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What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck #1284293 08/12/12 10:50 PM 08/12/12 10:50 PM
Joined: Dec 2009 Posts: 83 Southern IL. J jafr OP member
jafr OP member J Joined: Dec 2009 Posts: 83 Southern IL.	Last night my Indy SR heads droped a valve seat which broke the valve and piston. I am now in the market for a new set of heads among other parts. My SRs worked very well after Nick at Comp U Flow ported them but I think it is time to move on and try a new head. I am looking at Indy 440-1s B-1 BS or Edelbrock Victors.These heads will be on a 499 low deck motor in a tube chassis 69 Dart. With the SR heads I was running low 5.70s in the 1/8th mile. All suggestions and opinions appreciated. Thanks, Joe

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284294 08/12/12 10:52 PM 08/12/12 10:52 PM
Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,318 State of confusion T Thumperdart I Live Here
Thumperdart I Live Here T Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,318 State of confusion	Are you getting rid of them because of the dropped seat or wanting more power? 72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284295 08/13/12 12:27 AM 08/13/12 12:27 AM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,228 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,228 Bend,OR USA	Quote: Last night my Indy SR heads droped a valve seat which broke the valve and piston. I am now in the market for a new set of heads among other parts. My SRs worked very well after Nick at Comp U Flow ported them but I think it is time to move on and try a new head. I am looking at Indy 440-1s B-1 BS or Edelbrock Victors.These heads will be on a 499 low deck motor in a tube chassis 69 Dart. With the SR heads I was running low 5.70s in the 1/8th mile. All suggestions and opinions appreciated. Thanks, Joe I've built and dyno tested motors with SR with M.W. ports, they flowed 340 CFM at .700 lift on a Super Flow 600 bench at 28 inches, I had a set of B1-BS CNC ported by Modern Cylinder heads to M.W. ports, they flowed 350 at .700,.800 and .900 on the same bench by the same tech, I had Modern cylinder heads CNC a set of 440-1 and had them change the intake valves to 2.250, they flowed 370 CFM at .600,.700 and all the way up to 1.0 on the same bench,(several years apart)by the same tech My message is the 440-1 CNC ported will flow a lot more air than the same size SR ported heads will with the smaller valves Call around and see if any of the shops have a set of 440-1 ported, ready to assemble or done and ready to ship Last edited by Cab_Burge; 08/13/12 03:27 AM. Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284296 08/13/12 01:06 AM 08/13/12 01:06 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,486 SoCal Brian Hafliger master
Brian Hafliger master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,486 SoCal	Quote: Last night my Indy SR heads droped a valve seat which broke the valve and piston. I am now in the market for a new set of heads among other parts. My SRs worked very well after Nick at Comp U Flow ported them but I think it is time to move on and try a new head. I am looking at Indy 440-1s B-1 BS or Edelbrock Victors.These heads will be on a 499 low deck motor in a tube chassis 69 Dart. With the SR heads I was running low 5.70s in the 1/8th mile. All suggestions and opinions appreciated. Thanks, Joe I would go with the -1's. Last set I ported we used a 2.25 intake valve and they flowed around 370's @ .700 and 390 @ .900. The victors are a great head when ported but I have not had the oppurtunity to push that casting much so not sure it would be alot better but maybe? Brian Brian Hafliger

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: Brian Hafliger] #1284297 08/13/12 08:01 AM 08/13/12 08:01 AM
Joined: Dec 2009 Posts: 83 Southern IL. J jafr OP member
jafr OP member J Joined: Dec 2009 Posts: 83 Southern IL.	Thanks for the replies so far. It is looking like the -1s have more potential for increased flow. But what about on the engine real world power? What I mean is I don't want to turn the motor 7500 to make power. I know you guys both have built plenty of motors that's why I'm asking. Thumper Dart, I was very happy with the SR heads but the head that got beat up would probably cost more to fix than what it is worth and they are pretty maxed out as far as porting goes. Thanks again, Joe

