I'm contemplating getting a Hurst V Gate shifter or similar for my Dart or Road Runner but heard that there may be some fitment issues requiring the floor tunnel to be heavily modified to accommodate it. Can any of you guys with experience using one confirm this or post pics of the shifter after installation? I just want to get my ducks in a row before I go through the effort of locating and buying one. Appreciate the help. -Trent

I can dig for pics from another PC ive got but you know with the odd adapter/extension plate its not a bolt in type deal. But you be cutting as I thing they all go a bit more reward then a oem hurst type. Mine did.

They are costly the last few years and unless you really need one for some serious shifting like racing or street money racing or have a high rpm (like 7500) and deep deep gear (4.88) where your just slamming to the next gear and more or less use the clutch to launch off of imo money spent on a good hurst competition plus shifter is still the way to go.

I ran one for many years with a 833/liberty guts before going to a GF101 and "Long" v gate style shifter.

If used as intended they are not trans friendly.

Although I never looked that hard of it, a long shifter might be alot cheaper and a better it and they sure as hell work better, its not like 1971 anymore (I got a HR article of when they first came out either 70 or 71 I think and they never changed).

Way back in the day I put a Mr Gasket V Gate shifter in my Duster. It requires a lot of cutting of the tunnel. A better choice is the Hurst Ram Rod shifter much more compact and it shifted better. I still have both of those shifters. I may end up installing one in one of my projects.
The Long shifter is the best out there. I used their T handle shifter on my Jericos until they came out with the Pistol grip.

I loved the one I had and drove it on the street for several years, but you do have to cut a large chunk out of the rear section of the 4 speed hump.

if you put an A833 in your D300 it'll work nicely and put the shifter in a nice spot compared to the stock OD 4 speed shifter.


of the 17 or so Big block D100/150s I built over the years 10 of them had a V gates in them, it was the best way to deal with the awkward location of the shifter with an A833.

On your 74 RR it'll put the handle about 3 inches behind the front edge of the seat,.....but you'll thrash the floor hump....forget any console
The only A body I've had a V gate in was a 70 Duster, I used a 69 B-body trans with a Modified trans cross member and fabed up a floor hump to work.

I had one years ago and yes you have to cut a big hole for them to fit. Even 30 yeares ago, one designed for a mopar was hard to come by. I got one for a muncie and made my own linkage rods up. You have to lift the handle to reset into 1st gear, so you always have to remember where you are as you have to shift and let the vertigal gate fall to get 3rd and 4th gears. But man you can bang some gears with it. People used to think I had an automatic in the car.

Step one....... cut giant hole.

I had bought one to use with a liberty pro-shifted 833......... but I just couldn’t bring myself to cutting my totally rust free factory 4 speed floor.

So, I sold it....... along with the trans.

I would say the Mr. Gasket and Long are basically the same. I have one in my Barracuda and think it is a great drag race shifter but using it on the street in my opinion would be a real pain. Then of coarse the cutting to fit, thats up to you.

I have two right now. One is going in my Demon right now. My other one I would part with. It's a Mr. Gasket.
Let me know if your interested.

Ted

Thanks for the input guys. Much appreciated. After looking at them, it looks like the Mr. Gasket shifter is substantially larger than the Hurst version and would require more cutting. I'll probably try to round up a Hurst setup to try. Thanks again for the heads up. -Trent

Have you look at the Hurst Super Shifter 3? If not you might want to before buying any new shifter

Don't think you can buy a SSIII new any more.

I saw a couple of those guys on eBay but if I'm not mistaken, those are an "H" pattern shifter correct? I was thinking I wanted to go with an "Inline" shift pattern setup this time around which is why I was looking at the V gate and RamRod option. Also, I'm thinking I'm going to dabble with nitrous on the Road Runner so I feel like it will be a pretty busy and stressful ride at times as a rookie. Is that Super Shifter 3 a pretty slick setup?

I've used several SSIII's and there's one in my car now. It's not the shifter that makes the driver. The SSIII is a good shifter if you can find one. IIRC, the Super Shifter and the Super Shifter III are exactly the same except the III has a reverse lockout.

