Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: Mr PotatoHead]
#3018740
02/25/22 09:48 AM
02/25/22 09:48 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 215 Findlay
Ramman
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enthusiast
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Posts: 215
Findlay
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My take. Don't run it anymore until you can make pressure with the priming shaft. 1. Reassemble that pump. Checking to insure the relief valve slides smoothly. 2. Replace oil filter and add a quart of oil. 3. Try to prime it with the priming shaft. 4. If good pressure, rotate engine slowly while continuing to prime. 5. If still no pressure, add 2 more quarts of oil and retry. You're testing the oil pump pick-up crack theory. 6. If it builds good pressure, YOU"VE FOUND IT! Pull pan. See what hit the pick up and repair. Check a few rod and main bearings while you're in there. 7. If still no pressure, pull intake manifold and valley pan and look for displaced lifter.
Last edited by Ramman; 02/25/22 09:49 AM.
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Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: lancer493]
#3018757
02/25/22 10:25 AM
02/25/22 10:25 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,062 U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
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I Win
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You say the engine takes effort to turn over , pull all the plugs and spin the engine over by hand , if it's still a struggle then you have an issue somewhere inside. As far as the pump goes, the oil enters the pump then goes to the filter so anything that makes it past the pickup screen goes thru the pump before it gets trapped in the filter.
If it was my engine I'd be pulling the pan and looking inside instead of ignoring the stuck float issue that dumped more than normal amount of fuel into the cylinders. To pull the pan you need to pull out the center link , unbolt the motor mounts and raise the front of the engine a small amount to get the pan out .
Last edited by JohnRR; 02/25/22 10:26 AM.
running up my post count some more .
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Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: fal3]
#3018786
02/25/22 11:49 AM
02/25/22 11:49 AM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 253 Pasadena, Texas
fal3
OP
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OP
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 253
Pasadena, Texas
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There are grooves inside the pump where the relief spring plunger goes; cell phone camera didn't quite capture the image I wanted. When I first started this process to rotate engine, plugs were pulled and carb blocked @ WoT, but still tough to turn. This was the first filter. What I mean by that is oil pan full of gas, so I did an oil change with fresh filter (I use WIX 51515). New pump for sure. What I'm gonna do is this. The Rodeo is in town, and as usual, they brought the cold, rainy weather with them. Will be warm and sunny next week. I'm persuaded to pull the oil pan, and as recommended, check crank and rods for looseness, check the oil pick-up tube. When engine rebuilt in '97, I had machinist modify block to use a hemi 1/2" pick-up tube. I'm using a windage tray. Don't know if this is useful info. Right now, pessimistically, I think I'm looking at a short block rebuild. But, you guys have given me areas to work on that I did not realize that show some hope. If all is well with crank, rods, and pick-up, as recommended, I'll put engine together and see what happens. Alrighty, well the fun begins on Monday. Enjoy your weekend.
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Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: 3hundred]
#3019638
02/28/22 11:07 AM
02/28/22 11:07 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,220 Someplace you aren't
SomeCarGuy
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I Live Here
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Posts: 10,220
Someplace you aren't
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How big is that spring? Carter style metering rod spring? Looks pretty good for a trip down the motor.
I want my fair share
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Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: NITROUSN]
#3019662
02/28/22 12:13 PM
02/28/22 12:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,434 Omaha Ne
TJP
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I Live Here
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Omaha Ne
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Pull your fuel pump. Pictures are hard to tell but it could be off the fuel pump. Pull the motor and get it evaluated. I AGREE Or one from another pump along the way. Are the other chunks metallic? Side to side movement on the rods is normal to a point. Can't remember the specs but they're in the books. Up and down movement I would proceed with pulling a few bearing caps before giving the motor it's last rites
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Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: fal3]
#3019786
02/28/22 06:17 PM
02/28/22 06:17 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,879 S.E. Michigan
ZIPPY
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I Live Here
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Posts: 17,879
S.E. Michigan
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Have no idea where the spring came from. #6 & #8 connecting rods are loose; can move them with fingers. Any idea what is with orangish color on rods? Looks like a handy spare oil pressure relief spring in there. Hell of a place to store it. Rods are loose? Side to side or up and down? Side to side is normal. The orange color is copper plating which Chrysler did to salvage otherwise out of spec rods. They didn't like wasting parts.
Rich H.
Esse Quam Videri
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Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: 3hundred]
#3019841
02/28/22 10:01 PM
02/28/22 10:01 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,230 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,230
Bend,OR USA
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Looks like an oil pump pressure relief spring? There is no way for that spring to get into the oil pan from the pump on any Mopar BB or gen 2 hemi, NO WAY Someone drop that into the motor from the top or it got left in the motor somehow when it was being assembled. Do the loose rods push up and down or only sideways ? If only sideways your probably okay If up and down start taking the motor apart starting with those two rod caps to make sure it is not just a set of bad rod bearings scored up. Mopar would copper coat rebuilt rods or rods that had to be work on to meet their minimum specs for production engine use I've seen a ton of them over the years.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#3019843
02/28/22 10:06 PM
02/28/22 10:06 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,228 Colleyville
3hundred
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I Live Here
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Looks like an oil pump pressure relief spring? There is no way for that spring to get into the oil pan from the pump on any Mopar BB or gen 2 hemi, NO WAY That's what had me so puzzled, HTF did that get there.
'68 Fury Convertible '69 300 Convertible '15 Durango 5.7 Hemi '16 300 S Hemi
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Re: 440 oil priming mystery or is my engine seized
[Re: 3hundred]
#3019886
03/01/22 08:15 AM
03/01/22 08:15 AM
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,290 nowhere
Sniper
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master
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Posts: 6,290
nowhere
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Looks like an oil pump pressure relief spring? There is no way for that spring to get into the oil pan from the pump on any Mopar BB or gen 2 hemi, NO WAY That's what had me so puzzled, HTF did that get there. Years ago, I was swapping out a 225 for a 360 in my 72 Dart. I bought a running 79 Doda that had been hit in the left rear hard enough to S shape the leaf spring. Once I got it out of the Cordoba I put it on an engine stand and pulled the pan to look at the bearings. Based on the date codes and other pointers I was pretty sure no one had ever been in there before. I found a nut in the crankcase. Specifically a con rod nut. That engine had 17 con rods nuts inside it, 16 installed, one loose. I can only assume that during the build someone dropped a con rod nut and just grabbed another rather than find the loose one.
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