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rod shopping *DELETED* #1547966
12/15/13 08:33 PM
12/15/13 08:33 PM
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lewtot184 Offline OP
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Post deleted by lewtot184

Re: rod shopping [Re: lewtot184] #1547967
12/15/13 10:58 PM
12/15/13 10:58 PM
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ahy Offline
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I beam rods are in theory a better design. Really high end rods like Oliver are I beams.

That said, there are some great H beams out there. I'm running Eagle H beams on a 496 with no issues at around 550 HP. They seem to be good to about 700 HP. Scat is supposed to be good also and I believe the 440 source H beams are OK as well.

If you are running a press fit piston pin, the 440 source I beam may be a good replacement for factory LY rods.

If the pin is floating, I'd personally go for one of the good H beam rods out there or use the ones you have if nothing is wrong with them.

Re: rod shopping [Re: ahy] #1547968
12/16/13 01:25 PM
12/16/13 01:25 PM
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dogdays Offline
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Your question leaves so much to be guessed at that it doesn't have an answer.

Here are some things I think about when I read your question:
1. Why do you need new rods?
2. What are you doing with your engine that stock rods won't work?
3. What's wrong with the rods you're running now?

For a street engine that doesn't see more than 5000 rpm, the stock rods usually lasted basically forever.

The part of a connecting rod that usually gives trouble is the big end. The highest force the rod sees is at the end of the exhaust stroke. Rod bolts stretch and loosen the crush on the rod bearing, and/or big ends distort.

For years and years the Carrillo rod was the best that could be bought. It was an H-beam.

When more got into the aftermarket rod market, most of the first generation rods were also H-beam. I maintain that's because you could create an H-beam rod out of a piece of steel plate. No forging equipment required.

When the aftermarket rod industry took off (and a lot went overseas) there started to appear reasonably priced I-beam rods. Economics of scale allowed the manufacture by forging.

In the beginning, H-beam rods were heavy. I maintain they have the beam material in the wrong places. But as time went by, the H-beam became lighter and lighter as better design techniques were used. Now, the difference in weight between a really good H-beam and a really good I-beam is meaningless.

Go on Ebay and look at the used racing rods. There are some of each style. That means to me that either style can be used in the most demanding applications.

If you have to or want to change your rods for I-beam rods, the best two that come to mind are the Oliver parabolic billet and Crower billet rods. They don't come cheap.

R.

Re: rod shopping [Re: dogdays] #1547969
12/16/13 02:45 PM
12/16/13 02:45 PM
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lewtot184 Offline OP
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Quote:

Your question leaves so much to be guessed at that it doesn't have an answer.

Here are some things I think about when I read your question:
1. Why do you need new rods?
2. What are you doing with your engine that stock rods won't work?
3. What's wrong with the rods you're running now?

For a street engine that doesn't see more than 5000 rpm, the stock rods usually lasted basically forever.

The part of a connecting rod that usually gives trouble is the big end. The highest force the rod sees is at the end of the exhaust stroke. Rod bolts stretch and loosen the crush on the rod bearing, and/or big ends distort.

For years and years the Carrillo rod was the best that could be bought. It was an H-beam.

When more got into the aftermarket rod market, most of the first generation rods were also H-beam. I maintain that's because you could create an H-beam rod out of a piece of steel plate. No forging equipment required.

When the aftermarket rod industry took off (and a lot went overseas) there started to appear reasonably priced I-beam rods. Economics of scale allowed the manufacture by forging.

In the beginning, H-beam rods were heavy. I maintain they have the beam material in the wrong places. But as time went by, the H-beam became lighter and lighter as better design techniques were used. Now, the difference in weight between a really good H-beam and a really good I-beam is meaningless.

Go on Ebay and look at the used racing rods. There are some of each style. That means to me that either style can be used in the most demanding applications.

If you have to or want to change your rods for I-beam rods, the best two that come to mind are the Oliver parabolic billet and Crower billet rods. They don't come cheap.

R.


the engine in question has h-beam rods in it now. i don't like them and want to change them; simple. do you have any experience with the 440 source i-beam rods? i'm looking for feedback on the 440 source i-beam rods.

Re: rod shopping [Re: lewtot184] #1547970
12/16/13 03:50 PM
12/16/13 03:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,005
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR Offline
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U.S.S.A.
Quote:

Quote:

Your question leaves so much to be guessed at that it doesn't have an answer.

