/06/12 09:04 AM
10/06/12 09:04 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 506
Texas Afghanistan Iraq etc.
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DakFink Offline
mopar
DakFink  Offline
mopar
D

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 506
Texas Afghanistan Iraq etc.
Quote:

Bob Sweeney from FX engines built the engine for the Blowfish. Nice guy to talk too with a lot of information on that engine.




THERE YOU GO!!!

I was pretty sure they didn't build that engine in house BUT wasn't 100% sure.

Most of the guys that build on that caliber don't have the time or facilities to build the core power-train stuff too. They source it out usually to shops that build on on the same level they do.

Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: DakFink] #1299259
10/06/12 10:25 AM
10/06/12 10:25 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,843
MI, usa
dvw Offline
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dvw  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,843
MI, usa
You want to street drive this thing? 1200 HP with ladder bars. It will spin,spin, spin and nothing else. Thousands of $ to putt around at 1/4 throttle. I've owned a boosted (very mild 600 hp) for over 25 years. Even with 320/15 drag radials tire spin from a roll is a given on the street at any speed in 1st or 2nd. I driven Dizuters mild build as well. It's right at the limit of usefulness as far as traction, and that's with a 2.76 gear. Trust me I like HP as much as the next guy. Just think out your plan before you leap.
Doug

Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: dvw] #1299260
10/07/12 09:55 PM
10/07/12 09:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 25
California
Mad Dart Offline
member
Mad Dart  Offline
member

Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 25
California
On the Fuel Pump questions. I would never run just 1 fuel pump with boost. If for some reason it shuts down it could be a very expensive lesson to learn. You want to OVER fuel pump it. Tons of guys on theturboforums.com use the Walbro GSL-392's. They pump some serious fuel and are good up to 600 Boosted EFI HP Each. They cost $100.00 each, are quieter than the Magnafuel, Aeromotive etc. They will lift fuel, act as a dead head if you are turning multiple pumps on at different times "Boost or NOS" etc and are Super Reliable. No Fuel Pump Controller needed!!
I am running Triplets on mine. Dual 10an feeds off the Fuel Cell to the Manifold with a single 10an to the regulator, 8an return. This set up is good for 1600 Boosted EFI HP and cost right at $500.00 for the manifolds, fittings etc to set up.

7411437-phpdFSCtcPM.jpg (91 downloads)
Re: Turbo Build for the duster info please [Re: Mad Dart] #1299261
10/07/12 11:18 PM
10/07/12 11:18 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,646
Plymouth Meeting, PA
bigtimeauto Offline
Trophy Winner
bigtimeauto  Offline
Trophy Winner

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,646
Plymouth Meeting, PA
Quote:

On the Fuel Pump questions. I would never run just 1 fuel pump with boost. If for some reason it shuts down it could be a very expensive lesson to learn. You want to OVER fuel pump it. Tons of guys on theturboforums.com use the Walbro GSL-392's. They pump some serious fuel and are good up to 600 Boosted EFI HP Each. They cost $100.00 each, are quieter than the Magnafuel, Aeromotive etc. They will lift fuel, act as a dead head if you are turning multiple pumps on at different times "Boost or NOS" etc and are Super Reliable. No Fuel Pump Controller needed!!
I am running Triplets on mine. Dual 10an feeds off the Fuel Cell to the Manifold with a single 10an to the regulator, 8an return. This set up is good for 1600 Boosted EFI HP and cost right at $500.00 for the manifolds, fittings etc to set up.




i strongley disagree with this therory, Actually its opposite If you run one pump and it stops working your engine shuts off with no fuel to burn(been there done that)no harm no fowl. If you run multiple pumps and one stops working you take the chance of leaning the engine out and burning it up


BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154
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