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Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: Sniper] #2986959
11/19/21 07:47 PM
11/19/21 07:47 PM
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Calgary, Alberta Canada
a12rag Offline
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Try this guy . . . . he was way helpful for me on my 64 Ford Falcon 6cyl 1bblcarb

https://carbkitsource.com/

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: Cab_Burge] #2987109
11/20/21 10:21 AM
11/20/21 10:21 AM
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Chino Valley
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Originally Posted by Cab_Burge
The accelerator check valve is put there to stop siphoning out of that circuit at cruising speeds, I found out about them the hard way back in the early 1960s on a Rochester 4GC carb on a 1957 Chevy 283 motor, it was my bosses car and he ask me to rebuild it. He ran the gas station in SO CA that I was working at.
It was my first carb. to take apart and dip it in carb cleaner that he bought and I put back together, I didn't see the check ball fall out and couldn't tell were the new one in the kit was suppose to go so I left it out realcrazy
He ended up taking it to a local professional shop that fixed it for him. I ask that guy later what was wrong with it and what it took to fix it but he wouldn't tell me rant
That was along time ago, good luck on fixing all the issues you may have up wrench up


You know you're good when you end up with extra parts! Lol.
I wonder why the mechanic wouldn't tell you what you did wrong? That's how people learn!
I'm sure this sucker will be up and running soon.
I expect I'll have to continuously work on my van though until every component is rebuilt or replaced.
I should've done this a long time ago with the carb but it always ran well enough for me to disregard it...
I'll keep posting my progress! Thanks.

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: Sniper] #2987115
11/20/21 10:44 AM
11/20/21 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Sniper
While you are in there verify the jet sizes. I had a slant 6 with a 1bbl Holley that got horrible mileage and ran poorly. It had a reman carb on it when I bought it and I put another reman on it with no change. After digging thru the manual I could on conclude the jetting was off so I cracked the warranty seal and sure enough it had a #664 jet were the book called for a #50. Bought the right jet, put it in and it made everything alright.

I looked at my go to carb parts source and they don't show that check valve though in other applications I have seen a check ball used when a check valve was shown. That might be an option for you.

https://carburetion.walkerproducts.com/holley/?


It's always run decent when it's all adjusted correctly but it's main issues were stalling when quickly acceleration in reverse or forward. I've never been able to just stomp the pedal because it would bog out so I've always had to ease into acceleration! The mileage I've gotten out of this thing is surprisingly horrible! I've been getting 8-10 mpg's and I'd like at least 12 maybe 15 but I won't get my hopes up...

I'll dig around a bit more and check on those jets, thanks! Never hurts to check... How do I find the proper jet size anyway? My Techbook has nothing on jet size!

The guy I spoke with from Mike's Carburetors suggested the possibility of a spring and ball in place of the needle style weight but wasn't suggesting the exact part or spring or weight so I got fed up and just went with what the eBay builder does... Like I explained two posts ago, if this guy is successfully rebuilding the 2210 and selling it on eBay with 100% feedback then the smaller style weight he uses must be working fine. I don't think I'll have an issue with either of the weights I ordered...

Last edited by B300 VanDanage; 11/20/21 10:56 AM.
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2987127
11/20/21 11:15 AM
11/20/21 11:15 AM
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So I found an interesting bit of info when looking up the main jets.
I live in Arizona at about a 5100ft elevation and read people mention something about swapping the jet's with either a smaller or bigger size making it run leaner or richer depending on the elevation.
What am I looking for here at 5100ft high? Do I need to run leaner or richer?
The jet's in my carb are #638 & #641.

This website(https://www.binderplanet.com/forums/index.php?threads/stock-jet-size-for-a-2210c.44145/) speaks of a #533 jet for non-California models... They also mention about 4 or 5 other sizes...

So are the jet's I have too big and too rich??
I need to do some digging on this...

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2987129
11/20/21 11:16 AM
11/20/21 11:16 AM
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the factory service manual had the jet sizes listed in it. This was for a 72 Dart and the Holley 1bbl in it used the same jets as the Holley 4bbl's. The FSM will also have a lot of other carb specs adn settings in it specificatlly for your application, rather than a more generic set from a one size fits all aftermarket manual.

