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vacuum or mechanical advance #256546
03/17/09 08:54 AM
03/17/09 08:54 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 129
wisconsin usa
M
moretork03 Offline OP
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moretork03  Offline OP
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Joined: Mar 2006
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wisconsin usa
Stoked 440, i think 555 cubes.any one have info on which advance I should run and the reasons?
Thanks

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: moretork03] #256547
03/17/09 09:02 AM
03/17/09 09:02 AM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,542
BROOK PARK, OH
WILD BILL Offline
Senior Member of the Junior Dragster Club
WILD BILL  Offline
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Posts: 10,542
BROOK PARK, OH
Depends on how your using the car. Is it street/strip or a 100% race only?

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: WILD BILL] #256548
03/17/09 09:30 AM
03/17/09 09:30 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 769
Europa, Estonia
Georg Offline
super stock
Georg  Offline
super stock

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Posts: 769
Europa, Estonia
Quote:

Depends on how your using the car. Is it street/strip or a 100% race only?



Exactly. When it`s street car what see race track few times use vacuum, if it`s full race car use mechanical one


Outlaw Plymouth Valiant R5/P7 Powered by Liuzzo Racing COMP Performance Group dealer in Baltic Premium Performance
Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: WILD BILL] #256549
03/17/09 10:56 AM
03/17/09 10:56 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 129
wisconsin usa
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moretork03 Offline OP
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wisconsin usa
was race only but going to strip/street, what is advantage or disadvantage?

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: moretork03] #256550
03/17/09 10:59 AM
03/17/09 10:59 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,015
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR Offline
I Win
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U.S.S.A.
You always have mech advance unless you LOCKOUT the dist. , Vac advance is for fuel economy under PART THROTTLE cruising conditions .

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: JohnRR] #256551
03/17/09 01:12 PM
03/17/09 01:12 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,442
LOWELL IN
Q
QWK_ENUF Offline
top fuel
QWK_ENUF  Offline
top fuel
Q

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Posts: 2,442
LOWELL IN
Quote:

You always have mech advance unless you LOCKOUT the dist. , Vac advance is for fuel economy under PART THROTTLE cruising conditions .




vac advance is for high vac conditions when a little more advance is beneficial


WAXER
Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: QWK_ENUF] #256552
03/17/09 01:30 PM
03/17/09 01:30 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,472
Overland Park, KS.
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Joshs68 Offline
pro stock
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Posts: 1,472
Overland Park, KS.
I just capped the vac advance on mine and use the mechanical only, works good and one less thing to worry about/fuss with.

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: Joshs68] #256553
03/17/09 02:34 PM
03/17/09 02:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Don't think I've run a vacuum advance on any of my mopars. well maybe my 318 coronet. All of them that had some performace upgrades have been blocked. I'm guessing you will have your distrib curved for your application?

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: JohnRR] #256554
03/17/09 02:42 PM
03/17/09 02:42 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,314
Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
dave571 Offline
master
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Posts: 5,314
Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
Quote:

You always have mech advance unless you LOCKOUT the dist. , Vac advance is for fuel economy under PART THROTTLE cruising conditions .



100% correct

A motor like that will need a custom curve on the mechanical to match the build. Cam, tire size, stall speed, weight, etc.. all play a part in the desired mechanical advance curve.

Vacuum advance is a feature for economy. Under hard throttle, performance should be unchanged, even on a mild build.

I curve deistributors on my sunn machine, and quite often will delete the vacuum. Usually on applications where the motor is radical enough the the mileage is not affected by not having it. Usually on these same apps, the initial value is so high, that adding vacuum at lower speeds gives it too much advance. Can creat a light throttle surge condition. Vacuum can also be a negative thing on a 4 gear car, as it comes up on the shifts, adding the possibility of theadvance plate sticking with too much advance etc..

Equally, on a milder build there is no reason not to run vacuum advance.

It only becomes a gray area in the middle

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: Mr.Yuck] #256555
03/17/09 02:45 PM
03/17/09 02:45 PM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,169
Virginia Beach, VA
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Old School Offline
super stock
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Virginia Beach, VA
on my my street cars with 500" motors,i use mech advance only. i tried to use vaccum adv.but it made the car surge and sputter at a steady throttle. when i unhooked it ,it went away.