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284298 08/13/12 08:40 AM 08/13/12 08:40 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,011 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw... gregsdart I Live Here
gregsdart I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,011 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...	With 499 cubes you can make roughly 850 hp with fully ported 440-1 heads. That is about the upper limit on a good budget. There is more available hp wise but the cost goes up fast when you start looking into the parts needed. The rpm will go up some as well. For that power you will most likely need to shift at 7300 or there abouts. You could keep the revs down if you really want to stay at 7,000 or below but it will cost some of the power. The 440-1 heads will make great power from about 5000 up. I ran 9.30s at 2000 DA with 2980 weight, 499, unported 440-1 heads and alky as an example of what they can do if you shift at 6800. For valvetrain take a good look at T & D stuff in as high a rocker ratio as they will make (1.7?). I have had a lot of greaf with Jesel stuff. You can move up to a B1 head at this point if you have the budget for pistons and other items required, and those heads should allow for another 50 to 75 hp over the 440-1, maybe more. If you chose to go B1, I strongly suggest getting a good center weighted crank to keep the block alive. I am going to post results of my switch to a center weighted crank after I post this. 8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284299 08/13/12 12:10 PM 08/13/12 12:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,050 Oregon A AndyF I Win
AndyF I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,050 Oregon	MW ports on a 500 inch short block will give you a torque peak in the 5000 to 5500 rpm. Peak power is usually around 7000 rpm. I don't think you'll see much difference between the SR heads and the -1 heads if they are both ported the same. If you need new rocker arms I'd suggest getting the -1 heads machined for Jesel rocker arms right out of the box. The Jesel setup cost more up front, but it sure is nice to work with over time. Dwayne is always a good guy to talk to on builds like this. He can set you up with the heads that you need and give you some cam suggestions at the same time. 7333334-505_rockers.jpg (227 downloads) Last edited by AndyF; 08/13/12 12:12 PM.

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284300 08/13/12 12:25 PM 08/13/12 12:25 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,228 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,228 Bend,OR USA	My 526 C.I. 440 stroker motor made 775 HP at 6500 RPM and the same at 7000 RPM with the SR heads I mentioned, they have a set of 1.65 T&D single shaft rockers. The same motor with the CNC ported set of 440-1 withh Harland Sharp 1.65 rocker made 845 HP at 7000 RPM with no other changes and the 440-1 have a really big exhaust port that ended up making the motor miss from 5200 RPM up because the dyno headers are to small to fit the 440-1 heads properly There may have been a little bit more power left on the table because of that That motor will have a set of custom made headers in the race car, 2 .125 stepped up to 2.25 with 4 inch collectors instead of a set of 2.0 inch primarys with 3.5 collectors, the flanges will be bigger than the exhaust ports with no over hang over the heads ports Not like the dyno headers Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284301 08/13/12 12:54 PM 08/13/12 12:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,928 NC 440Jim I Live Here
440Jim I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,928 NC	If you were happy with the performance of the SR combo, and only one head is damaged, then you could buy one head and have it ported to match the other one. That is less than buying two new heads! But, I agree now is the time to step up if you want more power. IMO, the larger port of the 440-1 will make more power than the SR. And now is the time to get a good CNC port job. I like the 2.25" intake valve option, just make sure the piston valve reliefs are large enough in diameter for them. The Edelbrock Victor with good CNC porting can match the 440-1. And I like their stuff. But I think it will cost you a little more in both work (pushrod fit, etc) and money since you already have the Indy valley plate, external oiling kit, etc. I just don't think the B1-BS is up to the task. The B1 originals or MC are a big step up, but will cost even more. 1993 Daytona, 5.50 at 130mph (1/8) 1.19 sixty ft (PG). Link to 572 B1 - Part 1

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284302 08/13/12 01:04 PM 08/13/12 01:04 PM
Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,318 State of confusion T Thumperdart I Live Here
Thumperdart I Live Here T Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 19,318 State of confusion	Quote: Thanks for the replies so far. It is looking like the -1s have more potential for increased flow. But what about on the engine real world power? What I mean is I don't want to turn the motor 7500 to make power. I know you guys both have built plenty of motors that's why I'm asking. Thumper Dart, I was very happy with the SR heads but the head that got beat up would probably cost more to fix than what it is worth and they are pretty maxed out as far as porting goes. Thanks again, Joe I understand and that`s why I was asking..........looking to put another 400 stroker together and was just seeing if maybe they were 4 sale but if they`re that jacked up then............. 72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284303 08/13/12 02:27 PM 08/13/12 02:27 PM
Joined: Oct 2011 Posts: 559 Idaho L LaRoy Engines mopar
LaRoy Engines mopar L Joined: Oct 2011 Posts: 559 Idaho	It doesn't make any difference what cylinder head you choose, the difference is in who prepares it. Pick any head you want 440-1, B1 BS or Victor. Even the EZ head will go 370 cfm. Just get the right guy to port them. Darn, you can get 730 HP with factory iron heads at 6600-6700 rpm. Last edited by heyoldguy; 08/13/12 02:30 PM.

