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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: challenger70]
#147192
11/20/08 05:15 PM
11/20/08 05:15 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 531
Virginia
JimG
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 531
Virginia
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Quote:
do you have to modify the car at all, other than wiring? 
No, the headlights will physically bolt in with no mods needed.
Jim
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: challenger70]
#147193
11/20/08 05:39 PM
11/20/08 05:39 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
HealthServices
Why would you even post that?
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Why would you even post that?
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
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Real Xenon is something you may and may not want to try. Real xenon is a HID or High Intensity discharge lighting. Quote:
Discharge (HID) lighting technology replaces the filament of the light bulb with a capsule of gas. The light is emitted from an arc discharge between two closely spaced electrodes hermetically sealed inside a small quartz glass tubular envelope capsule. To operate, they require ballasts, which supply proper voltage and control current. The amount of light produced is greater than a standard halogen bulb, while consuming less power, and more closely approximating the color temperature of natural daylight
The problem with HID is they were made for projection headlight with light sharp cut off. Most people when first using this, dislike it because it would not shine on street signs, but because it is so bright aiming it any higher would blind oncoming traffic.
Many of the late model cars use this type of lighting now. That's why sometimes when you are heading toward a BMW with correctly aim HID lights they appear to have only the parking lights on. But on closer inspection you see the light pattern on the ground ahead of them.
Recently in the last few years aftermarket companies made a bulb that would fit h1,h4, as well as many other sockets where replacement bulbs could be replaced.
There are two major problems with this setup.
1. is that the bulb is not position correctly (too long) and the resultant the light pattern is incorrect.
2. The light is scattered (housing optics cannot control the light correctly) causing oncoming traffic to be blinded
Allen
Here's a novel idea, let's not throw a bunch of parts at the car hoping it will fix the problem and instead spend a little time diagnosing it first.
Life was a little easier when I was just a wrench.
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: HealthServices]
#147194
11/20/08 05:49 PM
11/20/08 05:49 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,358
Berwyn, IL
challenger70
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,358
Berwyn, IL
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So if I understand this the H1/H4 is a upgrade but basically the same as the stock halogens as far as fit and function, they just work better. The HID's are the Xenon and funtion differently, ie the sharp light/dark cutoff and don't they also require a ballast? 
Last edited by challenger70; 11/20/08 05:51 PM.
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: HealthServices]
#147197
11/20/08 06:04 PM
11/20/08 06:04 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
HealthServices
Why would you even post that?
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Why would you even post that?
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
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The 'Xenon' came to be when HID surfaced and many of the replacement 'bulbs' called themselves 'xexon' to copy the look of the HID.
Ba careful when shopping bulbs. Many say they have 12V 100/90W 6000K color temperature when they are actually colored 55/60 watt bulbs that have the 'color' of a 12V 100/90W 6000K color temperature bulb.
Allen
Here's a novel idea, let's not throw a bunch of parts at the car hoping it will fix the problem and instead spend a little time diagnosing it first.
Life was a little easier when I was just a wrench.
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: mkdart]
#147199
11/20/08 11:16 PM
11/20/08 11:16 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 556
Arkansas
GregGarner
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 556
Arkansas
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Here are some suggestions: 1) replace points style mechanical limiter on back of the dash with a solid state limiter. (available from us for $50 at www.rt-eng.com) 2) Have the ammeter rebuilt so it has much lower resistance. (www.rt-eng.com rebuilds any mopar ammeter for $60). We are able to lower the restiance of a good standard ammeter about 10 times after we get done rebuilding it. Our rebuilt ammeters average .001 Ohms resistance. 3) Switch to Solid state blinkers. 4) Bead blast all connectors on the wiring harnesses, then use dialectric grease when you put them back together. 5) Switch over from points style distributor to solid state. 6) Use a higher amperage alternator to stop headlight dimming at idle. If you go over about 70 Amps, switch from ammeter to voltmeter, and wire from alternator output to starter terminal. (www.rt-eng.com sells voltmeter kits for $150 for most mopars) 7) If you dimmer switch for the dash lights is flaky, have it rebuilt (we can do this, prices vary). 8) Change tachometer circuit board over to new design. Makes your tach more accurate and will make it work with MSD ignition, makes it more reliable as well. ($75 from www.rt-eng.com) 9) Change clock mechanism to quartz movement ($75 from www.rt-eng.com)
GregGarner www.rt-eng.com Home of the mopar solid state limiter adn tach repair kit
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: HealthServices]
#147201
11/21/08 11:52 AM
11/21/08 11:52 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,358
Berwyn, IL
challenger70
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,358
Berwyn, IL
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Quote:
The 'Xenon' came to be when HID surfaced and many of the replacement 'bulbs' called themselves 'xexon' to copy the look of the HID.
Ba careful when shopping bulbs. Many say they have 12V 100/90W 6000K color temperature when they are actually colored 55/60 watt bulbs that have the 'color' of a 12V 100/90W 6000K color temperature bulb.
O.k. So in summation
1)Xenon is just a wannabe HID rip off.
2)HID is probably the best but requires a ballast
3)H1/H4 is an upgrade to the factory sealed beams, but not as "good" as HID.
am I on the right trail here? 
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: challenger70]
#147202
11/21/08 12:11 PM
11/21/08 12:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
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5.7L Hemi, 6spd
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
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Quote:
Quote:
The 'Xenon' came to be when HID surfaced and many of the replacement 'bulbs' called themselves 'xexon' to copy the look of the HID.
Ba careful when shopping bulbs. Many say they have 12V 100/90W 6000K color temperature when they are actually colored 55/60 watt bulbs that have the 'color' of a 12V 100/90W 6000K color temperature bulb.
O.k. So in summation
1)Xenon is just a wannabe HID rip off.