I've also use V-Gate shifters on the street. The only thing wrong with the V-Gate is you have to cut what I consider to be a massive hole in the floor and I hate that. Also, everybody who has one wants straight gold for them. The V-Gate is easy to drive on the street. The SSIII is about as good as it gets for a race shifter that has an H gate.

Just found a refurbished SSIII for 400 bucks on eBay. Damn. I don't think mine was that much new.

eBay is real crap shoot. I find that what people are asking for parts and what parts are actually selling for are worlds apart. Fair priced parts are out there. Just gotta keep an eye out for them when they pop up. If I had to pay some of these ridiculous eBay prices for these parts, I honestly couldn't afford to be in the hobby. Family first, then cars, just the way it is for me. -Trent

I remember being in the staging lanes at the track one time and there was a guy chatting with the owner of this 69 a12 4 speed car that was running high tens.
I don’t recall what the question was, but the answer was, “I’ve broken everything you can break from the block rearward......and a few things more than once”.

That’s the thought that comes to mind when I think: heavy car, 833, nitrous.

I have no doubt that's spot on. I should probably print your post and stick it to the dash so I can remember that somebody tried to warn me....

You can talk to people, but that doesn't mean they listen

I never ran a V gate shifter but when I raced my 66 Dart with the 833 four speed I used the Hurst Super Shifter and I did not have to cut the floor at all. It was an original 273 four speed car. Actually I never wanted the V gate as that Hurst super shifter worked awesome and I felt I could shift gers as fast as my buddies could with their V gate inline shifters. Actually I felt like I could shift faster with the Hurst super shifter then they were with their V gate shifters. I really liked that Hurst super shifter and the T handle on it instead of the ball. Ron

Here is a picture of my Road Runners floor pan, and what is needed to fit a Jerico trans with LONG shifter. You will pretty much need to do the same to fit a Hurst V gate.

The Hurst "Ram Rod" and "Super Shifter" for a B body both use the same "L" bracket and longer rods. This requires cutting a slot about 2" wide in the back of the tunnel. No other cutting is required but I have seen some real hack jobs. Now you have to figure what to cover all that mechanism with. Back in the day, Hurst made these just for that purpose and provided a template to match the floor lines.

NOTE: the large hole in the floor as seen in the above post is not necessary with an a833 and these shifters. Also, the original hole in the top of the tunnel is still required. In 1974 these were $80. through a speed shop. I still have a couple and have tossed around reproducing them but haven't got around to it yet.

I should mention this is a '69 B body.

I ran a Hurst V gate in my GTX for years, loved it, no more missed 3rd gear shifts. Now, with my GTX restored, including repairing the hole I cut in the floor pan and reinstalling the factory shifter and console, I remember why I changed to the V gate...jeez this factory shifter sucks, already tired of hitting my knuckles on the dash trying to grab 3rd

Then you need to do what I did, to my Dads Super Bee. I installed a new Comp Plus mechanism, and then made my own shift Rods with heim joints. It cuts the throw down by half.

Another view.

My brain is not grasping how that reduces the throw by 50%...the levers on the trans are still required to move the same amount fore and aft...is the difference in the shifter?

And how does all that clear the tunnel and all the crap in the way down there?

Tolerance stack. When you see how much slop the stock style parts have, and the non positive stop, the shift lever multiplies that slop. Trust me, it's a night and day difference.

Everything fits the stock tunnel. No way I'd ever go back to stock stuff.

What are you using for a shift lever? Of course I'm using the stock lever that comes over and up towards the driver's thigh...lol...looks like this

Using the exact same shifter handle.

50% is a lot of "tolerance stack" !!! I suspect the majority of that 50% is from longer levers on the shifter mechanism.

What size tubing is that? I may give that a shot if you got it in there without hacking stuff out.

The biggest PITA will be buying a left handed tap, and that's a phone call to MDS or whoever I buy that crap from.

X2 if those tubes help that significantly I'd be down to build a set also.

[quote=madscientist
What size tubing is that? I may give that a shot if you got it in there without hacking stuff out.

