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Re: Cam duration vs cubic inches [Re: emarine01] #1082457
03/26/12 06:12 AM
03/26/12 06:12 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,633
in a cattle trailer down by th...
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Guitar Jones Offline
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,633
in a cattle trailer down by th...
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From the 4 inch throw small block posts on here over the years It seems that the smaller cid 408 to 416 with good heads 300cfm to 330cfm make peek power around 6500 to 6800 with cams in the 260 to 270 @.050 range.... There really are too many variables for a rule approach




Well my cam is 276 @ .050 and I need it to turn 7000-7200. I don't think that will be a problem.


I would think with 276 on the intake low 7s would be easy, Are you gona advance it 4*




Actually it should have been in at 108 but I had to move it to 104 to get valve to piston clearance.


.... you run that much exhaust duration & lift... Must be a nitrous engine




The exh is 284 @ .050 with .714 net lift. Not a nitrous engine, but it does have a TR and 2 750 Demons. It's a SS grind I got from a SS racer friend that only had about 20 dyno pulls on it. He said they made 650HP with it but they were still looking for another 30 HP. I don't know what they were twisting it to but I'm sure it was over 8000.


How did the new engine work out? Did it pull as you expected?




Yes it pulls fine to 7200, I just can't give any definitive numbers on it as the torque converter hub broke on the burnout and it was peeing fluid out the whole pass but what it ran is in my sig. I just finished putting my repaired, improved and stall adjusted converter back in the car yeaterday. I also took the 2.76 1st gear out. Hopefully I'll get to make a few passes this Sunday with it.


"Follow me the wise man said, but he walked behind"


'92 D250 Club Cab CTD, 47RH conversion, pump tweaks, injectors, rear disc and hydroboost conversion.
'74 W200 Crew Cab 360, NV4500, D44, D60 and NP205 divorced transfer case. Rear disc and hydroboost coming soon!
2019 1500 Long Horn Crew Cab 4WD, 5.7 Hemi.
Re: Cam duration vs cubic inches [Re: emarine01] #1082458
03/26/12 07:33 AM
03/26/12 07:33 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,074
detroit, mi
POS Dakota Offline
super stock
POS Dakota  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,074
detroit, mi
I would say that when picking a cam DURATION, the focus needs to be based more on the stroke than the overall cubic inches.

You can have a 5 inch bore, or a 4 inch bore. They both travel the same distance down the bore and spend the same time doing so in degrees of crank rotation, (no?) so I would say that generally they would both need roughly the same duration as one another and that the larger bore for example would need not necessarily more duration, but more of an opening to breathe through (larger cylinder head port and maybe higher valve lift) than the smaller bore, but not necessarily duration. A larger cylinder bore (larger cubic inches) isnt going to benefit from hanging the valve open any longer than the smaller bore.

Now take (again as an example) a 4 inch stroke and a 5 inch stroke.
The 5 inch stroke is going to have a piston travelling down the cylinder on the intake stroke (for example) for a longer length of time empasized in degrees of crank rotation than the 4 inch stroke. So by that virtue, you are going to want to open the valve for a longer time in crank degrees of rotation on the 5 inch stroke than the 4 inch stroke as the 5 inch stroke is spending more time creating a depression in the intake port, or breathing in.

So I would say that when picking a duration for a cam. It is really more reliant for the most part on what the stroke is than the actual cubic inches.

I briefly skimmed through the thread and correct me if I am wrong, but I didnt see any mention of stroke...but this is why an engine that has a longer stroke (408 over a 360) needs more duration, and also explains why the 360 with too much duration becomes a dog.

Think about that for a second....the 360 with 270 @.050 lobe isnt able to make the vac that the 408 would because the valves are open too long and a lot of that fuel isnt being retained in the cylinder to be burned, or even exhausted.

And this is why the 360 will have the higher powerband, and the same cam in the 408 will have a few hundred less rpm. Because of the stroke. Not really because of the cubic inches.

If I had a 360 and 408, (one larger than the other only because of bore size and not stroke for example) I would only want a larger port feeding the larger bore, and maybe more valve lift to help ensure that since the larger bore will indeed breathe in more air than the 360, but it's still spending the same amount of time doing so as the 360.

With a longer stroke, there is more time spent in degrees of crank rotation breathing in and that is where duration comes into play.

Re: Cam duration vs cubic inches [Re: POS Dakota] #1082459
03/26/12 11:57 AM
03/26/12 11:57 AM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
polyspheric Offline
master
polyspheric  Offline
master

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
Not really.


Boffin Emeritus
Re: Cam duration vs cubic inches [Re: polyspheric] #1082460
03/26/12 04:00 PM
03/26/12 04:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,695
nc
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emarine01 Offline OP
master
emarine01  Offline OP
master
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,695
nc
Quote:

Not really.


Hey Jeff Can you expand on that thought a little?

Re: Cam duration vs cubic inches [Re: emarine01] #1082461
03/26/12 08:04 PM
03/26/12 08:04 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
polyspheric Offline
master
polyspheric  Offline
master

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
More mistakes than content = too much work.


Boffin Emeritus
Re: Cam duration vs cubic inches [Re: polyspheric] #1082462
03/26/12 08:09 PM
03/26/12 08:09 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,595
On the south side of Nowhere
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S/ST 3040 Offline
master
S/ST 3040  Offline
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Posts: 4,595
On the south side of Nowhere
Quote:

More mistakes than content = too much work.




I have to agree.

Re: Cam duration vs cubic inches [Re: S/ST 3040] #1082463
03/26/12 09:09 PM
03/26/12 09:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,695
nc
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emarine01 Offline OP
master
emarine01  Offline OP
master
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,695
nc
There are surly some mistakes but...If you read into the content, I think some of it is just the wording is wrong.... just simple stuff like time & speed. Even though its not technically correct, if you think about some of the opinions they have merit or express another way to look at things, most of the greatest achievements on this planet stemmed from mistakes. I understand why you don't post the long version anymore.... but bother to comment.... Vic, this was not to you.

Last edited by emarine01; 03/26/12 09:17 PM.
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