Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: rumblebee4232]
#1753917
02/16/15 04:39 PM
02/16/15 04:39 PM
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Posts: 512 Niwot, CO Formerly denn...
dynorad
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mopar
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There are two circuits involved here. One is a "low current" that goes through the ignition switch. The other is a high current that passes through the starter relay/solenoid. Have a helper test the voltage at the terminal from the ignition switch while you try to start. The most likely culprit is a low battery, followed by the switch or the bulkead connector. If that voltage is fine, have your helper test the battery voltage while you are cranking. If the battery voltage is fine, check the voltage on the terminals also while cranking. If good test the starter terminal while cranking. If the voltage is good at the starter terminal replace the starter or the starter solenoid. Also ensure that your ground from engine to battery is good and that you have the engine grounded properly to the body.
Last edited by dynorad; 02/16/15 04:48 PM.
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: dynorad]
#1753918
02/16/15 05:08 PM
02/16/15 05:08 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,584 MD
p d'ro
pro stock
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pro stock
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Quote:
There are two circuits involved here. One is a "low current" that goes through the ignition switch. The other is a high current that passes through the starter relay/solenoid. Have a helper test the voltage at the terminal from the ignition switch while you try to start. The most likely culprit is a low battery, followed by the switch or the bulkead connector. If that voltage is fine, have your helper test the battery voltage while you are cranking. If the battery voltage is fine, check the voltage on the terminals also while cranking. If good test the starter terminal while cranking. If the voltage is good at the starter terminal replace the starter or the starter solenoid. Also ensure that your ground from engine to battery is good and that you have the engine grounded properly to the body.
Can he jump the solenoid like I used to on my GM? Good old screwdriver touching terminals together?
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: p d'ro]
#1753919
02/16/15 05:39 PM
02/16/15 05:39 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 21 New Zealand
Wiggy
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Jumping the terminals sounds exciting I guess with the 12v going to the large terminal on the starter being constant and the smaller terminal being just in front, it would be easy to bridge the two with a screwdriver. This I guess bypasses the starter relay? If you read up a bit, I did test the starter (both terminals) during ignition and the main 12v feed dropped slightly and the smaller one that has nothing going to it to start with got around 11.5v when the key is turned. This to me suggests the electrics are working ok, I've checked the grounds, I even installed a second battery to body ground and I might add another engine to body ground as well (can't have too many grounds...hehe). I think the starter is at fault here, the fact that it jumps out but doesn't engage the flywheel wheel means its kinda working but just not energizing properly? The annoying thing is, I've had the car for over 3 years and its always cranked over, up until the back end of last year anyway. I had this problem once before where it just clicked but the next time I tried, it turned over. This time however, nothing and I've been trying and trying hoping it would just go. I plan to remove the starter this week, I will bench test then to see what happens.
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: Wiggy]
#1753920
02/16/15 06:31 PM
02/16/15 06:31 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,848 Memphis
HemiRick
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If the bendix is jumping out and the starter is not turning the contacts in the solenoid are not working.....time for a starter or new contacts....
Take care, Rick 68 Coronet R/T 440 & 68 Charger 528 Hemi,and 5 Challengers! 6 cyl, 318, 360, 383, 451
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: skicker]
#1753922
02/16/15 07:21 PM
02/16/15 07:21 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 21 New Zealand
Wiggy
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If you have narrowed it down to the starter do yourself a favor and hit the starter a few times with a BFH. I've had them turn over and work for months after that. If it doesn't work oh well your going to swap it out anyway.
Yeah sadly I've tried the hitting it method from above and below, while my wife turned the key to try and help it but zip I'll remove and check it out, the starter looks new so maybe its just because it's been sat not doing much for a few years while I restored it?
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: Wiggy]
#1753923
02/17/15 08:06 PM
02/17/15 08:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 512 Niwot, CO Formerly denn...
dynorad
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What is the voltage between the big terminal on the starter and battery negative post while cranking? Then check voltage from the big terminal to the engine block while cranking and let us know what the voltage is.
Last edited by dynorad; 02/17/15 08:08 PM.
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: dynorad]
#1753924
02/20/15 12:10 AM
02/20/15 12:10 AM
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Joined: Feb 2015
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Wiggy
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Missed that last comment and went and removed it from the car after a lot of swearing trying to get it round the exhaust header. Anyway, bench test revealed it still doesn't work!! It just clicks as it did on the car, kinda jumps out a bit but goes right back in, no spinning like it should. The annoying thing is, the starter looks new, I stripped the solenoid to check the brushes and they look fine, all the inside looks OK. Is there anything in particular I should check on the inside of the starter or solenoid? As previously mentioned the car was part restored when I got it, which probably explains the almost new looking starter but if this was an aftermarket replacement perhaps its not up to the standard of the original? I tested by fixing the negative terminal on the battery to the body of the starter via a battery cable and then the positive from the battery going to both small and large terminals, all I get it click click and a few small arc sparks from the battery as I touch it on. Clueless
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: Wiggy]
#1753926
02/20/15 12:16 AM
02/20/15 12:16 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
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Open it up further. The solenoid ain't moving far enough for the large terminal to get continuity to the armature for the whole shebang to engage. Go further/you'll see what's fubared. EDIT If you're in a rush, what Skicker said, toss another one (reg or mini) in there & be up & running. plenty of parts over there?
Last edited by RapidRobert; 02/20/15 12:19 AM.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: Wiggy]
#1753931
02/20/15 04:32 AM
02/20/15 04:32 AM
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Posts: 21 New Zealand
Wiggy
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quick movie showing what happens Push solenoid down manually, motor spins up no probs. Join contacts of two terminals and the solenoid activates and pulls down the center tube, which connects the copper washer but the motor doesn't spin up? Confused??? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1R0hkdkCa4k
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Re: Starting problems 71 Challenger
[Re: Wiggy]
#1753932
02/20/15 04:51 AM
02/20/15 04:51 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,848 Memphis
HemiRick
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Cant see movie it's private it says
Your symptoms indicate no contact across the round copper washer and 2 contacts on either side.....Are the surfaces clean?
Take care, Rick 68 Coronet R/T 440 & 68 Charger 528 Hemi,and 5 Challengers! 6 cyl, 318, 360, 383, 451
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