Thinking one of my cars is going to need an upgrade to power steering and I could order a Firm Feel box (I’ve had three and enjoyed them), was thinking I could try a Borgeson swap this time. Looking for good steering, lighter weight and small enough for big tube headers if needed. I remember some people raving about them, other cursing their very existence. Wanted to see who on here did the deed and and what their overall opinion of the swap and use was like.

Mine is yet to be installed. It will get in around the time they offer a mopar 12:1? box is my guess.

I love mine but it was a lot more work than the advertising folks make it sound. The Borgeson box is actually kind of a kluge of a swap. You need the shorter PS steering column (my car had manual steering so that was a big hassle), the box sits at a weird angle which may or may not matter depending on who you talk to. The Borgeson box uses metric fittings so you need special hoses. Some PS pumps don't work well with the Borgeson box but nobody seems to know what works or what doesn't and it is hard to know who to trust. Oh, and on some engines the Borgeson box will interfere with the motor mount ear and it is not easy to reach in there to cut or grind on. So good luck there.

Bottom line is you can make it work but it isn't a bolt in swap. You have to actually spend a bunch of time running down all of the little parts to finish the job.

Bergman Autocraft has taken the time and effort to address all the issues on this swap an offer a kit. Check them out and see what you think. I have no dog in this hunt, all my cars use Armstrong steering, lol

https://bergmanautocraft.com/product/borgeson-steering-box-conversion-master-kit/

I just went through this install towards the later part of the crusing season, so I don't have a couple of thousand of KMs to remark about, but for what it's worth....

So to baseline my feeback, I started with the following combination:

1) 1980 M-body Coupe, using a pretty tight factory box (literally no float in the middle)
2) previously installed the pressure-drop shim kit in my power steering pump, so the ride was already pretty tight feeling, but yes, that good ol' Mopar squirly feeling was still there
3) my Coupe is set up with handling as the focus, so fleet car large sway bars, KONI adjustable shocks, all new suspension pieces with about 6K miles since a total rubuild

Alright, so following the install I will say this:

1) there is noticable improvement in ride stability, no doubt about it
2) was it a 'Day & Night' type of a thing...??? Nope, not for me, but I attribute that to the decent handling baseline I started off with
3) what AndyF remarked on was very true for me as well, and a real PITA at that...trying to find the right fittings to bolt it all together...my oh my, it felt I was literally hacking this thing together at times
- here is a Moparts thread of mine on this very topic
- I am running a power steering cooler, so perhaps that complicated things a tad more
- the power steering pump high-pressure hose used by the factory uses a weird (to me LOL) fitting, it's not a straight forward flare, rather it's an O-ring type retaining flare (for a decent pic and description of this check out the above thread I linked above)
4) I did actually run into an issue with the 1st unit they shipped, cross threaded bolts on the head piece (2 of 4), the exchange unit had a crooked dust seal on the pitman shaft, which I was able to correct, see this thread
5) finally, last but not least, take a look at the attached photo, those are 1-7/8" TTI pipes and while I do have a pretty good amount of room, but it gets HOT HOT HOT...so I am planning on wrapping the power steering hoses with some heat deflecting sleeves

Ohhh...almost forgot: I made up my own direct-fit-coupler. Basically took a factory piece and had a local race shop weld on the fitting with the correct spline count. Yes, you can get these on-line from Bergman, but holy molly the price...I couldn't afford that!

Here are a couple pictures of my install. I designed and built custom brackets to hang a late model Corvette PS pump on the front of my big block. I'm running 1 3/4 headers and they clear okay.

I bought my Borgeson box and install kit from Bergman Autocraft. Installation was about as simple as can be, the Bergman Autocraft install kit has everything to make it a true bolt in. There is a slight angle in the box the steering column alignment which Borgeson and Bergman said is not an issue and in 3 summers of driving its been a non issue.

I swapped from a manual box to power so my comparison is apples to oranges but the car drives like a newer car. It has decent road feel and the ratio is much nicer that I don't feel like I am turning a boat around. The smaller size and lighter weight was nice, I pulled the manual box out and installed the borgeson without touching my TTI headers or pulling the engine etc.

My only complaint is when at a red light with the box just off center it can have a bit of the dreaded hiss. I sent the box back to Borgeson via Bergman and they looked at it and may or may not have done anything. The hissing is much less and but still do it at times.

