Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: ireland383]
#210639
02/16/09 01:13 PM
02/16/09 01:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows?
1_WILD_RT
Management Trainee
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Management Trainee
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 27,347
Today? Who Knows?
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Quote:
I will have the blocked decked. One concern now is the cam selection because I'm keeping the 3.23's for now, but will soon be switching to the 3.91's or even 3.73's.
The term you need to use when speaking to your machist is Zero Deck the Pistons.. If you just tell him to deck the block he'll take a light pass to true the gasket surface, he needs to acurately know what your looking for...
As you already mentioned the camshaft selection is very important, I would suggest a Crower 271HDP it sfecs out with 222/234 duration .050 .486/.496 lift & 112 centers It's a good cam for a 383, I've got two friends running them & I plan to put one in my 383 next time I tear into it...
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: cptn60]
#210641
02/16/09 10:11 PM
02/16/09 10:11 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 426 Califor-ni-A!
MrFoFody
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 426
Califor-ni-A!
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AS others have pointed out, don't go to big on the cam. When I rebuilt (re-ringed) my 383 a couple of years back, I put in the 509 because I wanted that prostock idle and I wanted to kill a little torque for the street (4spd, less wheel spin). It was fun romping around with that choppy idle but the power band dosn't kick in untill around 3000rpms. My build is: -.040 383 w/factory style flat tops & slighty decked. 9.10 calculated compression. -516 heads, 2.14-1.81 valves, bowls ported and blended & straightened out exhaust ports. cced @ 72cc. Shim gaskets -Holly SD w/800dp I know it's too big but all I had available and some old school Jardine headers. The car has a 4spd and 3.91 gears so it makes the cam livable on the street. I'm either going to change the cam to a 528 solid or swap the gears to 4.30-4.56 for some extra zip in the street light grand prix.
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: 64Post]
#210643
02/17/09 09:19 AM
02/17/09 09:19 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098 A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
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Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
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Quote:
John, I'm not doubting Dwayne made the number, I just don't think it was as mild of a build as was let on.
My combo FWIW:
383 block .030+ By CRE 3.915 crank. 450 cid 12.3:1 static cr (10cc domes; .004/.005 below deck MCH ported Eddys milled to 82 cc's-- we all know the numbers, plus I had them locally flowed. Jeff's numbers are a hair conservative. Comp Custom solid cam= .261/.266 @ .050 .578/.585 gross lift Eddy RPM intake 950HP worked by Biggs 1 3/4 Headers
HP? Unknown at this time. Might get it on the dyno in the spring...
I never said it was mild , it was built to be a LEGAL NHRA stock engine , built to blueprint spec with a stock lift cam . NHRA only calls out lift in the cam spec , you can get as wild on the cam duration as you please , he got a little long on the duration and had NEGATIVE piston to valve clearance .
I'm building a similar engine as you same compression smaller cam , except it will have 906's on it flow is unknown by me.
I'm told it'll be hard pressed to make 500hp with stock manifolds ...
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: ireland383]
#210644
02/17/09 09:24 AM
02/17/09 09:24 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098 A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
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Quote:
I will have the blocked decked. One concern now is the cam selection because I'm keeping the 3.23's for now, but will soon be switching to the 3.91's or even 3.73's.
wait till you figure out what piston you THINK you want to run , if he gets you a piston that is .100 in the hole you DO NOT want to cut that off the deck .
I would consider dropping the extra coin and get a piston to fit a block that was just skimmed to get it back to square .
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: 71383beep]
#210645
02/17/09 09:32 AM
02/17/09 09:32 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098 A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
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Quote:
I agree that they do not take much to get them going, but it seems that good compression is crucial in achieving it. Selecting cams and bolting on intakes and heads only works in fantasy land unless the motor had zero deck pistons to start with. My first builder just put in the pistons cleaned the deck and bolted on monstrous 906 open chambers...and gave me a motor that would not hold a tune to save its life.
