A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
#1251006
06/14/12 04:04 PM
06/14/12 04:04 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,847 Missouri
StrokerPost
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Suppose you were wanting to build a bracket car to run in the 9.50 range, all other things being the same, i.e. weight-say 3200 lbs, auto trans-you pick which one, stuff like that, and it HAD to be a hemi, which would be the better, easiest, most cost effective way to go, old style RB block style or new school Gen 3? Maybe this has come up before, but I didnt see it. I've been impressed by the performance of the Gen 3 motor, but dollar for dollar can it match the old hemi? I'm just gonna sit back and listen to you guys. Thanks. Ken.
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: StrokerPost]
#1251008
06/14/12 04:17 PM
06/14/12 04:17 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 243 United States
W9 Dart
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I say Gen III. I obviously have a swayed opinion on the topic though. Can you have power adders? Tell me more what your class restriction are. I'm running a 6.1 with forged drop in pistons(stock forged crank stock powdered rods), ported heads, custom cam, TTi headers, and a Kenne Bell supercharger 10 lbs of boost. Making approximately 640 to the wheels. I'm at 3200 lbs as well. that puts me in the ball park of where you want to be. If I had better rods I could turn the wick up to 18-22 lbs and make so monster power, but my build was a so called budget build. I have close to 18 in the motor and power adder.
I know tons of guys running new Chargers, challengers, and 300 that are in the 10.5 range and they are 4400lbs. One of the guys is running it N/A alumin block 46X CI motor. The other are NO2 cars, etc. If it's a budget build just get a short block like my 6.1 port the heads, change the cam, and put the bottle on it and you will make ur number.
I chose to go supercharger b/c of the wow factor.
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: cagebob1]
#1251010
06/14/12 05:06 PM
06/14/12 05:06 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,590 Indy
joshking440
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Lunch is on me!
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: cagebob1]
#1251012
06/14/12 05:41 PM
06/14/12 05:41 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,213 New York
polyspheric
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And a real Ardun trumps that.
Depends on whether you're trying to impress 15 year olds at the Dairy Queen, or build a fast car.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: W9 Dart]
#1251014
06/14/12 06:28 PM
06/14/12 06:28 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,847 Missouri
StrokerPost
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Quote:
I say Gen III. I obviously have a swayed opinion on the topic though. Can you have power adders? Tell me more what your class restriction are. I'm running a 6.1 with forged drop in pistons(stock forged crank stock powdered rods), ported heads, custom cam, TTi headers, and a Kenne Bell supercharger 10 lbs of boost. Making approximately 640 to the wheels. I'm at 3200 lbs as well. that puts me in the ball park of where you want to be. If I had better rods I could turn the wick up to 18-22 lbs and make so monster power, but my build was a so called budget build. I have close to 18 in the motor and power adder.
I know tons of guys running new Chargers, challengers, and 300 that are in the 10.5 range and they are 4400lbs. One of the guys is running it N/A alumin block 46X CI motor. The other are NO2 cars, etc. If it's a budget build just get a short block like my 6.1 port the heads, change the cam, and put the bottle on it and you will make ur number.
I chose to go supercharger b/c of the wow factor.
Ok I will clarify this a bit more. First, this IS purely hypothetical, nothing I will be doing..........at least anytime soon. No power adders here, just heads up, pure motor, cubic inch to cubic inch. One thing that appeals to me about the Gen 3 is the weight as compared to a Gen 2, also the size makes it a winner, but I'm still interested in the best over all performer in this comparison. I'm in no rush to do either cuz I know that every month that goes by the Gen 3 will have more and more available, but the possibilities are already impressive.
BTW, what is currently the largest displacement you can achieve with the Gen 3?
Last edited by StrokerPost; 06/14/12 06:33 PM.
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: StrokerPost]
#1251015
06/14/12 06:50 PM
06/14/12 06:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,266 Renton Washington
Triple Threat
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Arrington www.shophemi.com offers a 440" 6.1 based hemi "440 HEMI (7.2) - 6.1 to 440 short block. 4.060 Bore x 4.250 Stroke" I think that a 426-440" Gen 3 with some compression a real camshaft and a set of Apache heads should get you there.
-Dustin 67 Dart, 9 second, 392" G3 Hemi 68 Barracuda 340 F/SA
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: Triple Threat]
#1251016
06/14/12 08:20 PM
06/14/12 08:20 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
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I Live Here
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The G3 weighs at least 200 lb less than the G2. You said cubic inch for cubic inch, which I take to mean no humongous elephant motor competing with a 430 inch G3. 30 years ago, a friend of mine ran a 433 bigblock chevy powered camaro into the 9s. I bet the latest Hemi heads flow better than the old rectangular ports, and the new "Hemi" chamber is much better than the bbchevy open chamber head which had to have a mountain range in the middle to get compression. That camaro weighed in at around 2950 lb. I don't think a 433 inch G3 Hemi would have any trouble laying waste to that car, meaning I can't see why you couldn't get into the 9s normally aspirated using a stock block. Now you could also do it with an elephant motor but the $$$ would indeed be more and you'd have more problems with weight transfer, engine fitment, etc. Just my R.
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: StrokerPost]
#1251021
06/14/12 10:20 PM
06/14/12 10:20 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,686 W. Kentucky
justinp61
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Ken, how have you been? If I didn't already have the small block stuff I'd do a gen III without any second thoughts. The gen IIs are cool but the thought of making 700 hp on pump gas and only weighing 450 lbs appeals to me. Anything I would build would be a street/strip deal. My wife and I drive the Dart all over the place, it never runs hot, starts easy too. The best thing is I can drop the exhaust off and run low 6.70s in the heat. Speaking of the Dart, when do you want to come to I-57 and drive it? Justin
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: racer_amx]
#1251023
06/14/12 10:40 PM
06/14/12 10:40 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 243 United States
W9 Dart
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enthusiast
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You gotta love gen 3 power, reliability, and advanced tech. Last week end I drove the car on a 300 mile road trip. At 70 mph it averaged 16 mpg. This video was started in 2nd gear. [IMG]http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t73/jbellyus/88a95a76.mp4[/IMG]
Last edited by W9 Dart; 06/14/12 10:41 PM.
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Re: A hypothetical question for you all to chew on.
[Re: rickseeman]
#1251025
06/15/12 11:35 AM
06/15/12 11:35 AM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 970 Backwater, PA
bwdst6
Bob George Racing #1 Fan
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Backwater, PA
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Last weekend for the Mopar Action event at Maple Grove someone had a gen3 hemi in a white 70 something Duster. Ran high 12’s… BFD! Of course everyone was interested in how he got it in there, what tranny he bolted it to, etc, etc. It was quite popular, just not that fast. In fact the only gen3 I saw there that was running mid 9’s was Barton’s drag pack. And I don’t see too many people being able to build something of that caliber.
This post is available in double vision where drunk.
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