Holley 553 is just a close tolerance hand selected #53 jet. But I wouldn't use 2210 specs on a 2245.

Last edited by Sniper; 11/20/21 11:19 AM.
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: a12rag] #2987334
11/20/21 10:53 PM
11/20/21 10:53 PM
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Chino Valley
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Originally Posted by a12rag
Try this guy . . . . he was way helpful for me on my 64 Ford Falcon 6cyl 1bblcarb

https://carbkitsource.com/


Thanks.

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2987369
11/21/21 02:05 AM
11/21/21 02:05 AM
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Chino Valley
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I purchased my van up in Washington state and the previous owners rebuilt the engine and I assume they may have also rebuilt the carburetor last so I would also assume they built it to run at sea level and now the van is about 5000ft higher elevation. If I understand correctly the higher the elevation the smaller the hole correct?
If my carb has what is roughly two #64 jets then I'm looking at getting something in the 50's??

Edit: I read that for every 2000ft increase you want to decrease the jet one size...
According to that scale I should get a #61 & #60... I think... Assuming whoever installed those jets did it correctly...

Last edited by B300 VanDanage; 11/21/21 11:42 AM.
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2987451
11/21/21 11:50 AM
11/21/21 11:50 AM
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Here's some more findings...

Screenshot_20211121-084826.pngScreenshot_20211121-084834.png
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2987455
11/21/21 12:03 PM
11/21/21 12:03 PM
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You need to get the factory service manual, RockAuto sells them on CD for a minimal cost, assuming you have a computer with a CD drive anymore. I had to dust off my old one and copy the files to a thumb drive.

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2987552
11/21/21 04:23 PM
11/21/21 04:23 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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At your altitude I would change it down two sizes up wrench scope wave


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: Sniper] #2987620
11/21/21 07:08 PM
11/21/21 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Sniper
You need to get the factory service manual, RockAuto sells them on CD for a minimal cost, assuming you have a computer with a CD drive anymore. I had to dust off my old one and copy the files to a thumb drive.


I do not...
I can't find it on there website...do you have the link?

Isn't what's in the picture I posted a couple posts ago out of that same manual you're talking about? It says #63 & #65 and if that's correct I'll need about two sizes down up.

Do you see that? and the one's I have are .641 & .638 so maybe the ones I have are spot on...? I still need to adjust for high altitude...

Last edited by B300 VanDanage; 11/21/21 07:20 PM.
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2987621
11/21/21 07:12 PM
11/21/21 07:12 PM
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https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/dodge,1978,b300,5.9l+360cid+v8,1075092,literature,repair+manual,10335

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: Cab_Burge] #2987622
11/21/21 07:16 PM
11/21/21 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Cab_Burge
At your altitude I would change it down two sizes up wrench scope wave



thumbs

Sounds about right.

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2988059
11/22/21 11:21 PM
11/22/21 11:21 PM
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Albany, NY
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The member whose name is actually Art
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This thread has been really educational to read, learning from troubleshooting advice and the results.

Originally Posted by B300 VanDanage
I purchased my van up in Washington state and the previous owners rebuilt the engine and I assume they may have also rebuilt the carburetor last so I would also assume they built it to run at sea level and now the van is about 5000ft higher elevation.


On this note, I bought our '67 Satellite from Golden, CO up around 5,700 ft. The seller apologized for how poorly the car ran, the plugs were all black, etc. I got it for $1,000 less than he was asking. I suspected what was "wrong" and just started driving home to NY. By the time I got to my first overnight stay in Grand Isle, NE (altitude 2,000ft) the engine was running great, and the plugs were all cleared up. The altitude made it run way rich, was all that was "wrong".

