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Thoughts on Q16 #1501701 09/15/13 11:27 AM 09/15/13 11:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY F F1Scamp OP mopar
F1Scamp OP mopar F Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY	Hey guys, that time of year where all I can think about is squeezing every little ounce of performance out of my 71 Duster. I have been thinking about trying some q16 fuel. From what I have read, the more air starved your combination is, the bigger return you will get from it. My motor is probably about as air starved combo you can come up with. I am looking for tips, tricks, etc. to get the most out of the switch. Currently I am running c16 which is probably overkill for the motor (all cast iron, 13.5 comp), but the cranking compression is around 250psi so I just want to be safe. I realize I have to jet up, but read conflicting information on how much to start with. What is the target a/f? Same as normal gas? What about timing? Does it HAVE to be dropped? My motor likes pretty low timing but getting it so low kills bottom end tq (may put on a programmable box). Sorry for the long post. Thanks guys Work In Progress- 71' Duster F.A.S.T.- 10.36@130 Smallblock Record Holder.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501702 09/15/13 11:55 AM 09/15/13 11:55 AM
Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 8,124 Mt Morris Michigan mopar dave master
mopar dave master Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 8,124 Mt Morris Michigan	if q16 is oxygenated fuel,vp old me 4 jet sizes up with their 100 streetblaze. no change in timing needed. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIxaesJ190U http://youtu.be/lCZAaN7fFLg

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: mopar dave] #1501703 09/15/13 01:12 PM 09/15/13 01:12 PM
Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,029 Trumbull,CT. J jim sciortino top fuel
jim sciortino top fuel J Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,029 Trumbull,CT.	C16 is a "heavy" fuel, more suited to boosted combinations. I use it in a 1700hp blown street car. No way is it the correct fuel for your combination. If you wanna try oxy fuel.....with your CR, VP113 may be a better choice, possibly C12, or C14 in non-oxy.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501704 09/15/13 03:02 PM 09/15/13 03:02 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,259 Oregon A AndyF I Win
AndyF I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,259 Oregon	You can try it, but I'm not sure if you have enough compression to make it work. VP recommends a minimum of 14:1 compression for Q16. I've tried it in lower compression engines without much luck. In my 514 it worked pretty well, but that engine has 15.5 compression.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: AndyF] #1501705 09/15/13 06:41 PM 09/15/13 06:41 PM
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY F F1Scamp OP mopar
F1Scamp OP mopar F Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY	I didn't realize they made a oxygenated 113 octane fuel. It says it is good for up to 14:1 and oxygenated to street gas levels. I guess I won't know which one works best till I try them. Too bad you have to buy it in 5gal cans. Wonder if you could mix them? Work In Progress- 71' Duster F.A.S.T.- 10.36@130 Smallblock Record Holder.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501706 09/15/13 06:44 PM 09/15/13 06:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 32,394 Q Quicktree I Win
Quicktree I Win Q Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 32,394	why are you running stock exhaust? are you running FAST or something.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: Quicktree] #1501707 09/15/13 06:52 PM 09/15/13 06:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY F F1Scamp OP mopar
F1Scamp OP mopar F Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY	Quote: why are you running stock exhaust? are you running FAST or something. Yes, current smallblock record holder in FAST. Car ran 11.27 @ 120.5, now it has about 40hp more and 43lbs lighter. Trying to break the 10second barrier in FAST form. Work In Progress- 71' Duster F.A.S.T.- 10.36@130 Smallblock Record Holder.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: Quicktree] #1501708 09/15/13 06:55 PM 09/15/13 06:55 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 1,578 K KOS pro stock
KOS pro stock K Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 1,578	i tried q16 against c12 in my 13.1 small block stroker it was worth a tenth but you might have to get into changing the air bleeds i couldnt put enough jet in my QF 1050dom.i believe it has 10%oxygen the 113 is 6%or8% so might be better suited in your application.i wanted to try the 113 but was hard to get ahold of around here.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: KOS] #1501709 09/15/13 08:17 PM 09/15/13 08:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY F F1Scamp OP mopar
F1Scamp OP mopar F Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY	Quote: i tried q16 against c12 in my 13.1 small block stroker it was worth a tenth but you might have to get into changing the air bleeds i couldnt put enough jet in my QF 1050dom.i believe it has 10%oxygen the 113 is 6%or8% so might be better suited in your application.i wanted to try the 113 but was hard to get ahold of around here. Well that's encouraging. It would awesome if it would give me a tenth. Of course, the more hp I give it, the harder and harder it is to get it off the line. Work In Progress- 71' Duster F.A.S.T.- 10.36@130 Smallblock Record Holder.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501710 09/16/13 10:10 AM 09/16/13 10:10 AM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 8,166 Left Coast B BobR master
BobR master B Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 8,166 Left Coast	Q16 works very well. You need 5 jet sizes and air bleed work. It also burns very clean.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501711 09/16/13 11:45 AM 09/16/13 11:45 AM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 6,446 NJ-USA H HPMike master
HPMike master H Joined: May 2005 Posts: 6,446 NJ-USA	Brian... It works...Aside from being a VP fuel dealer, I have many dyno tests to prove the fuel does whats its supposed to..I have been using it since it first came out and worked with a VP engineer on getting up to speed on running this fuel safely and effectively. I have also recommended and worked through several other combos for friends and fuel customers that have run their best times on the Q16. These guys swear by it now.. There is special handling invoived..Jetting is important as is timing. Also some other more mundane stuff. It is an IDEAL fuel for FAST type engines..Many of the records set might not even have been possible without the oxygenated fuel. Call me if you want...I have a lot of experience and R & D with this fuel. It will work for you. MB

