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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: Moparnut426]
#1230206
05/09/12 03:25 PM
05/09/12 03:25 PM
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 610
long time lurker, short time p...
PorkyPig
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 610
long time lurker, short time p...
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Hope this gets resolved.
Lets see - Customer thinks Builder did a poor job and doesnt want to give him another chance and Builder feels burned by Customer for going public with complaints without even attempting to have them resolved.
I think I have a better chance at solving world peace than those guys do at resolving this deal.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: Thumperdart]
#1230209
05/09/12 03:42 PM
05/09/12 03:42 PM
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 610
long time lurker, short time p...
PorkyPig
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 610
long time lurker, short time p...
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I said HOPE, not im sure it will LOL
I was refering to the "two sides to every story" part................ 
Its still two sides if Customer is claiming the lifters failed because of Builders spring choice and Builder says Customer provided used lifters of unknown history that may have already been hammered on before being put into use.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: PorkyPig]
#1230210
05/09/12 03:46 PM
05/09/12 03:46 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,013
Finally a HUSKER again
Moparnut426
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,013
Finally a HUSKER again
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I said HOPE, not im sure it will LOL
I was refering to the "two sides to every story" part................
Its still two sides if Customer is claiming the lifters failed because of Builders spring choice and Builder says Customer provided used lifters of unknown history that may have already been hammered on before being put into use.
I dont see how a lifter link bar can fail because of incorrect springs. 
I would think that if the lifter was getting into the block too far and the link bars were hitting the block then Ryan would have machined the lifter bores to clear the link bars.
I cant make it work in my head how the springs caused a failed lifter from them hitting....
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: jamesc]
#1230214
05/09/12 04:18 PM
05/09/12 04:18 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,544
Syracuse,NY
CompWedgeEngines
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,544
Syracuse,NY
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these things are rarely anything less than ugly. i have no affiliation with, nor do i know either of those involved so i take no position on this particular situation.
what i can say without question is that i personally know of a couple engines one of which i ended up working on that had such major unacceptable workmanship it's hard to describe.
both of these engines came from large nationally recognized shops (racing at professional levels) that just about anyone involved in drag racing would know of. one of the engines (not the one i worked on) ended up grenading.
having seen the two engines i did coming from the shops i mentioned left me horrified.
competition engine building can be a real risky business for both the builder and customer. often customers do or want to supply some or all of the components which in itself can lead to problems.
then the builder has no control over how the engine is handled after it leaves their shop. not a blanket statement nor directed to this situation but if a person doesn't have the ability to build their own engine (sans machine work) how can one know if they're even qualified to run and maintain it?
i've had many people approach me over the years about building engines and i've only done a handful. it's really bothered me to say no but the fear of these types of situations dissuades me from doing them.
the builder can never be certain or have control of what the customer does with the engine when it leaves their shop and the customer is at the mercy that the builder will deliver a properly assembled engine.
to make matters worse everyone makes mistakes and parts do fail. the builder can make a mistakes on assembly and/or the customer can make mistakes with their operation of the engine.
as much as i've always wanted to get into this business it's a tough crowd.
Off topic a touch here...
James, very well said. You get it. Its a very slippery slope, not nearly rewarding enough financially, and truer words could not have been spoken.  to you for understanding it( not necessarily this particular situation...but in general) all.
RIP Monte Smith
Your work is a reflection of yourself, autograph it with quality.
WD for Diamond Pistons,Sidewinder cylinder heads, Wiseco, K1 rods and cranks,BAM lifters, Morel lifters, Molnar Technologies, Harland Sharp, Pro Gear, Cometic, King Engine Bearings and many others.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: RyanJ]
#1230216
05/09/12 08:04 PM
05/09/12 08:04 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,410
Belpre,Ohio
CHAPPER
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,410
Belpre,Ohio
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I read your response, you state "by looking at the invoice..". I keep notes the whole time I am building an engine, as to any problems, things I have doubts/questions about, etc. It is not on a computer, it is hand written, dated, hour of the day, etc. This has saved me alot of problems over the years. If a customer has a problem with something, or thinks he is having a problem with something, or sees something a year later that he thinks is becoming a problem, I can look back at my notes and usually have a good idea what is happening. I am not busting anybody's chops here, just saying that I need more information than their old invoice when I talk to them. You can be 'REAL' sure, if any used parts, supplied by the customer, were involved in my builds, there will be notes to show that and any reccomendations I gave at the time. Hope this all works out. I have always said, "satisfied customers are never heard from, but, one unhappy customer is heard 'round the world". 
If you like drag racing, support your local track.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: Thumperdart]
#1230217
05/09/12 11:03 PM
05/09/12 11:03 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
408strokerdart
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
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Accidents and oversights is going to happen.. doesnt matter who you are and what your reputation is..
IMO what most important is those that stand up and take responsibility when they do screw up.. I'd like to know what Shady Dell has said to you about this mishap..
I have not contacted the shop. I know myself to well as to the action I might take if the result was not satisfactory so I choose not to. There is no excuse for the mistakes made. Looks like a high schooler put it together, only with parts he couldn't afford himself.
Man, this sucks for sure and hopefully you`ll be in good hands now. I`ve heard interesting things about your "builder" and I`ll keep em under my hat unless you want to pm me. I hope you EXCEED your goals and that this can be put to rest although I doubt it and sure would like to hear Ryans side.............  PETTIS PERFORMANCE............just ask Chris, Al and others.........one of the best hands down. 