2)HID is probably the best but requires a ballast
3)H1/H4 is an upgrade to the factory sealed beams, but not as "good" as HID.
am I on the right trail here?
1) HID's are Xenon bulbs. What is a rip off is anything that says Xenon, but doesn't include a ballast and such.
2) HID is the best, does need a ballast, but is a huge upgrade over even H4s. Downside is it may cause some on-coming traffic to be bothered. I don't have much of an issue in my Ranger with oncoming traffic complaining (flashing lights).
3)H4 upgrade over sealed beam is definitely worth doing. Which I have. Still not really a comparison to the lighting HID gives you. I will be losing my H4's to HIDs asap since I upgraded my truck lights..I am sold on them, I will be doing the Barracuda.
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: GregGarner]
#147203
11/21/08 12:14 PM
11/21/08 12:14 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
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5.7L Hemi, 6spd
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
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Quote:
7) If you dimmer switch for the dash lights is flaky, have it rebuilt (we can do this, prices vary).
I never dim my lights, I went ahead and just jumped out the rheostat (dimmier switch) and gained better lighting. Others have soldered up the resistor for bone stock wiring with the same results.
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: GoodysGotaCuda]
#147204
11/21/08 12:22 PM
11/21/08 12:22 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,072
Farmland, IN
Ludington1
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,072
Farmland, IN
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Quote:
Quote:
7) If you dimmer switch for the dash lights is flaky, have it rebuilt (we can do this, prices vary).
I never dim my lights, I went ahead and just jumped out the rheostat (dimmier switch) and gained better lighting. Others have soldered up the resistor for bone stock wiring with the same results.
Got any more details on that Goody? I never dim mine either, but I do have to play with the dimmer sometimes to get them to brighten up.
Darren
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: Ludington1]
#147205
11/21/08 12:32 PM
11/21/08 12:32 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
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5.7L Hemi, 6spd
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
7) If you dimmer switch for the dash lights is flaky, have it rebuilt (we can do this, prices vary).
I never dim my lights, I went ahead and just jumped out the rheostat (dimmier switch) and gained better lighting. Others have soldered up the resistor for bone stock wiring with the same results.
Got any more details on that Goody? I never dim mine either, but I do have to play with the dimmer sometimes to get them to brighten up.
Darren
Thought I took a couple pictures when I did it. I will have to look when I get home. I didn't really want to hack into the stock dash harness too much (since I didn't when I converted to autometer gauges either). So it's easily reversible, nothing that can't be undone with no harm.
Basically the dimmer on my Barracuda has three spade connectors on it. One I believe (middle?) gives ground (i think) to the dome whenever it's fully turned. The other two are for the dash lights, one will have 12v into the rheostat (dimmer/resistor), the other will be the output over to the dash lights. So what I did was unhooked the wiring harness from the rheostat. (to I had a connector with three female spades in it). I made a short jumper wire out of 14ga wire with two male spades and connected it into the two outer wires in the connector. So I basically took the rheostat/resistor out of the circuit over to the dash lights.
To make the dimmer still work the dome light when switched over I took another small jumper, with one male and one female spade and hooked it from the connector to the dimmer switch. Like I mentioned, it's not overly complicated or beautiful back there, but it does work fine and doesn't harm anything, soldered the spades in the jumper wires so they are nice and solid.
Works for me 
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: HealthServices]
#147207
11/21/08 01:45 PM
11/21/08 01:45 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,358
Berwyn, IL
challenger70
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,358
Berwyn, IL
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Quote:
In order for us to use HIDs in our cars we must use the H1/H4 housings and put the HID h1/h4 bulbs in there.
Wouldn't the H4 housing "scatter" the nice focused beam of the HID? I thought HID's had a clear/non-refracting lens? 
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: challenger70]
#147208
11/21/08 03:05 PM
11/21/08 03:05 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
HealthServices
Why would you even post that?
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Why would you even post that?
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
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You are correct.
As mention before correct HID systems use a projector light.
There are some systems that will put a HIDs bulbs in the h1/h4 retofit housing. This is just about (there is an projector someone sells that fits in the standard headlight case but looks a little hokey) the only way to install HID in a early model car. The other alternative is to use a HID fog light from some of the aftermarket suppliers.
Yes the light will scatter and may not have the desired effect when installed in a h1/h4 set up.
People still do it though.
Allen
Here's a novel idea, let's not throw a bunch of parts at the car hoping it will fix the problem and instead spend a little time diagnosing it first.
Life was a little easier when I was just a wrench.
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: HealthServices]
#147209
11/21/08 03:42 PM
11/21/08 03:42 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,358
Berwyn, IL
challenger70
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,358
Berwyn, IL
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Quote:
You are correct.
As mention before correct HID systems use a projector light.
There are some systems that will put a HIDs bulbs in the h1/h4 retofit housing. This is just about (there is an projector someone sells that fits in the standard headlight case but looks a little hokey) the only way to install HID in a early model car. The other alternative is to use a HID fog light from some of the aftermarket suppliers.
Yes the light will scatter and may not have the desired effect when installed in a h1/h4 set up.
People still do it though.
Does anyone know what setup "Mr. Angry" runs, it looks like he has a true HID setup on his '68 Charger. 
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Re: Let's talk small electrical upgrades
[Re: challenger70]
#147210
11/21/08 03:52 PM
11/21/08 03:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
HealthServices
Why would you even post that?
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Why would you even post that?
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
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advantange with the chargers is you can hide the light behind the doors... There was a ebay listing a while back that sold a projector in a 5 3/4" housing format but I cannot seem to find it anymore. They look something like the later model porsches.   but take a lot of space and not too pretty.
Last edited by HealthServices; 11/21/08 04:02 PM.
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