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: HPMike] #1501712 09/16/13 12:41 PM 09/16/13 12:41 PM
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY F F1Scamp OP mopar
F1Scamp OP mopar F Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY	Quote: Brian... It works...Aside from being a VP fuel dealer, I have many dyno tests to prove the fuel does whats its supposed to..I have been using it since it first came out and worked with a VP engineer on getting up to speed on running this fuel safely and effectively. I have also recommended and worked through several other combos for friends and fuel customers that have run their best times on the Q16. These guys swear by it now.. There is special handling invoived..Jetting is important as is timing. Also some other more mundane stuff. It is an IDEAL fuel for FAST type engines..Many of the records set might not even have been possible without the oxygenated fuel. Call me if you want...I have a lot of experience and R & D with this fuel. It will work for you. MB Mike do you think I should go with Q16 or do you think the VP113 would be better suited? The motor is 13.5:1 with 250psi of cranking compression. Work In Progress- 71' Duster F.A.S.T.- 10.36@130 Smallblock Record Holder.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501713 09/16/13 12:53 PM 09/16/13 12:53 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 6,446 NJ-USA H HPMike master
HPMike master H Joined: May 2005 Posts: 6,446 NJ-USA	Quote: Quote: Brian... It works...Aside from being a VP fuel dealer, I have many dyno tests to prove the fuel does whats its supposed to..I have been using it since it first came out and worked with a VP engineer on getting up to speed on running this fuel safely and effectively. I have also recommended and worked through several other combos for friends and fuel customers that have run their best times on the Q16. These guys swear by it now.. There is special handling invoived..Jetting is important as is timing. Also some other more mundane stuff. It is an IDEAL fuel for FAST type engines..Many of the records set might not even have been possible without the oxygenated fuel. Call me if you want...I have a lot of experience and R & D with this fuel. It will work for you. MB Mike do you think I should go with Q16 or do you think the VP113 would be better suited? The motor is 13.5:1 with 250psi of cranking compression. Q16 No doubt...If you can get it on a chassis dyno, great..I am thinking I will be at MIR..If you want ill help you out... MB

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: HPMike] #1501714 09/16/13 01:03 PM 09/16/13 01:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY F F1Scamp OP mopar
F1Scamp OP mopar F Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 419 NY	I am going to try it at the Mopar day at leabonan valley in 2 weeks. If the car picks up, I will def. be using at MIR. Work In Progress- 71' Duster F.A.S.T.- 10.36@130 Smallblock Record Holder.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501715 09/16/13 01:13 PM 09/16/13 01:13 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 6,446 NJ-USA H HPMike master
HPMike master H Joined: May 2005 Posts: 6,446 NJ-USA	Quote: I am going to try it at the Mopar day at leabonan valley in 2 weeks. If the car picks up, I will def. be using at MIR. Gimme a call if you need any tuning assistance...The O2 reading #s cant really be relied on, like you would for conventional fuels. MB

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501716 09/16/13 01:55 PM 09/16/13 01:55 PM
Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,029 Trumbull,CT. J jim sciortino top fuel
jim sciortino top fuel J Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,029 Trumbull,CT.	Yes, current smallblock record holder in FAST. Car ran 11.27 @ 120.5, now it has about 40hp more and 43lbs lighter. Trying to break the 10second barrier in FAST form. That is so cool I can't stand it!!! If the Q16 can give you a tenth+, that would be sweet. Good luck with the hunt for 10s.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: jim sciortino] #1501717 09/16/13 02:14 PM 09/16/13 02:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,602 Las Vegas Al_Alguire I Live Here
Al_Alguire I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,602 Las Vegas	We have been using it for a LONG time and have helped a number of folks make the transition. There is NO Magic jet number for making the switch. VP will tell you 5% more is a good starting point. We have found some combinations have taken up to 10% more. IN my car it was about 8% more jet and a lot of bleed work. As for A/F ratio we have seem to make the best power at 12.6 or so in my B1 and the Pro Stock 99 Hemi I have. That has also been close on every car we have worked on. It will take quite a bit more fuel to get it there over a conventional fuel. Another option might be C25, it is expensive but it makes power too... "I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know." "It's never wrong to do the right thing"

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: F1Scamp] #1501718 09/16/13 03:25 PM 09/16/13 03:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,259 Oregon A AndyF I Win
AndyF I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,259 Oregon	There might not be too many folks still alive who know how to change the fuel curve on a Thermoquad! You don't have the luxury of adjustable air bleeds and unlimited jet sizes like a Holley. Be sure to drain the carb after every race. That Q16 might turn the TQ into jelly if you leave it in there too long.

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: AndyF] #1501719 09/16/13 04:21 PM 09/16/13 04:21 PM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 732 NY X XXHEMI super stock
XXHEMI super stock X Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 732 NY	Brian I think I will try that out with you. HP Mike did make more power on the dyno (I think 16HP)with the Q but I never saw results at the track. And draining it out of the car is a must. Eat up my accellerator pump in about 4 hrs. One thing that did happen when using it is at about the 1000' the engine would feel like it was running out of fuel for a split second and then come back to life? This happened every time with the Q never with c16 I don't know if anyone else has had this issue. Maybe HP Mike can make a track visit we have not seen him in a while? Ed Cook

Re: Thoughts on Q16 [Re: XXHEMI] #1501720 09/16/13 07:57 PM 09/16/13 07:57 PM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 999 Addison,IL OUTLAWSSAA super stock
OUTLAWSSAA super stock Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 999 Addison,IL	I've been using it for a number of years also. Most of the comments about what needs to be changed in the tune up is correct. As far as the running out of fuel situation, I had the same thing happen and the cure was changing to a bigger needle & seat to allow more fuel into the bowl.

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