Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: sixpackman]
#2792002
07/02/20 07:29 PM
07/02/20 07:29 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,403 It's a dry heat
gtx6970
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I was thinking the same on chopping off the input shaft. The reason I'm asking is the paper that came with the bearing said you needed too?? And of coarse the engine builder kept the paperwork on it so I can't verify it.
It's a new crank to me sense my old one had welds and a crack in it. I prefer using the bearing but never have in the past and wanted a sanity check.
Thanks for the input. Measure the depth of hole in the back of the crank before you cut anything If it is deep enough you can still use the roller bearing with no issues if you so desire
Last edited by gtx6970; 07/02/20 07:30 PM.
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: sixpackman]
#2792144
07/02/20 11:58 PM
07/02/20 11:58 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,070 CA
crackedback
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If the opening in the crank is deep and wide enough to accept the input shaft pilot, no need to cut it.
You could probably get a grinder and open it up if need be.
Last edited by crackedback; 07/02/20 11:59 PM.
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: crackedback]
#2792163
07/03/20 01:49 AM
07/03/20 01:49 AM
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,753 Phila
PhillyRag
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If the opening in the crank is deep and wide enough to accept the input shaft pilot, no need to cut it.
You could probably get a grinder and open it up if need be. Probably OK with grinder, BUT ONLY if you need to increase a few thousands. Beyond that, I doubt you get a nice centered opening. That may lead to alignment issues with the mating parts.
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: PhillyRag]
#2792165
07/03/20 02:50 AM
07/03/20 02:50 AM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,070 CA
crackedback
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The pilot doesn't have to touch anything, there is no alignment issue when using the big bearing like the dakotas use. Hot dog down a hallway analogy here. Doesn't touch the walls at all. The bushing/pilot isn't in play here at all unless the OP is asking about the smaller bearing style that aligns the pilot tip. I think they are talking about the type of pilot bearing that fit in the converter register and captures the smooth section just in front of the splines, not the pilot tip like the bushing does. https://www.carid.com/1994-dodge-ram-transmission-parts/national-clutch-pilot-bearing-98317886.html
Last edited by crackedback; 07/03/20 02:56 AM.
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: crackedback]
#2792513
07/04/20 03:49 AM
07/04/20 03:49 AM
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PhillyRag
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The pilot doesn't have to touch anything, there is no alignment issue when using the big bearing like the dakotas use. Hot dog down a hallway analogy here. Doesn't touch the walls at all. So putting a steel shaft (input shaft end) into a bearing (with needle bearings); alignment isn't an issue. Since when? The bushing/pilot isn't in play here at all unless the OP is asking about the smaller bearing style that aligns the pilot tip. I think they are talking about the type of pilot bearing that fit in the converter register and captures the smooth section just in front of the splines, not the pilot tip like the bushing does. https://www.carid.com/1994-dodge-ram-transmission-parts/national-clutch-pilot-bearing-98317886.html
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: PhillyRag]
#2792775
07/04/20 08:57 PM
07/04/20 08:57 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,070 CA
crackedback
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The pilot doesn't have to touch anything, there is no alignment issue when using the big bearing like the dakotas use. Hot dog down a hallway analogy here. Doesn't touch the walls at all. So putting a steel shaft (input shaft end) into a bearing (with needle bearings); alignment isn't an issue. Since when? The bushing/pilot isn't in play here at all unless the OP is asking about the smaller bearing style that aligns the pilot tip. I think they are talking about the type of pilot bearing that fit in the converter register and captures the smooth section just in front of the splines, not the pilot tip like the bushing does. https://www.carid.com/1994-dodge-ram-transmission-parts/national-clutch-pilot-bearing-98317886.html The big bearing uses the converter register, NOT, the OEM area where the smaller bronze bushing is installed. It's why you can cut off the end of the input shaft when using the BIG bearing... If the oem crank opening is wide enough and deep enough that section is now INSIGNIFICANT to alignment and operation! hot dog in a hallway... Also why you can grind it out if you choose to do so using the dakota bearing. I used these register bearings on 360 cars all the time. The red area is where the OEM bronze captures, blue where the Big dakota bearing captures.