Cheers,
- Art


65 Satellite hardtop 361/4bbl console 727 2.76
67 Satellite convert 383/2bbl column 727 3.23
67 Lancia Fulvia Sport 1.3 Zagato. Alloy body, 1.3L V4 DOHC 4-spd
67 Lancia Fulvia Rallye 1.3. Alloy panel, 1.3L V4 DOHC 4-spd
71 Alfa Romeo GT Junior 1300 Zagato, 1.3L 4cyl DOHC hemi 5-spd
82 Alfa Romeo GTV6 2.5L SOHC hemi V6 5-spd transaxle
75 Maserati Bora US spec 4.9L DOHC hemi V8 5-spd ZF
77 Maserati Khamsin Euro spec 4.9L DOHC hemi V8 5-spd ZF
07 Aston Martin DB9 6.0L DOHC V12 6spd transaxle
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2988634
11/24/21 12:50 PM
11/24/21 12:50 PM
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SoCal
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Originally Posted by B300 VanDanage
Originally Posted by Sniper
While you are in there verify the jet sizes. I had a slant 6 with a 1bbl Holley that got horrible mileage and ran poorly. It had a reman carb on it when I bought it and I put another reman on it with no change. After digging thru the manual I could on conclude the jetting was off so I cracked the warranty seal and sure enough it had a #664 jet were the book called for a #50. Bought the right jet, put it in and it made everything alright.

I looked at my go to carb parts source and they don't show that check valve though in other applications I have seen a check ball used when a check valve was shown. That might be an option for you.

https://carburetion.walkerproducts.com/holley/?


It's always run decent when it's all adjusted correctly but it's main issues were stalling when quickly acceleration in reverse or forward. I've never been able to just stomp the pedal because it would bog out so I've always had to ease into acceleration! The mileage I've gotten out of this thing is surprisingly horrible! I've been getting 8-10 mpg's and I'd like at least 12 maybe 15 but I won't get my hopes up...

I'll dig around a bit more and check on those jets, thanks! Never hurts to check... How do I find the proper jet size anyway? My Techbook has nothing on jet size!

The guy I spoke with from Mike's Carburetors suggested the possibility of a spring and ball in place of the needle style weight but wasn't suggesting the exact part or spring or weight so I got fed up and just went with what the eBay builder does... Like I explained two posts ago, if this guy is successfully rebuilding the 2210 and selling it on eBay with 100% feedback then the smaller style weight he uses must be working fine. I don't think I'll have an issue with either of the weights I ordered...


Good morning B300, sorry I was absent and have been reviewing the thread. Recall that we mentioned the power piston which is operated by a vacuum connection. When the throttle is open 60 degrees there is a hole which aligns and connects the vacuum circuit, be sure this is not occluded with dirt or material. You'll need to rotate the throttle and look for the hole in the middle. This could be causing your stalls at acceleration. Replacing the cup on the accelerator pump could also be helpful

The manual I recommend is the shop manual, I have the one for the 1978 year - these were used by the dealerships and not necessarily widely available to the public at the time. Mine was available on CD off of Ebay, but the link below could be for the 1979.
https://www.factoryrepairmanuals.co...er-factory-shop-service-manual-original/

I reviewed my manual for jet size but couldn't find it, but it does indicate a difference in the power piston assembly between 2210 and the 2245 carbs but not the check weights so I assume the latter will be identical. The problem is that these two models appear to be described together in most reference material, however there are crucial differences! The sheet that you posted earlier appears to be a reference for carb rebuilding for Holley, but not sure.

I'm dismayed that Mike's carburetors hasn't been working out for you, I don't think a spring and ball will work with our setup and the weights that you ordered are a good educated guess..

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2988653
11/24/21 01:56 PM
11/24/21 01:56 PM
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B300:

You're in luck, I checked my stock and I did have a 2210 (R6452) back there. They jets are both .642 and there is a check weight. I have no way of knowing if these are the originals but there is a strong possibility. I hope this is a little helpful

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: Sniper] #2989489
11/27/21 02:17 AM
11/27/21 02:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Sniper
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/dodge,1978,b300,5.9l+360cid+v8,1075092,literature,repair+manual,10335


Thanks! I checked it out and it specifies the years 77-78 and mine's a 79', maybe that's why I couldn't find it... shruggy

Last edited by B300 VanDanage; 11/27/21 03:33 AM.
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: 67SATisfaction] #2989498
11/27/21 03:28 AM
11/27/21 03:28 AM
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Originally Posted by 67SATisfaction
This thread has been really educational to read, learning from troubleshooting advice and the results.

