Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: 73rrak]
#1173684
02/07/12 10:51 PM
02/07/12 10:51 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 44 Maine, USA
4spdswinger340
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member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 44
Maine, USA
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If you took .010 off the heads and .030 off of the blocks deck and are running thin .020 gaskets, you would have needed shorter push rods or shim your rocker shafts to compensate the difference. Otherwise you would have to much preload. I wouldn't think it would be enough to bend push rods but it wouldn't help matters if you did not. Did you do so?
Last edited by 4spdswinger340; 02/07/12 11:04 PM.
Life can be like fighting a dinosaur. Very hard
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: 4spdswinger340]
#1173686
02/07/12 11:03 PM
02/07/12 11:03 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 340 Alaska
73rrak
OP
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 340
Alaska
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Quote:
If you took .010 off the heads and .030 off of the block you would have needed shorter push rods or shim your rocker shafts. Did you do so?
It had the steel shim head gasket from the factory and I put a composite head gasket on so the should have taken up .020 of the .040 that was cut from the block at least that's what I thought. I hope I was wrong and the problem is just push rods too long.... and maybe a ruined cam.
When I take this car for it's first drive I think I'll bring a priest with me and drive it to my enemies house park it in his driveway then have the priest do an exorcism on the car so all the evil and demons go to my enemies cars ...... hahhahahahha
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: 73rrak]
#1173687
02/07/12 11:08 PM
02/07/12 11:08 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 44 Maine, USA
4spdswinger340
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Posts: 44
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Had a buddy that bent a few pushrods in a 383 by milling the heads and installing a .509 cam @ the same time. He milled .070 off the heads and was running a .040 gasket. Only reason I mentioned it. His retainers were hitting the top of the valve seal. We changed the seals, bent push rods and then shimmed the rocker shafts and it is still running good 5 yrs later. Can you tell if the top of your seals are stove up?
Last edited by 4spdswinger340; 02/07/12 11:24 PM.
Life can be like fighting a dinosaur. Very hard
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: 73rrak]
#1173688
02/07/12 11:09 PM
02/07/12 11:09 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,880 Out in Left Field, NY
bobs66440
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,880
Out in Left Field, NY
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Quote:
Quote:
If you took .010 off the heads and .030 off of the block you would have needed shorter push rods or shim your rocker shafts. Did you do so?
It had the steel shim head gasket from the factory and I put a composite head gasket on so the should have taken up .020 of the .040 that was cut from the block at least that's what I thought. I hope I was wrong and the problem is just push rods too long.... and maybe a ruined cam.
When I take this car for it's first drive I think I'll bring a priest with me and drive it to my enemies house park it in his driveway then have the priest do an exorcism on the car so all the evil and demons go to my enemies cars ...... hahhahahahha
Or maybe have your enemy take it for the first drive
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: 73rrak]
#1173689
02/07/12 11:25 PM
02/07/12 11:25 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,716 Baltimore/Denver
64Post
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,716
Baltimore/Denver
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it's not your pushrods. I'd almost guarantee it.
if the pushrods were too long, then you'd have lifters bottomed out and hanging valves open.
who's valve springs are they? Hughes recommends their own springs/retainers to run with their cams, especially with the whiplash cams.
put a good pushrod into the valve train, and slowly crank the engine over by hand, again and again, let us know what you find. does it crank over smoohtly the whole way? do you feel anything binding up? can you visually inspect the valvespring/valves to ensure the coils are not binding up or the retainer hitting the valve guide?
I bought the whole Hughes setup.... Cam, lifters, springs and retainers. They told me that my springs would be fine because they only had 50,000 miles on them but I bought them anyway. I had them installed by a machine shop that has been doing work for me for years with no problems.
I think I will leave the camera in the cylinder and get the push rods checked and measured because it sounds like the heads are coming back off anyway.
Please try to leave everything assembled. Leave the camera in for now and fab the push rod checker. When that's done work on getting the camera out. Bring that cylinder up close enough to TDC by hand to get the camera out. It sounds like the engine turns over ok since the kid bumped the starter. Then we'll go from there...