It takes more than a zero deck piston to get compression in a stock stroke 383 , the small bore is the killer. Doing the math on factory built 383's you BARELY get 9.3 compression out of a CLAIMED 10.0 factory spec , the pistons have to be poking out of the deck .020 AND the heads cut down to 79.5 vs the as delivered 90-92 cc. or you have to stick a 10cc - 12 cc dome on the piston which gets in the way of proper flame travel .
I wish KB made a step head piston for the 383 like they do the 440 and 400 instead of that POS KB162 , that would go a LONG way toward helping the 383 builder .
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: cdp]
#210648
02/17/09 09:50 AM
02/17/09 09:50 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098 A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
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Quote:
So John, are you saying they didn't make the 450 like they claim in the Moparmuscle/Westech article? I was unaware of this if thats the case.
I need to see the original build of the engine and I need to know WHEN that engine was run at Westech . 450 is definitely possible , but I'm curious as to the compression ratio of that engine .
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: JohnRR]
#210651
02/17/09 12:23 PM
02/17/09 12:23 PM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,167 CT
GTX MATT
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,167
CT
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Quote:
Quote:
So John, are you saying they didn't make the 450 like they claim in the Moparmuscle/Westech article? I was unaware of this if thats the case.
I need to see the original build of the engine and I need to know WHEN that engine was run at Westech . 450 is definitely possible , but I'm curious as to the compression ratio of that engine .
John the compression was supposed to be 9.2:1. It was a September 2002 issue. I would have guessed the engine made 400-420 horse, they dynoed it at [Email]455@6000[/Email] rpm, which was the highest rpm tested. I thought the dyno doesn't lie I guess they must have done it but I've always been skeptical, it just seems a little to easy to make 450 horse with a 383 after reading the article. Maybe a happy dyno is the reason. Heres the article, let us know if the dyno was happy or not.
http://compcams.com/Community/Articles/Details.asp?ID=1111284973
Last edited by GTX MATT; 02/17/09 12:23 PM.
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: GTX MATT]
#210652
02/17/09 01:05 PM
02/17/09 01:05 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098 A Banana Republic near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,098
A Banana Republic near you.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
So John, are you saying they didn't make the 450 like they claim in the Moparmuscle/Westech article? I was unaware of this if thats the case.
I need to see the original build of the engine and I need to know WHEN that engine was run at Westech . 450 is definitely possible , but I'm curious as to the compression ratio of that engine .
John the compression was supposed to be 9.2:1. It was a September 2002 issue. I would have guessed the engine made 400-420 horse, they dynoed it at [Email]455@6000[/Email] rpm, which was the highest rpm tested. I thought the dyno doesn't lie I guess they must have done it but I've always been skeptical, it just seems a little to easy to make 450 horse with a 383 after reading the article. Maybe a happy dyno is the reason. Heres the article, let us know if the dyno was happy or not.
http://compcams.com/Community/Articles/Details.asp?ID=1111284973
The info about Westech being HAPPY came out in 2004 ( it came out after the we did the Enginemasters in 2003) , the numbers in that article ARE INFLATED .
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: ireland383]
#210654
02/17/09 08:42 PM
02/17/09 08:42 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,716 Baltimore/Denver
64Post
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,716
Baltimore/Denver
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Quote:
That's is ok for all the posts more info helps. I should be getting a call from the builder today or Wednesday and will post what he finds when he opens the motor. Thanks
I'm really curious as to his shop charges. All of those $50-$100 machining steps add up real quick, unless you short cut a few things. How much is he going to charge for the assembly?
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Re: Help me with 383 upgrade!
[Re: ireland383]
#210656
02/17/09 10:44 PM
02/17/09 10:44 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,152 Central NC
gch
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,152
Central NC
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Quote:
Will the .528 cam affect the vacuum since I have power brakes,vacuum secondaries, and distributor?
The .528 should have enough vacuum to run these accessories.At worst you could install a vacuum cannister but I don't think it will be needed.
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