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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: BradH]
#1729697
01/14/15 11:21 PM
01/14/15 11:21 PM
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 700
Southern Alberta
Uberpube
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 700
Southern Alberta
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Quote:
I'm looking seriously into a flowbench upgrade, like something that can pull 450+ cfm @ a real 28" H2O test pressure, instead of relying on major correction factors like I have to use w/ my current bench.
So, that got me wondering about other people are into this type of car stuff as a hobby who also have set themselves up w/ what would otherswise be considered "overkill" professional-level equipment, tools, etc.
Anybody else want to jump in to help me rationalize this more easily? 
What forced my hand to buy tools, was that locally, I really didn't trust the shops that had the tools, they just didn't seem to have the ability to do things to the level that I would have expected of a "pro" shop. Also, when you have to rely on others, it does put you onto their time schedule, work ethic etc. I have the ability to do things, so it just makes it easier to do things myself. Plus I have direct control over the quality of the work if I do it myself.
I started into the car hobby originally with a sawzall, 5hp compressor and a oxyacetylene set. When I realized I could do the work, but was tool limited , it kind of exploded, as one tool either compliments or requires another to take the work to the next step. And then it goes into " why should I take this here and wait 6 weeks, when I could buy this tool to finish what I already started with my other tools."Or the service you require is more than what the tools end costing.
What really blew it wide open was a quote for 3000.00 to do the required stainless and aluminum welding on my first turbo car. I bought a new Miller synchrowave 180 for 2800 instead. Then I spent some time at some car shops in Japan to learn the finer points of tuning, and I discovered the usefulness of real machine tools in automotive applications. Lathes and what not before were just for machine shops, after seeing what could be built I was hooked and it just sort of pushed me to learn more, and of course buy more. I am pretty much self sufficient for most things now, and I really wouldn't have it any other way.
A partial run down of collection
Dynojet 224xlc loading chassis dyno
marquette scope and engine analyzer
Vertical Bandsaw
Horizontol Bandsaw
Chin Hung 430x1100 Lathe
National 12x36 Lathe
Vertical Knee mill
14000 lb 4 post hoist
6000 lb scissor hoist
Miller 350p Mig
Hypertherm plasma cutter
Dynasty 200 tig
5 ton press
Hand tools and diagnostic stuff out the ying yang..but you get the idea.
The problem is my new shop I built 2 years ago, is already to small.
I've been thinking about a flow bench to for a while.
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1729698
01/14/15 11:27 PM
01/14/15 11:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,392
nielsville, minn.
quickd100
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,392
nielsville, minn.
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If I can build or fabricate it I do. Some things you just have to bite the bullet and buy. I've got a 16" swing x 48" lathe, and vertical mill, gas, arc, mig, and tig welders, a press break, and a hoist. The dyno was the best thing I've ever bought. I learned more with it in 1 month than 30 years of backyard and dragstrip testing.Dave 
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: quickd100]
#1729699
01/14/15 11:36 PM
01/14/15 11:36 PM
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 700
Southern Alberta
Uberpube
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 700
Southern Alberta
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Quote:
If I can build or fabricate it I do. Some things you just have to bite the bullet and buy. I've got a 16" swing x 48" lathe, and vertical mill, gas, arc, mig, and tig welders, a press break, and a hoist. The dyno was the best thing I've ever bought. I learned more with it in 1 month than 30 years of backyard and dragstrip testing.Dave
True... It's fun to test products from major aftermarket vendors on the dyno, and find out they are kind of full of [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean] to.
I think so many people blow up on the dyno, because the clock ticking away means money paid to someone else to, so they rush through things and make mistakes.. Its really nice to just set it up, and chew away at it and a leisurely pace and make solid safe gains in power.
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: Uberpube]
#1729700
01/15/15 12:16 AM
01/15/15 12:16 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,392
nielsville, minn.
quickd100
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,392
nielsville, minn.
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Quote:
Quote:
If I can build or fabricate it I do. Some things you just have to bite the bullet and buy. I've got a 16" swing x 48" lathe, and vertical mill, gas, arc, mig, and tig welders, a press break, and a hoist. The dyno was the best thing I've ever bought. I learned more with it in 1 month than 30 years of backyard and dragstrip testing.Dave
True... It's fun to test products from major aftermarket vendors on the dyno, and find out they are kind of full of [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean] to.
I think so many people blow up on the dyno, because the clock ticking away means money paid to someone else to, so they rush through things and make mistakes.. Its really nice to just set it up, and chew away at it and a leisurely pace and make solid safe gains in power.