I would strongly urge you to follow the advice given. I have installed many versions of their 💩 kits in different make vehicle and have yet to find one that is much different than stated. Bergman sounds like he's dialed in what they haven't.
On the hiss PD mentioned might try a different fluid. I had one that we likely tried 5-7 different fliuds in to get ring of a low RPM noise. Lucas was the best, it waas still there a bit but the customer was OK with it (Thankfully)

Yeah, I'm working on a 1963 Ford Galaxie right now and we're installing a Borgeson box in it. Same crap as with a Mopar. The box doesn't come with the correct fittings, steering column has to be modified but no instructions, no instructions on PS pump or fluid, etc. Borgeson does a poor job with these boxes. They could make more money and have happier customers if they just put a little more work into their kits.

This all reads like a cure that may be worse than the disease...
But I guess if the box is really great, maybe it's worth the hassle ?

I'll go against the grain and say it wasn't worth it for me.
My experience is similar to Diplomat's, I put in a "cop box" in the 90's when you could still get them at Advance Auto.
I later did the shim upgrade too, and the steering was great.
I only decided to go Borg because of my Gen3 swap for added space.
As mentioned, it was a cumbersome install working through various issues.
I actually put the box in while the 340 was still in the car and drove it 6 months before the motor swap.
The 5.7 is in the car with the Holley power steering swap pump.
Had to get new fittings and custom hose made, it works, with the hissing at low RPM everyone mentions.

Since then, I have seen several other E-bodies with the Gen3 swap using factory gear at car shows.

Take this with the understanding I'm "budget minded", so this was a waste for me. The $1k could have been used several other places.
Does it have better feel than what I had? Maybe, but hardly noticeable.
The car is a cruiser and not autocrossed, but again, I can't tell the difference.

This mod seems to be in the category of " I've done everything else and seems cool"

Not yet mentioned, but I thought this box had like a one? point faster steering ratio over an OEM PS box, granted not much, but nobody has even commented on that aspect as if it's not even noticeable?

The OP asked for opinions on the kit and he's gotten them. The bottom line appears to be, Is the paint worth the gain ? that is what every one is commenting on.
I actually got to one of their senior tech guys while trying to sort out issues with a Mustang install. After getting to know him, he admitted it started with one kit for Something like a tri five Chev or cashmaro. He said the interest and sales were beyond expectations. So they figured they were on to something and started using the same box in A LOT of different app's by changing the weldment /adapter. Little NO actual testing was done on actual installs.

He also admitted they were winging it as the owner and his son moved to Tennessee (I think) and were concentrating on making Custom guns. Research at the time confirmed this.
He further said they really didn't have any actual Engineers in house just staff left over from the U-Joint days which is where the old man made his $$

As I stated earlier, I have installed quite a few and everyone was a PITA. groaning, box to column alignment, pitman arm and center link alignment issues and the list goes on. We didn't have issues with the hoses as we usually made our own.
BTW, I'm not trying to be offensive to you in anyway

i just shimmed the sh!t out of the relief valve in the saginaw pump my charger has, and it works really good now, compared to what it was.
a no bux, super simple improvement for sure, but i'm not corner carving either............

It is a good ratio and I think the install was well worth the effort on my Coronet. The Coronet was a hassle to drive with a manual box and now it is very easy to drive. It isn't over powered and soft like the OEM Mopar PS boxes, it is nice and stiff like a modern PS system.

I guess my main point is that the install was a hassle for me and at the time I was working in a very well equipped shop. I also have the ability to fabricate almost anything that is required for any hot rod project. So if it was a hassle for me it could prove to be really difficult for someone working in their driveway with just a claw hammer and a screw driver.

No Harm no foul. Me being here for over a decade, your last sentiment puts you into a very small crowd is my observation.

This UP here is the key point: I was lucky enough to have a Mopar buddy give me his high-pressure hose and a couple of fittings, which helped significantly, otherwise I would basically have the BOX...and....ummm, lots of questions how to button it all up!!!

Once again, the mopar guys here have answered my questions. Thanks for the replies and info.

I installed one in a 69 Charger, went in just fine, and it drives and steers much better.

I really do not understand the issues people have been having. I ordered everything through Bergman Autocraft so it included all the fittings, hoses and his column adapter. Box went right in without so much on an issue. This is on an M body that nobody makes [censored] for or even takes into consideration when designing kits. Completely took the slop out of the steering. I've installed two of these kits on separate cars. Just order it all through Bergman!