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Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 #3041825
05/12/22 04:41 PM
05/12/22 04:41 PM
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hp383 Offline OP
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Where can a person find info on adding a turbo?

I am looking to get a little more power, and maybe help the mpg,

Playing with the idea of adding a turbo to a 77 C body Fury, stock engine, and 2.76 gears out back.

Any parts lists of what to scavenge and from what would be helpful.


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Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: hp383] #3041892
05/12/22 10:38 PM
05/12/22 10:38 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Originally Posted by hp383
Where can a person find info on adding a turbo?

I am looking to get a little more power, and maybe help the mpg,

Playing with the idea of adding a turbo to a 77 C body Fury, stock engine, and 2.76 gears out back.

Any parts lists of what to scavenge and from what would be helpful.

Lets see, making more power includes consuming more air and fuel correct? work shruggy
Have you decided on how you're going to control the fuel with boost and vacuum yet, carb or fuel injection ? work scope


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: hp383] #3041927
05/13/22 01:42 AM
05/13/22 01:42 AM
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Sweden
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MikeN Offline
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The combination was used on Bristol cars in the early eighties.
Here is one example:
https://barnfinds.com/hand-built-classic-1980-bristol-beaufighter/
Try to copy as much as possible.

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: MikeN] #3041939
05/13/22 08:38 AM
05/13/22 08:38 AM
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furious70 Offline
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theturboforums.com was a great resource for DIY stuff, still tons of great historical info to read to see how people have done it. Traffic has fallen way off there, don't know where people went.
Also, go to the engine forum here.


70 Sport Fury
68 Charger
69 Coronet
72 RR
Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: hp383] #3041975
05/13/22 11:47 AM
05/13/22 11:47 AM
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Kalispell Mt.
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HotRodDave Offline
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The only way you get better MPG by adding a turbo is if you significant;y reduce the engine size but keep the power output the same or drastically reduce the engine RPM and use the turbo to supplement the low end TQ. They are one of those things that works better on paper than in the real world, ford uses them to cheat the EPAs MPG tests but real world use is basically the same (slightly worse in my personal experience) as all the other similar size modern trucks.

All that being said I would look for one from a cummins and drastically reduce the RPM or CID of your engine. It should work great for very low RPM TQ but will not work real good for significant HP gains. Also if it goes bad they are easy to get replacements.

My disclaimer also is that I have not got a ton of experience with turbos so someone may have better info than me, I am just sharing my thoughts and experience.


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Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: HotRodDave] #3041999
05/13/22 02:26 PM
05/13/22 02:26 PM
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I missed the mpg part - completely agree mpg increase on an existing engine will never happen. A turbo is a mild restriction in the exhaust when just freewheeling along and there's no way that improves mpg.

mpg can be improved along the lines Dave says + putting a milder cam in an existing engine (not something you need to do on a stock c body 360).

But a turbo can be a very efficient way to provide 25-50% more power than an engine has in it's NA state.

I ran stock Ford SVO/Turbocoupe turbos on my 383 when I first did it. They were too small, but they did work pretty well to get going. Something like that would work pretty good on your 360 (a pair of them). A pair of cummins turbos cfm wise is ok since you're a 5.9 at 2x rpm of a cummins, but the compressor map on those is pretty narrow and so it wouldn't be that efficient.


70 Sport Fury
68 Charger
69 Coronet
72 RR
Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: furious70] #3042207
05/14/22 10:02 AM
05/14/22 10:02 AM
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You might opt to remove some of the emissions stuff especially if you still have the lean burn. Performance spread bore,Headers-exhaust, MSD6A etc might help.

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: Moparite] #3042221
05/14/22 10:59 AM
05/14/22 10:59 AM
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So Near, Yet So Far
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Look through Dizuster's old posts on his '62.
It hauled butt with a used 360 & budget turbo, but wasn't built for MPG.
Seems to methat if you don't have to whip an engine to run a given speed that there would be a MPG bonus.
But that's hypothetical on my part from comparing a Slant vs 318 in Darts, all stock drivers from years ago.

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: topside] #3042384
05/14/22 09:15 PM
05/14/22 09:15 PM
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Brisvegas, Australia
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Turbo slant would be a much better option, way less weight, just over half the capacity.