So right you are! The big problem is knowing when to say enough. I made 36 pulls on the 605, 18 just fine tuning the carbs. You can wear a motor out testing all the hairbrain crap you think up laying in bed at nite. Dave    
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: quickd100]
#1729701
01/15/15 01:01 AM
01/15/15 01:01 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,099
Rogue River, OR
Jeremiah
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,099
Rogue River, OR
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Yes and yes, but not to the degree that some of you have climbed to.  There is a fellow locally that has a dyno because all of the other dyno operators are too flaky and that seems to be a common theme. This is insignificant in comparison bet I just bought a new set of Spellmaco transfer punches ($$$). I could have bought four sets of Chinese punches and still had change. I just couldn't do it!  We need to do some work to our new to us home's driveway. I bought a D600 and am looking for a Case 580 or Cat 420 backhoe. After calling a few places and waving my (cash) money around to no avail the decision was easy. Own another mopar lol. My day jobs permits and prohibits ever hobby I have and that is a good thing around here.
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: quickd100]
#1729703
01/15/15 01:13 PM
01/15/15 01:13 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 2,411
Weatherford, Texas
RapidusMaximus
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 2,411
Weatherford, Texas
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
If I can build or fabricate it I do. Some things you just have to bite the bullet and buy. I've got a 16" swing x 48" lathe, and vertical mill, gas, arc, mig, and tig welders, a press break, and a hoist. The dyno was the best thing I've ever bought. I learned more with it in 1 month than 30 years of backyard and dragstrip testing.Dave
True... It's fun to test products from major aftermarket vendors on the dyno, and find out they are kind of full of [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean] to.
I think so many people blow up on the dyno, because the clock ticking away means money paid to someone else to, so they rush through things and make mistakes.. Its really nice to just set it up, and chew away at it and a leisurely pace and make solid safe gains in power.
So right you are! The big problem is knowing when to say enough. I made 36 pulls on the 605, 18 just fine tuning the carbs. You can wear a motor out testing all the hairbrain crap you think up laying in bed at nite. Dave
That's funny stuff right there...and probably soooo very true, I'd probably be the same way...now if I could just afford one...wait...isn't that what started this thread 
1968 Plymouth GTX
1974 Dodge P/U Long Bed Stepside 318
2019 Ram 2500 6.4, auto, 4WD
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: quickd100]
#1729704
01/15/15 01:32 PM
01/15/15 01:32 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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I think that some have the engine built(or build it themself) and then use the dyno as a break-in tool.. some guys(for what ever reason) will get just a warm up and a couple of pulls. maybe it was the money or a time frame(I dont know)..I was paying $400 per day of dyno time(this included dropping the engine the day before so it could be mounted up)... I could do anything I wanted during that time period from tuning to idling... I did get a break one day when I only ran a couple of hours and had to come off the dyno and they charged me $200... but I did go back a week later to run again... I did end up with about 4 days on the dyno(at different times) with that engine 
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1729705
01/15/15 02:09 PM
01/15/15 02:09 PM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,106
Northeast
VincentVega
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,106
Northeast
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We're set up like that here. small garage. 4 milling machines, 6" belt sander, a couple of valve grinders, seat grinders, coats 40/40A tire changer, probably about 100 grand worth of miller tools at today's prices. max wedge stuff, big horizontal bandsaw, a couple of sheet metal brakes including a very nice 48" box and pan brake that does up to 16ga, a bear 4 wheel alignment machine, 6" Atlas lathe, electroplating stuff, hydraulic exhaust bender, welders, a used but uninstalled 2 post lift (lol), one-end air lift, all kinds of air tools including head porting stuff, planishing hammer, english wheel, mig/tig/oxy-acet welders, hitman alignment setup, rotary milling table, large granite surface plate. disk/drum brake lathes. it goes on and on. My dad was a pack rat for this stuff and when you consider the fact we are middle class, these procurements are insane. and took 50 years. The only problem was never enough space to have it out and in use all the time.
We also have a van norman rotary broach! lol! that thing is huge
I think this is what they call penny-wise dollar foolish
Looking for 1975 through 1978 B body 4 door sedan sheet metal or parts cars - monaco, fury, coronet. Please let me know
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: Dunnuck Racing]
#1729706
01/15/15 02:23 PM
01/15/15 02:23 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,099
Rogue River, OR
Jeremiah
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,099
Rogue River, OR
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Quote:
The flaky dyno guys in your area
must be related to the guys around here.
I initially bought mine for the same reason. I looked at a customers dyno sheet for his small block stroker street car
Two pulls with no changes from 4,000 to 6,000 RPM. 400 dollars and not a thing to help him
Keith
Exactly. Nobody wants to have any problems on the dyno and seem to have this "get you in, get you out" mentality when in reality you are there to get a baseline tune, check for leaks and save the aggravation of having to pull a fresh engine. Then there is the lack of carb tuning parts, disarray of greasy tools and parts, etc. IMO the first thing a machinist/engine builder/dyno operator should learn is how to respect the customer's investment. I applaud the guys with shops that actually respect the customer's project regardless is it's a stock resto 440 or a B1 headed 572. Sorry for the OT rant but that hit a chord lol.