Originally Posted by B300 VanDanage
I purchased my van up in Washington state and the previous owners rebuilt the engine and I assume they may have also rebuilt the carburetor last so I would also assume they built it to run at sea level and now the van is about 5000ft higher elevation.


On this note, I bought our '67 Satellite from Golden, CO up around 5,700 ft. The seller apologized for how poorly the car ran, the plugs were all black, etc. I got it for $1,000 less than he was asking. I suspected what was "wrong" and just started driving home to NY. By the time I got to my first overnight stay in Grand Isle, NE (altitude 2,000ft) the engine was running great, and the plugs were all cleared up. The altitude made it run way rich, was all that was "wrong".

Cheers,
- Art


That's awesome!
I got mine for $900 plus battery and after about 50 miles the oil started getting milky! Quite the opposite of what happened to you... I assume they thought it was a cracked head or block and just didn't want to deal with it so they decided to sell it to the first "sucker" that came along... Little did they know it would work out to my benefit and was only a head gasket! Hah!
Apparently Chrysler engines starting in 1980 were made in Mexico and are notorious for cracking heads and or blocks due to the mixing of inferior metals into the casting... It just so happens that my engine was one of the last ones built in the last month(December) of the last year(1979) they made them out of pure cast iron in Canada before they moved the plant to Mexico! So I got lucky and swapped out the head gasket for about $100 or so! Sometimes it just works out! grin

Last edited by B300 VanDanage; 11/27/21 03:41 AM.
Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: B300 VanDanage] #2989572
11/27/21 01:30 PM
11/27/21 01:30 PM
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https://mymopar.com/

may not go late enough but there are service manuals and part manuals for free here.

Re: Engine not starting, carb backfires! [Re: RustyDuster] #2989877
11/28/21 03:47 PM
11/28/21 03:47 PM
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Good morning B300, sorry I was absent and have been reviewing the thread. Recall that we mentioned the power piston which is operated by a vacuum connection. When the throttle is open 60 degrees there is a hole which aligns and connects the vacuum circuit, be sure this is not occluded with dirt or material. You'll need to rotate the throttle and look for the hole in the middle. This could be causing your stalls at acceleration. Replacing the cup on the accelerator pump could also be helpful

The manual I recommend is the shop manual, I have the one for the 1978 year - these were used by the dealerships and not necessarily widely available to the public at the time. Mine was available on CD off of Ebay, but the link below could be for the 1979.
https://www.factoryrepairmanuals.co...er-factory-shop-service-manual-original/

I reviewed my manual for jet size but couldn't find it, but it does indicate a difference in the power piston assembly between 2210 and the 2245 carbs but not the check weights so I assume the latter will be identical. The problem is that these two models appear to be described together in most reference material, however there are crucial differences! The sheet that you posted earlier appears to be a reference for carb rebuilding for Holley, but not sure.

I'm dismayed that Mike's carburetors hasn't been working out for you, I don't think a spring and ball will work with our setup and the weights that you ordered are a good educated guess..




[/quote]


Hey RustyDuster! Thanks! I appreciate the info! Sorry I took so long to reply, it's the holidays and things are kinda crazy right now so I've taken a break...
I do recall you mentioning the power piston and at first I wasn't going to remove it but decided I shouldn't be so lazy since it's mostly disassembled...
I've completely disassembled the carb and removed the piston and I soaked the body for 24 hrs in PineSol... It's all I had, I live far out on a ranch in rural Arizona so I have to use what I have... I've also taken some thin wire and cleaned out all the tiny little channels and ports...

Thanks for the link, I'll look for the CD version because I can't afford $80 right now shake_head At this point I may not even need it though... From the info I've gathered so far it looks like my carb had the proper jets and I've decided on a #61 and #63 at my elevation...

Mike's actually got back to me eventually suggesting this weight(https://www.carburetor-parts.com/17-16-2.html) after telling them which weight the seller on eBay uses for their rebuilds... I don't think I'll have a problem as long as there's a steady, solid stream of fuel that comes out of there...

Yea the more common and general manuals lump the 2010 and 2045 together but don't really described the differences in detail. They may mention there's a difference but not in detail...

All that's left is to reassemble the carb and install it...

I'll be back with an update on my progress and hopefully the carb is the issue...

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