Last edited by Old School; 03/17/09 02:47 PM.

68 cuda formula S 588" bb 5sp
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (SUBLIME)
70 CUDA CONVERT 500" 5SP (PLUMCRAZY):TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!
Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: Old School] #256556
03/17/09 04:01 PM
03/17/09 04:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 324
Northport, al.
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tvt59 Offline
enthusiast
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Posts: 324
Northport, al.
Don't mean to steal the tread. But I am going to try a programable msd 6 on my Valiant. Has any one else tried this?

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: dave571] #256557
03/17/09 04:48 PM
03/17/09 04:48 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 129
wisconsin usa
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moretork03 Offline OP
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wisconsin usa
thanks for all the info guy's.I wanted to know which distributor to get and now I know.I bought the car from a car finder, not the builder who raced it in the 80's. The car had a crossover ignition with a computer and the guy did not know how to program it so he put a points dist so I could hear it run before I purchased it.I know its a radical build, i found time slips under the carpet running low 8's.I want to go with electronic ign.

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: moretork03] #256558
03/17/09 09:22 PM
03/17/09 09:22 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,314
Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
dave571 Offline
master
dave571  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,314
Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
Quote:

thanks for all the info guy's.I wanted to know which distributor to get and now I know.I bought the car from a car finder, not the builder who raced it in the 80's. The car had a crossover ignition with a computer and the guy did not know how to program it so he put a points dist so I could hear it run before I purchased it.I know its a radical build, i found time slips under the carpet running low 8's.I want to go with electronic ign.




Definately no vacuum advance on a car like that.

I doubt many 8 second cars run advance at all. More likely be a lockdown unit with a timing retard to start it.

If it has advance at all, it will be a really short curve.

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: dave571] #256559
03/17/09 10:02 PM
03/17/09 10:02 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,384
Upstate NY
Bigcube Offline
I Live Here
Bigcube  Offline
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Upstate NY
If it has any sort of cam in it with a big motor you want to lock it out. It will idle much better with all the timing in it.


Jim

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: dave571] #256560
03/18/09 08:35 AM
03/18/09 08:35 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Quote:

Quote:

thanks for all the info guy's.I wanted to know which distributor to get and now I know.I bought the car from a car finder, not the builder who raced it in the 80's. The car had a crossover ignition with a computer and the guy did not know how to program it so he put a points dist so I could hear it run before I purchased it.I know its a radical build, i found time slips under the carpet running low 8's.I want to go with electronic ign.




Definately no vacuum advance on a car like that.

I doubt many 8 second cars run advance at all. More likely be a lockdown unit with a timing retard to start it.

If it has advance at all, it will be a really short curve.




yeah that, get a pro to set it up and lock it down.

Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: tvt59] #256561
03/18/09 08:44 AM
03/18/09 08:44 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,278
West Coast, USA
jbc426 Offline
master
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Posts: 3,278
West Coast, USA
Quote:

Don't mean to steal the tread. But I am going to try a programable msd 6 on my Valiant. Has any one else tried this?




I haven't tried it. Too many people get pissed when you throw a curve like this in a good reading thread. Kind of like barnacles on a whale's privates. It's very irritating to the other parties involved. It's always best to start clean with your own new thread.


1970 Plymouth 'Cuda #'s 440-6(block in storage)currently 493" 6 pack, Shaker, 5 speed Passon, 4.10's
1968 Plymouth Barracuda Convertible 408 Magnum EFI with 4 speed automatic overdrive, 3800 stall lock-up converter and 4.30's (closest thing to an automatic 5 speed going)
Re: vacuum or mechanical advance [Re: moretork03] #256562
03/18/09 11:51 AM
03/18/09 11:51 AM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,317
State of confusion
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Thumperdart Offline
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,317
State of confusion
My distributor`s been locked out for years and it starts/runs just fine and it`s one less thing to worry about..........from personal exp. the start retard made starting HARDER.....threw it in the trash years ago and starts fine w/out it.


72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....






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