Seems that most of the best builders in the country spend their time making horsepower rather than posting about how great they are. I absolutely agree that there are fantastic builders out there.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: 408strokerdart]
#1230218
05/09/12 11:18 PM
05/09/12 11:18 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 25
milton pa
mikegeyer340
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member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 25
milton pa
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Look im not sure exactly what went on in this situation , i have a engine built by shady dell any issues i ever had ryan was top notch in making sure that they were taken care of!!!
Ryan is one of the better engine builders in the country and i would have him build me another one without thinking twice
75 dart sport 340 ? @ ? shady dell 418 ci
73 challenger 440 12.93 @ 106 (gone)
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: FlyFish]
#1230219
05/09/12 11:23 PM
05/09/12 11:23 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
408strokerdart
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
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Accidents and oversights is going to happen.. doesnt matter who you are and what your reputation is..
IMO what most important is those that stand up and take responsibility when they do screw up.. I'd like to know what Shady Dell has said to you about this mishap..
I have not contacted the shop. I know myself to well as to the action I might take if the result was not satisfactory so I choose not to. There is no excuse for the mistakes made. Looks like a high schooler put it together, only with parts he couldn't afford himself.
If you are just stating facts, then please get your own story strait:
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...part=1&vc=1
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When did you check the lash prior to discovering this?
About 40 passes ago.
At the top of this post you claim to lash your valves ~ every 20 passes.
Everyone makes mistakes, sometimes BIG mistakes, it is how they are dealt with that matters more to me. The fact that you have not even contacted the builder (Shady Dell) and decided to trash them publicly is VERY poor form indeed. Give the man a chance to at least TRY to set things right....there are usually 2 sides to a story.
Getting the "story" straight is easy. I lash the valves every 20 passes (guess I mis-typed before).
Not really sure why everyone expects me to contact the original builder. The heads have been fixed, the block has been fixed, crank fixed, pistons are geting coated,rods are being made, new cam has been bought and ground, etc... Shadydell is 1300 miles from me...maybe I load the engine up and take it by his shop? Or maybe I can ship it to the one who screwed the pooch in the first place, that couldn't cost more than $400 to $500 each way. Or maybe he will just cut me a check to fix all of the damage....$6,500 will cover it if I take nothing for my time.
Maybe you should get some facts about reality. Possibly you would like to send him a big donation so he can right his mistakes? Looks like you get the title of bleeding heart liberal #2.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: B3422W5]
#1230220
05/09/12 11:25 PM
05/09/12 11:25 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
408strokerdart
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
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I will not return my parts to someone (even on their dime) if they already proved they couldn't get it right the first time. These fundamental errors were there from the start.
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I have not contacted the shop. I know myself to well as to the action I might take if the result was not satisfactory so I choose not to.
Are you saying that you haven't even contacted Ryan about this now-public issue and his first knowledge of it will probably be reading it on here? 
I think what the OP is saying is that the mistakes made are just flat stupid, and the fact the motor was put together like that seriously undermines the OP's ability to trust anything the builder could do to make things right.
I had issue as well with the same builder over several different things with work i had done, but its water under the bridge now.
I give the OP a ton of credit for correctly pointing out what he did.
Thanks.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: Moparnut426]
#1230221
05/09/12 11:38 PM
05/09/12 11:38 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
408strokerdart
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
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Accidents and oversights is going to happen.. doesnt matter who you are and what your reputation is..
IMO what most important is those that stand up and take responsibility when they do screw up.. I'd like to know what Shady Dell has said to you about this mishap..
I have not contacted the shop. I know myself to well as to the action I might take if the result was not satisfactory so I choose not to. There is no excuse for the mistakes made. Looks like a high schooler put it together, only with parts he couldn't afford himself.
If you are just stating facts, then please get your own story strait:
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...part=1&vc=1
Quote:
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When did you check the lash prior to discovering this?
About 40 passes ago.
At the top of this post you claim to lash your valves ~ every 20 passes.
Everyone makes mistakes, sometimes BIG mistakes, it is how they are dealt with that matters more to me. The fact that you have not even contacted the builder (Shady Dell) and decided to trash them publicly is VERY poor form indeed. Give the man a chance to at least TRY to set things right....there are usually 2 sides to a story.
I agree about contacting him prior to posting, but this dude isnt worried about sending his stuff back to someone who messed it up in the first place, If he was worried about the cost, which he dosnt seem to be, then take it back to the origional guy. But in this case, he is PISSED, and just wants a running engine again. As for seeing what Ryan will do about it, thats up to him and the customer. I havent seen a peep out of Ryan in a while, I dont know if we will hear anything on this post from him either.
Ryan knows of the issues and has since my first post about my tear down. He either sent PM's to some people or sent some email to a few select folks. I got nothing.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: 408strokerdart]
#1230222
05/09/12 11:38 PM
05/09/12 11:38 PM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,090
north cakalaky
instigator
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,090
north cakalaky
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A 4 year old motor.......oh my god.....50 passes or 5 passes......something broke......you speculate what happened..and I use that loosely....and then bash someone 4 years later....I sure wish I could type what I am really thinking.....I would probably be booted....
some people I have no desire to deal with and you would be one of those types.
65 Barracuda
All aluminum Indy HEMI with some boost!
COMING TO A TRACK NEAR YOU!
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: 408strokerdart]
#1230223
05/09/12 11:41 PM
05/09/12 11:41 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 25
milton pa
mikegeyer340
member
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member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 25
milton pa
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Maybe next time you will not be so cheap and buy new rocker arms and lifters. Expensive lesson
75 dart sport 340 ? @ ? shady dell 418 ci
73 challenger 440 12.93 @ 106 (gone)
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