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EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
#641905
03/16/10 03:24 PM
03/16/10 03:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 94
Austin, Texas
Seank
OP
member
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OP
member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 94
Austin, Texas
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68 cuda… I have a EFI tank quandary. I am looking at a FAST EZ-EFI setup and for $350 more I can get the kit with an external pump / lines. If one goes this route I have to replace sending unit and/or modify it with one with a return line tube. I think my current tank is ok but it should be boiled out as there is some rust and old gas varnish in it as it was off the road for a few years. Estimate expense would be: $60 to boil, 10 new gasket, 69 for sender, 350 for efi external pump kit = $489 total. But instead of buying the $350 external pump kit I can buy an internal pump (better setup and one a lot of people use is below) and modify my tank…however every article I have read says to buy a new tank and convert it but I am 80% sure I can boil my old one out: http://www.tanksinc.com/index.cfm/page/p...=prod/prd84.htmBut…it would require me to cut holes in my trunk to run the lines up from top of the pump as the mopar tank is smooshed up against the trunk floor, no clearance to sneak lines between them. Or pound down the top of the tank for clearance and not sure if I can do that. Cost: $60 to boil, 10 new gasket, 69 for sender, internal pump 215, new external fuel aeroquip supply lines $80 = $434 total. Cheaper, quieter and probably safer but I “may” have to cut up my trunk floor to route lines up and out, maybe not. Or have a custom tank done for the same, I hear they are about $1000 complete. I contacted Ricks Tanks but they need me to send them my old one in as a pattern. Don’t know anyone else doing mopar tanks. Any ideas? Thanks Sean
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: Seank]
#641908
03/16/10 04:21 PM
03/16/10 04:21 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 609
a cornfield near you
BlakDak
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 609
a cornfield near you
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Quote:
No such EFI pump made. All are installed down from the top of the tank.
EFI pump? its either electrical or mechanical.
Run a sump and a external pump, then either use your original pick up as the return line, or cap it off, and only use your sending unit.
I'll have to look at how the pick up mounts in the tank on my Valiant, but I am pretty sure you could modify it, and use a in tank electric pump.
As far as a return line, do you want to use one, or are you thinking you have to use one?
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: DaytonaTurbo]
#641910
03/16/10 05:28 PM
03/16/10 05:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,938
Sonora CA
Mopar_Rich
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,938
Sonora CA
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 As long as you don't need more fuel than the Walbro can deliver (about 550 HP). In the above picture the sump has two fittings. One can be the outlet from the pump and the other can be the return line. BTW: The internal pump is nice because you won't hear it.
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: Mopar_Rich]
#641911
03/16/10 05:37 PM
03/16/10 05:37 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 609
a cornfield near you
BlakDak
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 609
a cornfield near you
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Quote:
BTW: The internal pump is nice because you won't hear it.
wanna bet?
well maybe not in a big muscle car 
but I can hear one in my Rx7, and Eclipse, no where near as loud as a holley external pump I had in the 90's on a Duster.
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: ahy]
#641913
03/16/10 08:16 PM
03/16/10 08:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,938
Sonora CA
Mopar_Rich
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,938
Sonora CA
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Quote:
My bandaid is to slow down the A1000 with reduced voltage. 60' of #12 wire on the pump power feed has reduced voltage by about 1.3v. I'll try that and see if it works.
Any other ideas welcome!
You know they make a pump controller that does this for you...
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: Dragula]
#641916
03/16/10 10:02 PM
03/16/10 10:02 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Hey Sean, it's me Steve, long time no see. Anyway, when I converted my Diplomat to EFI (remember that car?) I used the stock tank. I went with an external pump initially, it burned out twice on me so I went with an internal pump. Modified the pick up to mount the pump on it. At less than half a tank that unbaffled tank would let the pump suck air and kill the engine. I did some looking around in yards for an EFI tank I could make fit the Diplomat with no luck. If you need to come out the top of the tank with lines you can simply use a spacer to space the tank down an inch or so for enough room. To be honest, if money weren't an issue I'd have a new stock tank modified by tanks, inc. to include an baffled sump and internal pump. http://www.tanksinc.com/index.cfm/page/p...prod/prd121.htmBTW, bottom mounted add on sumps are illegal and dangerous and I don't care how many people say they've run it with no problem.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: Supercuda]
#641917
03/17/10 01:06 AM
03/17/10 01:06 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
DaytonaTurbo
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
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Quote:
One can always plumb up 2 3/8" lines and feed 2 walbro's for upwards of 1100 horsepower capable as well as having redundant fuel supply in case one pump fails.  Just an idea that i've seen on high horsepower supras.