The biggest PITA will be buying a left handed tap, and that's a phone call to MDS or whoever I buy that crap from. [/quote]

1/2" tubing. I just used RH threads. Set it on the bench, and forget about it. IF I needed to make an adjustment, just loosen up one side of it, and turn it a turn or so, but it has been rock steady since being installed. I just bought heim joints on eBay, and went from there.

1/2" tubing. I just used RH threads. Set it on the bench, and forget about it. IF I needed to make an adjustment, just loosen up one side of it, and turn it a turn or so, but it has been rock steady since being installed. I just bought heim joints on eBay, and went from there. [/quote]


Cool. So I'm ASSuming that you used 3/8x3/8 hiem joints??? I already have enough LH taps that I'll make mine LH/RH and call it good.

That is correct.

My 2 cents-

1) V gates are kind of cool in a Fonzi way however not necessary for full throttle, clutch assisted gear changes in a race prepped a-833. Pro-shift, face-plate, whatever.

2) The thing that is missing from the Hurst Comp plus is a reverse lockout. Like most other things these days all of the hardware/linkage is cheesy. If yours doesn't have them you need the for/aft limited bolts.

3) IF I was going to cut my mint factory 4-speed tunnel (I hacked the hell out out of mine) I'd be looking at a Long shifter instead of a Hurst. I never looked into them for a long time and it's literally night and day IMO. As Jeff said go with the turbing or at least 7/16" solid steel rod.

OR

IF I was going to leave the factory 4-speed hump I'd call Passon and see if he has any parts to convert a new comp plus shifter to a reverse lockout. He was able to hook me up with one a few years back.


4) IF you are going to nitrous and a manual trans I'd start a thread on it, there are many ways to skin that cat.

The Hurst "Super Shifter" is a an H pattern shifter with reverse lockout. Although mine is on the L bracket and has longer rods that requires cutting the tunnel I see no reason it can't be bolted to the trans like a stock shifter and use shorter rods.



Using all RH threads you're "lucky" if you get the adjustment bang on (but close is probably good enough). With LH and RH threads the adjustment is infinite whereas with only RH threads adjustment is limited to the width of a thread

May as well use aluminum tubing while you're at it - or aluminum hex rod.

The Super Shifter does not have a reverse lockout. The Super Shifter does have a reverse lockout.

If you are referring to the red t-handle that pulls up to lock out reverse we are on the same page. They don't make those anymore as far as I know.

Correct. That's a Super Shifter III. I did see some remans on eBay but they want pretty good money for them.

The Super Shifter Three I had in a 1968 Baracuda in 1974 or 1975 didn't have that lever, I think I needed to push the shifter lever straight down in neutral and then move the shifter handle into reverse to the left and up towards the motor
I think the Hurst Ram Rod shifters and some of the Mr. Gasket shifters had push down or pull up levers like that for reverse, maybe not

??? Make up your mind !!

The Hurst "Ram-4" looks like it would work but I tried to race one with a slicked up Hemi box and I prefer the Super Shifter III or a Long V-gate .
My favorite was Long V-gate and Heim joint linkage.

I purchased my tubing from Liberty Gears and the heims from Long.

I also used a Long V-gate on my Richmond with Face-plate gears from Liberty and it was so much fun to do full throttle power shifts never missing a gear.

Spend the money on a Long shifter for a V-gate or look for a NASCAR Hurst shifter or "good used" Super Shifter III if you want an "H" pattern deal

Gus

The junk [censored] iPad decided to remove the III I typed. I've posted several times how it was, but I'll do it again for the crowd that wasn't there to live through the era or have reading issues.

The SUPER SHIFTER does NOT have a lock out lever, and AFAIK never did.

The SUPER SHIFTER III does have a reverse lock out lever, and AFAIK always did.

It's that simple. There are guys who swear on their mothers grave they had a SUPER SHIFTER III without a reverse lockout but I've never seen one. Ever.

^^^^well instead of listening to somebody who doesn't even have a car^^^^
I can tell you I absolutely love my vertigate. I never had a second to third shift any faster than slamming straightforward! I took it out thinking I just wanted the ball shifter for Comfort but now I miss that 3rd gear bang..