If your truly after MPG, then have a bit of a look at ecomodder.com and the mega weight loss thread here https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/2255190/1.html

Aero and weight, plus a well tuned engine is about the extent of achievable stuff without spending stupid money that could just be spent on fuel, especially if its not a daily driver

That said, this one popped up in my feed the other day, lawnmower carb on a ford 302 that gets 40mpg, so the dude claims https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xHQWu2ZzPc

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: Alchemi] #3042404
05/14/22 10:57 PM
05/14/22 10:57 PM
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N.W. Florida
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Fat_Mike Offline
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Originally Posted by Alchemi
Turbo slant would be a much better option, way less weight, just over half the capacity.

If your truly after MPG, then have a bit of a look at ecomodder.com and the mega weight loss thread here https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/2255190/1.html

Aero and weight, plus a well tuned engine is about the extent of achievable stuff without spending stupid money that could just be spent on fuel, especially if its not a daily driver

That said, this one popped up in my feed the other day, lawnmower carb on a ford 302 that gets 40mpg, so the dude claims https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xHQWu2ZzPc


In a '77 C-body with a 2.76 rear end?

Last edited by Fat_Mike; 05/14/22 11:00 PM.
Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: Fat_Mike] #3042408
05/14/22 11:27 PM
05/14/22 11:27 PM
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Central Pa
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moparjim79 Offline
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A better option would be a turbo hemi. Better mpg and way, way more power. 5.7 6.1 6.2 and 6
4 are readily available

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: hp383] #3042445
05/15/22 07:33 AM
05/15/22 07:33 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,002
Andrews,In. U.S.of A.
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67_Satellite Offline
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Get a copy of "Maximum Boost" by Corky Bell ,and read up at the previously mentioned turbo websites.One of the ebay G.T. 45's would work well on a 360ish engine.You just need to figure out the other support systems needed and how you are going to package them.

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: hp383] #3042514
05/15/22 02:39 PM
05/15/22 02:39 PM
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USA
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360view Offline
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A lot of good suggestions in above replys..

I would add one seldom mentioned tip:

Try to find someone near you that has a
Mazda Millenia S with its factory installed double superchargers V6 that runs on the “Miller Cycle”
and see if they would let you drive it, or do a ride along, etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazda_Millenia

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/mazda-once-made-a-225l-v6-and-its-spectacularly-complex/

https://www.newcartestdrive.com/reviews/2000-mazda-millenia/

If you are looking for a boost in fuel economy AND power
understanding the Miller Cycle
is a good way to learn how.
The Miller Cycle can run on one or two turbos, not just with double superchargers like the Millenia S.

Double superchargers are easier to program an engine computer for,
as their output depends on rpm,
and not the volume and temperature of exhaust gas varying second by second.

sample quote

This car really comes into its own when its Miller-cycle V6 is put to work. Mazda’s unique Miller-cycle engine was named one the world’s “10 Best Engines” by Ward’s, an automotive trade journal for the past four years. It uses a Lysholm compressor — a scroll-type supercharger — to boost intake pressure along with late intake-valve closing to produce an impressive amount of power without sacrificing fuel efficiency. This system allows this 2.3-liter engine to perform like a 3.3-liter engine, while still retaining the 2.3-liter engine’s economy of operation. The result is a vigorous 210-horsepower with the brawny, quick response of 210 foot-pounds of torque. The Miller-cycle package has no downside.

end quote




Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: hp383] #3042670
05/16/22 12:09 AM
05/16/22 12:09 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,783
Pittsburgh,PA
RTSrunner Offline
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Check this site for reasonably priced new turbos.Imported of course,but they seem to be decent quality from what I have read,not personal experience.Might be a good option vs a worn out oil-coked up used unit.
https://www.maxpeedingrods.com/category/turbocharger.html

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: RTSrunner] #3042706
05/16/22 08:33 AM
05/16/22 08:33 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 4,121
nowhere
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Originally Posted by RTSrunner
Check this site for reasonably priced new turbos.Imported of course,but they seem to be decent quality from what I have read,not personal experience.Might be a good option vs a worn out oil-coked up used unit.
https://www.maxpeedingrods.com/category/turbocharger.html


Go read the comments, if they aren't mostly fake I'll eat the turbo.

Now copy the part number, go to Amazon and read the comments there.

They are cheap for a reason, cheaply made.

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: 360view] #3042806
05/16/22 01:45 PM
05/16/22 01:45 PM
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Kalispell Mt.
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HotRodDave Offline
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Originally Posted by 360view
A lot of good suggestions in above replys..