Last edited by crackedback; 07/04/20 09:21 PM.
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: crackedback]
#2792830
07/05/20 02:31 AM
07/05/20 02:31 AM
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,753 Phila
PhillyRag
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The pilot doesn't have to touch anything, there is no alignment issue when using the big bearing like the dakotas use. Hot dog down a hallway analogy here. Doesn't touch the walls at all. So putting a steel shaft (input shaft end) into a bearing (with needle bearings); alignment isn't an issue. Since when? The bushing/pilot isn't in play here at all unless the OP is asking about the smaller bearing style that aligns the pilot tip. I think they are talking about the type of pilot bearing that fit in the converter register and captures the smooth section just in front of the splines, not the pilot tip like the bushing does. https://www.carid.com/1994-dodge-ram-transmission-parts/national-clutch-pilot-bearing-98317886.html The big bearing uses the converter register, NOT, the OEM area where the smaller bronze bushing is installed. It's why you can cut off the end of the input shaft when using the BIG bearing... If the oem crank opening is wide enough and deep enough that section is now INSIGNIFICANT to alignment and operation! hot dog in a hallway... Also why you can grind it out if you choose to do so using the dakota bearing. I used these register bearings on 360 cars all the time. The red area is where the OEM bronze captures, blue where the Big dakota bearing captures. But the input shaft end is still inserted into the bearing. Again; alignment between those 2 parts not important?
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: PhillyRag]
#2792831
07/05/20 03:12 AM
07/05/20 03:12 AM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,070 CA
crackedback
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The pilot doesn't have to touch anything, there is no alignment issue when using the big bearing like the dakotas use. Hot dog down a hallway analogy here. Doesn't touch the walls at all. So putting a steel shaft (input shaft end) into a bearing (with needle bearings); alignment isn't an issue. Since when? The bushing/pilot isn't in play here at all unless the OP is asking about the smaller bearing style that aligns the pilot tip. I think they are talking about the type of pilot bearing that fit in the converter register and captures the smooth section just in front of the splines, not the pilot tip like the bushing does. https://www.carid.com/1994-dodge-ram-transmission-parts/national-clutch-pilot-bearing-98317886.html The big bearing uses the converter register, NOT, the OEM area where the smaller bronze bushing is installed. It's why you can cut off the end of the input shaft when using the BIG bearing... If the oem crank opening is wide enough and deep enough that section is now INSIGNIFICANT to alignment and operation! hot dog in a hallway... Also why you can grind it out if you choose to do so using the dakota bearing. I used these register bearings on 360 cars all the time. The red area is where the OEM bronze captures, blue where the Big dakota bearing captures. But the input shaft end is still inserted into the bearing. Again; alignment between those 2 parts not important? REALLY??? Way to parse the sentence and create an issue which was ANSWERED in said sentence... I'll try again and be done. I was talking about the alignment where the OEM bronze bushing would be which is NO LONGER present or needed. The alignment in the register bearing set up is just fine. Pick away if you like. Using the register style makes the OEM hole in the crank for aligning the tip a moot point. That's the hot dog down a hallway... carry on with whatever you like... LOL
Last edited by crackedback; 07/05/20 03:14 AM.
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: crackedback]
#2792916
07/05/20 11:08 AM
07/05/20 11:08 AM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 19,355 north of coder
moparx
"Butt Crack Bob"
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a question i always wanted to ask, but never did, can ALL cranks use the roller bearing, in other words, are ALL cranks machined for the torque converter snout ? not trying to muddy the waters any more than they already are, just wondering.
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Re: 340 Pilot Bushing or Bearing???
[Re: moparx]
#2792964
07/05/20 01:50 PM
07/05/20 01:50 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,403 It's a dry heat
gtx6970
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a question i always wanted to ask, but never did, can ALL cranks use the roller bearing, in other words, are ALL cranks machined for the torque converter snout ? not trying to muddy the waters any more than they already are, just wondering. As far as I know, Yes. the big register is originally for torque conv alignment so to speak it wasnt till maybe the 80s is when the roller bearing showed up for manual trans use
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