Last edited by Jeremiah; 01/15/15 02:25 PM.
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: VincentVega]
#1729707
01/15/15 02:24 PM
01/15/15 02:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,921
Richmond, Indiana
19swinger70
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,921
Richmond, Indiana
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I have a mix of pro-level and non pro equipment in my shop. For me, having a nice, commercial / pro level shop is part of the hobby itself. As I get less and less time to actually work out there - it is nice to have good tools and equipment for the valuable time I am out there working. At least some of this "excess" could be sold if needed.
1970 340 swinger. sublime
1967 barracuda fastback BB
55 Plymouth Project
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: Jeremiah]
#1729708
01/15/15 03:56 PM
01/15/15 03:56 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,871
Ontario, Canada
Stanton
Don't question me!
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Don't question me!
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,871
Ontario, Canada
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Quote:
Quote:
The flaky dyno guys in your area
must be related to the guys around here.
I initially bought mine for the same reason. I looked at a customers dyno sheet for his small block stroker street car
Two pulls with no changes from 4,000 to 6,000 RPM. 400 dollars and not a thing to help him
Keith
Exactly. Nobody wants to have any problems on the dyno and seem to have this "get you in, get you out" mentality when in reality you are there to get a baseline tune, check for leaks and save the aggravation of having to pull a fresh engine. Then there is the lack of carb tuning parts, disarray of greasy tools and parts, etc. IMO the first thing a machinist/engine builder/dyno operator should learn is how to respect the customer's investment. I applaud the guys with shops that actually respect the customer's project regardless is it's a stock resto 440 or a B1 headed 572. Sorry for the OT rant but that hit a chord lol.
I've never dyno'd a motor but it seems logical to me that its your responsibility to show up with the stuff you want to test, If you show up with just your motor then what's the point of more than two pulls ? And maybe that motor was "sold" and the seller was just supplying a dyno sheet to satisfy the customer. In this case I think its unfair to cast judgement based on this single incident. "Street car" guys don't usually have a trunk full of intakes, carbs and cams !!
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: Stanton]
#1729713
01/15/15 05:25 PM
01/15/15 05:25 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
BradH
OP
Taking time off to work on my car
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OP
Taking time off to work on my car
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
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Quote:
"Street car" guys don't usually have a trunk full of intakes, carbs and cams !!
Hey, I'm a "street car" guy and when I've gone to the dyno (three different times) I've definitely been there w/ different carbs & intakes - even three different cams one time - to test.
Never mind; I'm the guy that started this thread... 
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: BradH]
#1729714
01/15/15 08:40 PM
01/15/15 08:40 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,489
Minnesota
Hemi_Joel
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,489
Minnesota
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It's amazing what guys have for hobby tools now. One of my buddies has an engine dyno , 3 cnc mills, lathe, powder coating equipt and a huge oven to bake it, vacuum forming machine for plastic, full size paint booth, plasma cutter, tig, etc.. Another buddy has a brake, shrinker/stretcher, roll former, tubing bender, tig set up. I've got a Bridgeport, engine lathe, horizontal/verticle bandsaw, tig, mig, stick, oxy acetalyene welders, valve seat grinder, valve grinder, valve guide knurler/reamers, electric ring filer, tire machine, electronic tire balancer, 20 ton press, 3/8 drive socket set, vicegrip... hard to find time to use it all. 
[img]http://i.imgur.com/boeexFms.jpg[/img]31 Plymouth Coupe, 392 Hemi, T56 magnum RS23J71 RS27J77 RP23J71 RO23J71 WM21J8A I don't regret the things I've done. I only regret the things I didn't do. "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something. ~ Plato"
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Re: "Hobbyists" w/ pro-level tools, equipment, etc.?
[Re: Hemi_Joel]
#1729715
01/15/15 09:06 PM
01/15/15 09:06 PM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,106
Northeast
VincentVega
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,106
Northeast
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CNC is amazing if you also have the computer, software, and knowledge to apply it. I had some CNC parts made for me based on a drawing I did on a program called Google Sketchup. I was able to export that drawing, one friend converted it from that format to AutoCad, and then a second friend (out of the goodness of his heart) made me twin pieces and shipped to me for free! His only bill was the promise to pay it forward. This is one of the reason I always try my best to help people diagnose their issues on here. in fact, it looks just like this  and here is one of them finished and on a measuring machine (another thrown-in bonus for fun and smiles) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCT5YjdfL0I&feature=youtu.bemild steel, nNominal thickness is 1/8 (.125) the key to this thing is that the wedge portion is a compound angle. it tapers in both the X and Y direction. Be hard to make by hand, but certainly doable. CNC just makes it fun
Looking for 1975 through 1978 B body 4 door sedan sheet metal or parts cars - monaco, fury, coronet. Please let me know
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