Here are some things I think about when I read your question:
1. Why do you need new rods?
2. What are you doing with your engine that stock rods won't work?
3. What's wrong with the rods you're running now?

For a street engine that doesn't see more than 5000 rpm, the stock rods usually lasted basically forever.

The part of a connecting rod that usually gives trouble is the big end. The highest force the rod sees is at the end of the exhaust stroke. Rod bolts stretch and loosen the crush on the rod bearing, and/or big ends distort.

For years and years the Carrillo rod was the best that could be bought. It was an H-beam.

When more got into the aftermarket rod market, most of the first generation rods were also H-beam. I maintain that's because you could create an H-beam rod out of a piece of steel plate. No forging equipment required.

When the aftermarket rod industry took off (and a lot went overseas) there started to appear reasonably priced I-beam rods. Economics of scale allowed the manufacture by forging.

In the beginning, H-beam rods were heavy. I maintain they have the beam material in the wrong places. But as time went by, the H-beam became lighter and lighter as better design techniques were used. Now, the difference in weight between a really good H-beam and a really good I-beam is meaningless.

Go on Ebay and look at the used racing rods. There are some of each style. That means to me that either style can be used in the most demanding applications.

If you have to or want to change your rods for I-beam rods, the best two that come to mind are the Oliver parabolic billet and Crower billet rods. They don't come cheap.

R.


the engine in question has h-beam rods in it now. i don't like them and want to change them; simple. do you have any experience with the 440 source i-beam rods? i'm looking for feedback on the 440 source i-beam rods.




Are the source i beam rods even still available ? if they are what material are they made from ?

Are you actually trying to compare them to a rod like an OLIVER ???

Re: rod shopping [Re: JohnRR] #1547971
12/16/13 05:11 PM
12/16/13 05:11 PM
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GTX MATT Offline
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The source I beams are 5140


Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat
Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
Re: rod shopping [Re: JohnRR] #1547972
12/16/13 07:35 PM
12/16/13 07:35 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,313
Prospect, PA
BSB67 Offline
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My guess is that he is looking at it like this: after you recondition a set of LYs with good bolts, you're most of the way to the cost of the 440 Source rods, and they are still 45 years old.

Last edited by BSB67; 12/16/13 07:36 PM.
Re: rod shopping [Re: BSB67] #1547973
12/16/13 07:41 PM
12/16/13 07:41 PM
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lewtot184 Offline OP
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Quote:

My guess is that he is looking at it like this: after you recondition a set of LYs with good bolts, you're most of the way to the cost of the 440 Source rods, and they are still 45 years old.


ding, ding! you win a cookie! i'll send you a pm.

Re: rod shopping [Re: GTX MATT] #1547974
12/16/13 08:45 PM
12/16/13 08:45 PM
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JohnRR Offline
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Quote:

The source I beams are 5140




If that is the case then I would prefer a set of reconed LY's out of Cbody donor motor.

Re: rod shopping [Re: JohnRR] #1547975
12/16/13 08:50 PM
12/16/13 08:50 PM
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dogdays Offline
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The stockers aren't made of any better stuff. Probably worse.
The new 440Source rods also have 7/16" rod bolts, which are what should have been in the stockers but weren't.
R.

Last edited by dogdays; 12/16/13 08:53 PM.
Re: rod shopping *DELETED* [Re: lewtot184] #1547976
12/16/13 09:06 PM
12/16/13 09:06 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda Offline
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Quote:

Post deleted by lewtot184




Isn't that nice


They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
Re: rod shopping *DELETED* [Re: Supercuda] #1547977
12/16/13 09:10 PM
12/16/13 09:10 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 19,907
Puttin' on the foil in Charles...
not_a_charger Offline
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Puttin' on the foil in Charles...
Quote:

Quote:

Post deleted by lewtot184




Isn't that nice




Look at me! I can delete a post!

Oh, wait...it's still here.


Earning every penny of that moderator paycheck.

DBAP
Re: rod shopping *DELETED* [Re: Supercuda] #1547978
12/17/13 03:11 AM
12/17/13 03:11 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
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JohnRR Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Post deleted by lewtot184




Isn't that SPECIAL




fixed







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