I would add one seldom mentioned tip:

Try to find someone near you that has a
Mazda Millenia S with its factory installed double superchargers V6 that runs on the “Miller Cycle”
and see if they would let you drive it, or do a ride along, etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazda_Millenia

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/mazda-once-made-a-225l-v6-and-its-spectacularly-complex/

https://www.newcartestdrive.com/reviews/2000-mazda-millenia/

If you are looking for a boost in fuel economy AND power
understanding the Miller Cycle
is a good way to learn how.
The Miller Cycle can run on one or two turbos, not just with double superchargers like the Millenia S.

Double superchargers are easier to program an engine computer for,
as their output depends on rpm,
and not the volume and temperature of exhaust gas varying second by second.

sample quote

This car really comes into its own when its Miller-cycle V6 is put to work. Mazda’s unique Miller-cycle engine was named one the world’s “10 Best Engines” by Ward’s, an automotive trade journal for the past four years. It uses a Lysholm compressor — a scroll-type supercharger — to boost intake pressure along with late intake-valve closing to produce an impressive amount of power without sacrificing fuel efficiency. This system allows this 2.3-liter engine to perform like a 3.3-liter engine, while still retaining the 2.3-liter engine’s economy of operation. The result is a vigorous 210-horsepower with the brawny, quick response of 210 foot-pounds of torque. The Miller-cycle package has no downside.

end quote






Maybe the original poster should mill a set of magnum heads down about .030, redrill the intake bolt holes to LA pattern, do a 3 angle valve job with nice sharp angles on the intake and polish the ex valve and use a thin steel head gasket to increase compression, air flow, valve lift, swirl, quench... all in one and all that would increase MPG TQ and HP with no turbo lag. It would not gain as much power as a turbo could but I would think 40-50 HP would not be out of the question and give a couple MPG improvement without all the hoses and piping (places for leaks) running all over under the hood making stuff hard to work on.


On a side note I been thinking about miller cycle engines and wondering how it could be done on a mopar and don't think it would be too hard, just build really high compression, get a wide LSA cam and retard the heck out of it to keep it from building so much cylinder pressure. You would get reduced overlap for a cleaner faster burn and increased expansion ratio as well as letting the combustion exert it's force on the piston till the last possible degree of rotation. The other option would be Atkins cycle but I think that would be harder to effectively build in a mopar engine with a readily available cam.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: hp383] #3043005
05/17/22 10:28 AM
05/17/22 10:28 AM
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Atlanta, GA
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mgoblue9798 Offline
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There very well could be some improvement in gas mileage in a smog dog low compression engine using a turbo in a very low boost setup with 6-7 lbs.

Just my two cents but similar efficiency gains could also be had with a set of pistons to bump compression and set up for quench.

Second option is by far the simpler way to go about it imo.

If mileage is the primary concern I would start with a 318 v/s the 360.

Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: mgoblue9798] #3043069
05/17/22 01:04 PM
05/17/22 01:04 PM
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HotRodDave Offline
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Originally Posted by mgoblue9798
There very well could be some improvement in gas mileage in a smog dog low compression engine using a turbo in a very low boost setup with 6-7 lbs.

Just my two cents but similar efficiency gains could also be had with a set of pistons to bump compression and set up for quench.

Second option is by far the simpler way to go about it imo.

If mileage is the primary concern I would start with a 318 v/s the 360.




The engine will not be under any boost the majority of the time, it will still be under vacuum under most driving conditions except now it will be working harder to pump air and exhaust through a pretty big restriction.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: HotRodDave] #3043467
05/19/22 12:58 AM
05/19/22 12:58 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,959
State of Confusion
hp383 Offline OP
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hp383  Offline OP
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I guess the turbo won't help the mpg as I thought it might. I honestly know very little about turbo setups other than a rudimentary concept of how they operate. I've heard others boast about mpg gains and thought it might be something to tinker with.

That looks to be wrong.


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Re: Budget minded, salvage yard turbo on a 360 [Re: hp383] #3043473
05/19/22 02:00 AM
05/19/22 02:00 AM
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Nor here, Nor there
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If you want MPG get a 2009+ 5,7 hemi and leave the MDS system, it'll run around in 4cyl mode a lot more often in something lighter than a new Ram or 300. If you want to boost a 360, just copy what the LS guys do.







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