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: 73rrak]
#1173694
02/09/12 07:55 AM
02/09/12 07:55 AM
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 413 Norway (old world)
Oyvind Mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 413
Norway (old world)
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Sorry about your mishaps with the car. What car is it? And for the pushrods: Maybe they are just too weak for the type of springs and cam. I have seen 5/16" hollow pushrods bent like spaghetti on a 440 with obviously too hard springs (for those rods). I have bent pushrods myself due to sticky valveguides (because of old gummy fuel) My
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... update !
[Re: 73rrak]
#1173696
02/09/12 10:43 AM
02/09/12 10:43 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,094 A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,094
A Banana Republic near you.
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Quote:
Ok I got my push rod length checker made and these are the numbers I came up with :
Stock rod = 9.292
Rod checker results from lifter cup to rocker cup :
intake = 9.203 exhaust = 9.210
Is this enough to cause all of my intake push rods to bend. It doesn't look like a whole lot to me.
Did the stock length pushrod bottom out the lifter ? If the pushrod were to long and bottomed out the lifter I don't think it would have run fine for 20 minutes .
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: JohnRR]
#1173698
02/09/12 11:43 AM
02/09/12 11:43 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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The push rods are solid not hollow and the valves were cleaned and inspected when the new springs and locks were put on. The fuel system was clean and new fuel before fire up.
If I am reading this right all you did was change the springs and retainers ? if so your problem is the retainers probably hitting the tops of valve guides because that cam has a lot of lift , pull a spring and low at the stem seals , they should show evidence of being crushed between the retainer and the top of the guide .
Also a hollow pushrod is stronger than a solid one .
John I think it ran for 20 minutes, then on the next re-start all the push rods bent. Remember he had a carb issue too. I think he wiped the cam then the push rods got hung up and bent. 73 Did you check the other bank? How do the ex push rods feel? Pull the dip stick and see how "sparkely" it is.
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1173699
02/09/12 11:51 AM
02/09/12 11:51 AM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,880 Out in Left Field, NY
bobs66440
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,880
Out in Left Field, NY
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Quote:
Liquid fuel running down into the cylinders due to stuck floats can cause hydraulic lock and bend the the push rods if enough liquid was in the cylinders. I have also seen bent rods from this type of engine flooding also. that is why i never start a new motor with a used carb unless it was running the day before on my own stuff.
I have to say, if it ran ok for 20 minutes then bent the push rods on the next start up with nothing else changing other than a fuel issue, I would have to agree with this, unless it started running bad during the first start up but after the 20 minute break-in period. It's a little hard to tell, he has 3 threads going regarding this issue.
I would imagine if it hydro-locked it may have bent a rod or two also.
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: bobs66440]
#1173700
02/09/12 12:18 PM
02/09/12 12:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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Quote:
Quote:
Liquid fuel running down into the cylinders due to stuck floats can cause hydraulic lock and bend the the push rods if enough liquid was in the cylinders. I have also seen bent rods from this type of engine flooding also. that is why i never start a new motor with a used carb unless it was running the day before on my own stuff.
I have to say, if it ran ok for 20 minutes then bent the push rods on the next start up with nothing else changing other than a fuel issue, I would have to agree with this, unless it started running bad during the first start up but after the 20 minute break-in period. It's a little hard to tell, he has 3 threads going regarding this issue.
I would imagine if it hydro-locked it may have bent a rod or two also.
gas isn't like water, if it sat over night the gas would be gone..he'd have to have a TON of gas flowing to do that wouldn't you think?
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Re: All of my intake push rods are bent ..... Help
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1173701
02/09/12 12:39 PM
02/09/12 12:39 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,880 Out in Left Field, NY
bobs66440
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,880
Out in Left Field, NY
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Liquid fuel running down into the cylinders due to stuck floats can cause hydraulic lock and bend the the push rods if enough liquid was in the cylinders. I have also seen bent rods from this type of engine flooding also. that is why i never start a new motor with a used carb unless it was running the day before on my own stuff.
I have to say, if it ran ok for 20 minutes then bent the push rods on the next start up with nothing else changing other than a fuel issue, I would have to agree with this, unless it started running bad during the first start up but after the 20 minute break-in period. It's a little hard to tell, he has 3 threads going regarding this issue.
I would imagine if it hydro-locked it may have bent a rod or two also.
gas isn't like water, if it sat over night the gas would be gone..he'd have to have a TON of gas flowing to do that wouldn't you think?
I didn't know it sat overnight before the next start up. It's a little hard to follow the exact sequence of events.
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