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727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? #192006 01/13/09 12:15 AM 01/13/09 12:15 AM
Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 793 Utah topbrent OP super stock
topbrent OP super stock Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 793 Utah	As the title states... What is the average HP loss difference between a basic bracket prepped powerglide and a basic performance manual VB 727. Or put a different way...how much less power does a Powerglide eat vs a 727. Let's not make this a comparison between PG's and a super-man 727 with every trick known to man...or a pro-trans 904 stuffed into a 727's shorts. Basic 727 to basic powerglide. Also, does anyone know the weight difference between a 'glide and a 727? What does a 727(no converter) dry weigh? PG's weigh around 95-100 lbs, I think.

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: topbrent] #192007 01/13/09 01:06 AM 01/13/09 01:06 AM
Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI MR_P_BODY Master
MR_P_BODY Master Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI	I seen some info on this a few years back and if I recall the glide used the least amount of power and the 727 was 2nd worst(the ford trans was worst) and I want to say there was 35hp difference between the glide and 727

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #192008 01/13/09 01:42 AM 01/13/09 01:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,826 las vegas 70AARcuda master
70AARcuda master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,826 las vegas	powerglide....18 hp 904...........24 hp c4............24 hp 727 ..........45 hp 400 ..........45 hp c6.............63 hp this is what i remember... Tony 70 AARCuda Vitamin C 71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield) 71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas) 71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: 70AARcuda] #192009 01/13/09 09:00 AM 01/13/09 09:00 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,999 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw... gregsdart master
gregsdart master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,999 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...	It would be fun to do a real honest test of this, and i think the only way would be to use a stock glide, a stock 727, then run a given amount of torque through them and see just how much torque is measured coming out. That way it could be converted to a percentage and be given for each gear, which i think is important. Weight differance should be about fifty pounds stock, thirty totally moded 727? 8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: gregsdart] #192010 01/13/09 09:05 AM 01/13/09 09:05 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,573 ...gently down the stream LAR_414 master
LAR_414 master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,573 ...gently down the stream	I wonder how much HP a 833 manual trans uses, compared to the automatics

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: gregsdart] #192011 01/13/09 12:24 PM 01/13/09 12:24 PM
Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 411 Portersville, Pa 1badx mopar
1badx mopar Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 411 Portersville, Pa	If someone has the transmissions and a test vehicle and willing to do the swap I'll provide some help, the lift, tools and dyno at no charge. I'm also interested in the REAL answer to this question.....

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: 1badx] #192012 01/13/09 01:00 PM 01/13/09 01:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,801 McGregor,Iowa 52157 5 500ciDuster top fuel
500ciDuster top fuel 5 Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,801 McGregor,Iowa 52157	I thought I had read that the 904 was 27 & 727 was 37,would be nice to see real numbers that were recent. Mitch

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: topbrent] #192013 01/13/09 04:36 PM 01/13/09 04:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,801 Rio Linda, CA John_Kunkel Too Many Posts
John_Kunkel Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,801 Rio Linda, CA	These numbers are from an article in Car Craft Magazine. Powerglide_____18 hp TH-350________36 hp TH-400________44 hp Ford_C-6______55-60 hp Ford_C-4______28 hp Ford_FMX______25 hp Chrysler_A904__25 hp Chrysler_727___45 hp The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: John_Kunkel] #192014 01/13/09 04:39 PM 01/13/09 04:39 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,826 las vegas 70AARcuda master
70AARcuda master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,826 las vegas	i was close...LOL was doing them off of memory... Tony 70 AARCuda Vitamin C 71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield) 71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas) 71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: 1badx] #192015 01/13/09 08:03 PM 01/13/09 08:03 PM
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 487 Charleston, SC S SCDaytona mopar
SCDaytona mopar S Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 487 Charleston, SC	Quote: If someone has the transmissions and a test vehicle and willing to do the swap I'll provide some help, the lift, tools and dyno at no charge. I'm also interested in the REAL answer to this question..... Since you are planning to do this in a car, how do you plan to get a glide converter and a 727 converter to be exactly the same to make this test accurate?