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: LaRoy Engines] #1284304 08/13/12 06:06 PM 08/13/12 06:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,011 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw... gregsdart I Live Here
gregsdart I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 10,011 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...	The grief I had with Jesel rocker arms is due to the offset on the intake valves in a 440-1 type head combined with a poor design for holding the intake rockers in place. Even with offset lifters the angle is enough to hammer the rocker arm over against the piece that it registers against. That piece is a little C clip on the rocker shaft that positions the rocker. It rides against the needle bearing cage in the rocker arm. The needle bearing cage wears on the C clip and actually thins them out over time and at some point they will break. The needle bearing cages get beaten up from the repeated impact every valve cycle and the edges crack, deform and then the needles inside the bearings seize and gall the shafts. If you don't catch it soon enough the bearings will come apart and the little needle bearing rollers will fall into the motor and find their way to the oil pump, seize it up and shear off the tip of your bronze gear distributor/pump drive shaft. And then you are waiting on the right size engine bearings to put your motor back together! I hope my -.001 rod bearings get hear tomorrow! Oh, forgot about the oil pump and expensive oil pump cover that also got destroyed. The end result of all this is over $1200 in repairs to just the rockers alone, and finally engineering a system for holding the rockers in place that doesn't rely on either the bearing cages or a C clip. So choose wisely, and hope you get many runs out of what ever you build 8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284305 08/14/12 02:09 AM 08/14/12 02:09 AM
Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 494 IL E EchoSixMike mopar
EchoSixMike mopar E Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 494 IL	The question you want to ask yourself is, "how far do you want to go?" If you're already replacing pistons(rods too?) and valvetrain, then B1's aren't that much more than -1's, and it's a lot more power if you want to build it. S/F....Ken M

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: EchoSixMike] #1284306 08/14/12 10:13 AM 08/14/12 10:13 AM
Joined: Mar 2009 Posts: 1,058 bigfork mn D dragram440 super stock
dragram440 super stock D Joined: Mar 2009 Posts: 1,058 bigfork mn	Just saw these on cragslist the other day. http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/dak/pts/3142675063.html 67' charger 499 RB 10.57 at 127

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: dragram440] #1284307 08/14/12 10:38 AM 08/14/12 10:38 AM
Joined: Feb 2008 Posts: 2,648 GA Boosted master
Boosted master Joined: Feb 2008 Posts: 2,648 GA	I like the 572-13's... That is what is on the Indy 528 we have.. 2011 RAM3500 1967 Fastback Barracuda with some go fast goodies.

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: Boosted] #1284308 08/14/12 01:30 PM 08/14/12 01:30 PM
Joined: Dec 2009 Posts: 83 Southern IL. J jafr OP member
jafr OP member J Joined: Dec 2009 Posts: 83 Southern IL.	I talked to Nick at Compu Flow yesterday he had a few options for me. Nick said he might be able to fix the torn up head or he could port a new head for me. When I mentioned that this ordeal had blown my budget for a new aftermarket block he said I might want to think about the 440-1 heads so that I would have room to grow in the future. I think most of you are thinking the same way as Nick on this. If anyone is intrested I would like to sell the SRs minus springs and retainers with the Harland Sharp 1.6 rockers. The heads had new valves put in them last year and the rockers were bought 3/11. I have the flow sheet etc. I don't know if the tore up head can be fixed or not. I would like to get $1000 for the heads and rockers. I figure that would cover most of the cost for a set of T&D rockers for the 440-1s

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284309 08/14/12 02:41 PM 08/14/12 02:41 PM
Joined: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,302 Nebraska 72Swinger master
72Swinger master Joined: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,302 Nebraska	I think it depends alot on what rpm do you want your peak power at. I think the -1s will want more rpm and the B1s even more. Mopar to the bone!!!

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284310 08/14/12 08:27 PM 08/14/12 08:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,152 SO. CAL. 7 70blackfish master
70blackfish master 7 Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,152 SO. CAL.	do you have a factory block...might want to think about the max hp on that.

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: 70blackfish] #1284311 08/15/12 07:26 AM 08/15/12 07:26 AM
Joined: Jun 2004 Posts: 294 Memphis TN B B1HEAD_USER enthusiast
B1HEAD_USER enthusiast B Joined: Jun 2004 Posts: 294 Memphis TN	Can you post pics of the damaged head?

Re: What Cylinder heads for a 499 low deck [Re: jafr] #1284312 08/15/12 08:02 AM 08/15/12 08:02 AM
Joined: Aug 2008 Posts: 4,072 Mo. racerx master
racerx master Joined: Aug 2008 Posts: 4,072 Mo.	Quote: Last night my Indy SR heads droped a valve seat which broke the valve and piston. I am now in the market for a new set of heads among other parts. My SRs worked very well after Nick at Comp U Flow ported them but I think it is time to move on and try a new head. I am looking at Indy 440-1s B-1 BS or Edelbrock Victors.These heads will be on a 499 low deck motor in a tube chassis 69 Dart. With the SR heads I was running low 5.70s in the 1/8th mile. All suggestions and opinions appreciated. Thanks, Joe What's the weight on your car?assuming under 3000 lbs

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