Also yeah I cut a little chunk out of that hump and just saved it and weld it back in and now I'll just cut the line back out again no big deal it's just a little piece. At least for my 73 a body.

I have a picture of the cut out but I haven't learnded how to post pictures...? Also of my Hurst v-gate and homemade linkage. It will be a winter project, but I know I'll enjoy having it back in.

I have a picture of the cut out but I haven't learnded how to post pictures...? Also of my Hurst v-gate and homemade linkage. It will be a winter project, but I know I'll enjoy having it back in. I also have a diagram of the special bracket you need to adapt it to an a body. A member of another forum dropped one on a piece of paper and traced it for me. The original was a cast aluminum but I just made mine out of a thin piece of Steel. It works great. Possibly a couple grams heavier than the original LOL

My Challenger tunnel was cut a long time ago and I have had most shifters in the car but the one I prefer is the Mr. Gasket Vertical gate shifter. I use the B Body V Gate shifter in my E Body. I prefer that location over all other shifters.

I was using a V-Gate shifter while you were still sucking your thumb.

Don't you have a snowmobile to waste time with?

In what? You got to have a car to have a vertigate don't you?

If you are THAT lonely, you can always call me.

Yes I have a car. It will never get a V-Gate because I'm not going to put a big hole in the tunnel.

Still driving my car mostly every day. The weather is beautiful, except it's in the low 20's at night.

Practice up. You'll need it.

Never happened...

All clear

1) Hit the newbie thread!

2) Use punctuation. I'm not Jack Kerouac.

3) Post a link so we don't have to read your run-on sentence of a story.

4) Welcome to Moparts! Please read the forum rules before posting and make sure to have fun with your new friends.

Happy Friday gang! : D

How do you post pictures??
I can shed first hand light on this subject with pictures.
As a matter of fact like I said I'm going to reinstall the vertigate this winter so I can do step by step cutting out the hole again and everything but I like to be able to do it with pictures. Also if anybody needs the blueprints to the adapter plate for an a body, not a problem.

When you post there is a little File Manager link that allows you to upload pictures. You "choose", then attach, then "done". The catch is pictures can't be too large.

A shot of my shifter body (from Passon, with rev. lockout purchased circa 2014?ish) and the comparison shot of a Long vs. the Competition Plus.

I have the Long HB1000s H-pattern shifter mounted in my 69 RR. I modified the Long mounting pad and welded the Long pad to the A833 shifter mounting pad. The Long shifter is in the same position as the original Hurst.

I also had custom operating levers made that are shorter than the original, in an effort to shorten the shifter throw. The 1-2 and the 3-4 operating levers were machined to be the same length hole to hole.

The unfortunate result of the Long h-pattern shifter is a noticeably longer throw than the original Hurst shifter even with the custom shorter operating levers. Furthermore, the 1-2 shifter throw and 3-4 shifter throw on the Long shifter are the same length, thus creating a problem when adjusting the shifter stop bolts. The Hurst shifter throws are different in length between the 1-2 and the 3-4, correlating with different length operating lever lengths original to the A833.

One last thing, The Long H-pattern shifter is not friendly to a fast and hard 2-3 shift. My opinion is for an h-pattern the Hurst is a superior choice on an A833.

I have a picture of a Hurst RamRod in my Dart, but can't get it to resize to post. I am taller and have long arms, so the shifter sits a little farther ahead than it was intended to. I actually cut and rewelded the mounting bracket for it making it shorter and altered the shifter linkage length to make it fit a little better.

See if this works.

Does anyone know the Part# for the inline "Long" Shifter that would be most applicable to an 833 by chance? Thanks! -Trent

Flipped it over for ya......

They may be able to customize one for you but the one I used on an 833 came off a Jerico 4-speed box. I had to custom make the brackets and make my own tubular linkage with heim joints on the forward gears. I used a Hurst reverse rod from a supershifter.
I don't think they offer a "kit" to mount one to a Mopar box

Gus