And that's what I would do before I ever dropped that kind of coin on an aeromotive pump. Most prefabbed aftermarket sumps have two outlets making it perfect for twin pumps. I wouldn't run the return to one of those fittings just because you're cycling the heated return fuel right back into the sump area and you can easily add the return to your stock pickup.
Also, my brother runs an external in-line walbro 255 on his 83 dodge rampage. 2.2L turbo with a bone stock small diameter exhaust with stock muffler. I do not heat the walbro when the engine is running.
Quote:
BTW, bottom mounted add on sumps are illegal and dangerous and I don't care how many people say they've run it with no problem.
Illegal where and dangerous how? The way my car sits in the back, the fuel tank is so high up there's more room between the bottom of the sump and the ground than there is between the bottom of my rockers and the ground. I'd have to back over a tree stump or a fire hydrant to hit that thing!
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: DaytonaTurbo]
#641919
03/17/10 01:56 AM
03/17/10 01:56 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,480
So Cal
autoxcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,480
So Cal
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There's a company at here in So Cal that builds aluminum gas tanks that are drop in replacements (except for a join in the fill tube IIRC). http://www.hotrodcitygarage.com/indexA.htmlHe comes out to Spring Fling. From what I hear they are a good deal. I just saw him at the last local swap meet. He can build you a tank that take a inside pump, but he advises against it. He says to change/repair the pump it's a pain. And he said there are external pumps that are not noisey. His words I dunno. Quicksilver440 just bought one and was very happy: https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...rue#Post5790175
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: DaytonaTurbo]
#641920
03/17/10 06:17 PM
03/17/10 06:17 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Quote:
Illegal where and dangerous how? The way my car sits in the back, the fuel tank is so high up there's more room between the bottom of the sump and the ground than there is between the bottom of my rockers and the ground. I'd have to back over a tree stump or a fire hydrant to hit that thing!
It's illegal in the US, Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards. I know nothing about Canadian law.
Unsafe, you betcha. What happens when you kick up so debris and it knocks a hose off the bottom sump setup? The whole tank dumps out.
With a top exit setup, even with an internal electric pump, you don't have that problem. With an external pump, it sucks air. With an internal pump, you shut of the key, no pump. And don't tell me there is no possibility you could kick up some debris, unless it's a trailer queen.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: Alikazam]
#641922
03/17/10 08:11 PM
03/17/10 08:11 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,024
In the twisties
RokketRide
super gas
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super gas
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,024
In the twisties
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Quote:
Does anyone here with Fuel Injection add a 1 gal or so sump tank after the main tank, but before the high pressure pump (basically fed by a low pressure pump) to eliminate as much need for a baffled tank? Just curious as I'm trying to plan out my fuel system for EFI as well. Hope this helps the OP as well!
I know for RX-7 track guys a surge tank is practically mandatory.
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: Mopar_Rich]
#641923
03/17/10 08:59 PM
03/17/10 08:59 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,664
IN
ahy
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,664
IN
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Quote:
Quote:
My bandaid is to slow down the A1000 with reduced voltage. 60' of #12 wire on the pump power feed has reduced voltage by about 1.3v. I'll try that and see if it works.
Any other ideas welcome!
You know they make a pump controller that does this for you...
I've seen those and looked them up again last night. They're a little expensive but it sounds like they drop the voltage with pulses instead of a constant low voltage which is easier on the pump. Plus they can go to full power if needed.
Min pump speed is adjustaable but I didn't see how much they can actually slow the pump down though?
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Re: EFI tanks...or just remote pump?
[Re: Supercuda]
#641924
03/17/10 09:17 PM
03/17/10 09:17 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 609
a cornfield near you
BlakDak
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 609
a cornfield near you
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Quote:
Quote:
Illegal where and dangerous how? The way my car sits in the back, the fuel tank is so high up there's more room between the bottom of the sump and the ground than there is between the bottom of my rockers and the ground. I'd have to back over a tree stump or a fire hydrant to hit that thing!
It's illegal in the US, Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards. I know nothing about Canadian law.
Unsafe, you betcha. What happens when you kick up so debris and it knocks a hose off the bottom sump setup? The whole tank dumps out.
With a top exit setup, even with an internal electric pump, you don't have that problem. With an external pump, it sucks air. With an internal pump, you shut of the key, no pump. And don't tell me there is no possibility you could kick up some debris, unless it's a trailer queen.
Hmmm, no cop has ever said anything about the cars I had them on.
Kick up debris to knock AN lines off? I dunno about you, but if its that big, I'm not going to hit it, and if I did, it'd probably take the car out.
Come on man, get real.
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