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: SCDaytona] #192016 01/13/09 08:38 PM 01/13/09 08:38 PM
Joined: Apr 2004 Posts: 976 Woodstock , Georgia Mopar_racer_99 super stock
Mopar_racer_99 super stock Joined: Apr 2004 Posts: 976 Woodstock , Georgia	I know this sounds stupid but I believe there is such a thing as a transmission dyno for testing trannies.ie you wouldnt need a convertor just drives off a electric motor I believe. 8.72 @ 154.6 ,68 Charger 578ci 440-1s, 3000# w/drvr, 2150 den/alt NA

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: SCDaytona] #192017 01/13/09 10:20 PM 01/13/09 10:20 PM
Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 411 Portersville, Pa 1badx mopar
1badx mopar Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 411 Portersville, Pa	Quote: Since you are planning to do this in a car, how do you plan to get a glide converter and a 727 converter to be exactly the same to make this test accurate? Good point! So much for that idea......

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: Mopar_racer_99] #192018 01/13/09 10:31 PM 01/13/09 10:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 487 Charleston, SC S SCDaytona mopar
SCDaytona mopar S Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 487 Charleston, SC	Quote: I know this sounds stupid but I believe there is such a thing as a transmission dyno for testing trannies.ie you wouldnt need a convertor just drives off a electric motor I believe. Bingo. We have a winner. It has already been done and the numbers posted probably came from this kind of testing.

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: SCDaytona] #192019 01/14/09 01:30 AM 01/14/09 01:30 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 296 Ontario Canada H Hutch enthusiast
Hutch enthusiast H Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 296 Ontario Canada	Its almost impossible to accurately answer this question. In the past some numbers were issued to it but how they came up with the numbers is beyond me. There are too many variables, including converter design , converter charge circuits, trans ratio , axle ratio, vehicle weight , motor max RPM, shift rpm. Some transmissions in some applications will take more power to run but you can't just say its 20hp VS a glide, no way. The losses will be greater if the parts used in the trans are a larger diameter , so all we can say for sure is the smaller the diameter of the parts used , the less power the transmission will require to run and thats about as far as it goes. Don't assume that because one trans is heavier than another , that its all rotating weight either. The powerglide is an efficient design and the internals come to speed progressively ,all 3 speeds have anti rotation to deal with (parts have to reverse then stop then start again) for a shift sequence and that takes time and power to do. Hutch

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: Hutch] #192020 01/14/09 10:19 AM 01/14/09 10:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,999 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw... gregsdart master
gregsdart master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,999 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...	Quote: Its almost impossible to accurately answer this question. In the past some numbers were issued to it but how they came up with the numbers is beyond me. There are too many variables, including converter design , converter charge circuits, trans ratio , axle ratio, vehicle weight , motor max RPM, shift rpm. Some transmissions in some applications will take more power to run but you can't just say its 20hp VS a glide, no way. The losses will be greater if the parts used in the trans are a larger diameter , so all we can say for sure is the smaller the diameter of the parts used , the less power the transmission will require to run and thats about as far as it goes. Don't assume that because one trans is heavier than another , that its all rotating weight either. The powerglide is an efficient design and the internals come to speed progressively ,all 3 speeds have anti rotation to deal with (parts have to reverse then stop then start again) for a shift sequence and that takes time and power to do. Hutch Hutch, thanks for the great input. A lot of us forget the little details(!) like reverse rotation, shaft diameters, circuitry, converter type and from what i have read the ability to build a better converter for a glide due to space limitations that plague a torqueflite. All in all, both have a place. In your opinion, what would be the most efficient three or more speed system (high $$ OK) to build? Lenco with converter? similar? 8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky

Re: 727 / Powerglide: Parasitic HP loss differences? [Re: gregsdart] #192021 01/15/09 12:49 AM 01/15/09 12:49 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 296 Ontario Canada H Hutch enthusiast
Hutch enthusiast H Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 296 Ontario Canada	Quote: Hutch, A lot of us forget the little details(!) like reverse rotation, shaft diameters, circuitry, converter type and from what i have read the ability to build a better converter for a glide due to space limitations that plague a torqueflite. All in all, both have a place. In your opinion, what would be the most efficient three or more speed system (high $$ OK) to build? Lenco with converter? similar? If you were not restricted , the most efficient would be to use a converter drive with a Liberty. There are a few designs of converter drives out there and I really can't give any of them the thumbs up but a Bruno can be reworked to perform well. Hutch Last edited by Hutch; 01/15/09 12:51 AM.

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