Edelbrock gets hot
#942559
03/04/11 03:27 PM
03/04/11 03:27 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 114 Gainesville, FL
CSSRegistry
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Hello Moparts, i have been chasing down some different problems on my 1964 Dodge D100 and this site has been great in helping sort them out. the one i am addressing today is the 440 that is powering the truck has had an issue when i have been driving the truck for any length of time when it is fully warmed up and i stop at a parts store or whatever, go in and get what i need and then return on my way. the truck will start fine but when i give it anything more than 1/3 throttle it bogs like it is starving for fuel. it seems like the carb is soaking up heat from the intake crossover. i have tried a couple of heat insulator gaskets and even changed out the carb, coil, distributor but i keep coming back to heat soak. specs are Edelbrock 800 AVS with electronic choke on a basically stock 1969 440 with the following mods - Mopar Peformance dual plane aluminum intake, CompCams dual energy cam and a pertronix in a dual point distributor with a flame thrower coil. i am also using a (reall loud) Holley Blue fuel pump and match pressure regulator set at 6 PSI. i have switched out the pertronix with a tried and true Mopar Electronic ignition with no change in the heat soak/bog. i have gone up and down with fuel pump pressure with no change. my question is: if i buy a valley pan that blocks off the intake cross-over-heat riser would i expect any negative effects from doing so? thank you in advance for any advice. Ben
1963-1967 Dodge Custom Sports Special
and High Performance Package REGISTRY
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Re: Edelbrock gets hot
[Re: CSSRegistry]
#942560
03/04/11 03:47 PM
03/04/11 03:47 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,220 toronto canada
69chargeryeehaa
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,220
toronto canada
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I've had the same problems as you have....a long long time ago. have you tried a 1" spacer? there's some spectrum (sp?) company that sells spacers, and they have a neat removable center piece that can be open or a 4 hole spacer....i used the 4 hole spacer on mine (on a 440 with dual plane intake eddy CH4B) and the difference was night and day...i like you tried the like 1/4" eddy thick gasket and still had a heat problem. after i put on this 1" job it totally completely disappeared, and the 4-hole spacer had a second benefit, and just ran much nicer by giving the carb better signal to the barrels...so my off-idle stumble disappeared as well... also how are your fuel lines routed? do you have a return for a vapor separator as well?
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Re: Edelbrock gets hot
[Re: CSSRegistry]
#942562
03/04/11 04:07 PM
03/04/11 04:07 PM
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,564 St. Clair Shores, Michigan
bigsbigelow
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,564
St. Clair Shores, Michigan
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Quote:
Quote:
I've had the same problems as you have....a long long time ago. have you tried a 1" spacer? there's some spectrum (sp?) company that sells spacers, and they have a neat removable center piece that can be open or a 4 hole spacer....i used the 4 hole spacer on mine (on a 440 with dual plane intake eddy CH4B) and the difference was night and day...i like you tried the like 1/4" eddy thick gasket and still had a heat problem. after i put on this 1" job it totally completely disappeared, and the 4-hole spacer had a second benefit, and just ran much nicer by giving the carb better signal to the barrels...so my off-idle stumble disappeared as well... also how are your fuel lines routed? do you have a return for a vapor separator as well?
the fuel line is well away from any hot spot but it does tuck in the front below the alternator and sneaks in between the distributor and head. i have rerouted it twice in an effort to keep it away from the block and the head.
i have not tried a one inch spacer. i was considering a heat sheild/spacer set up like this:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MRG-3710/
but then i saw this valley pan and got to thinking: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEL-1215/
i would use it without the paper gaskets.
i got rid of my off-idle stumble by using stiffer rod springs and a little richer on both stepups on the rods. it would be nice to lean it out a little as the plugs read rich.
Ben
This is what I personally would do, block off the heat crossover and run a short four hole spacer to help throttle response. I look at it this way, an aluminum intake is supposed to help keep the fuel and air mixture cool, why heat it up with a crossover?
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Re: Edelbrock gets hot
[Re: CSSRegistry]
#942563
03/04/11 04:13 PM
03/04/11 04:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,220 toronto canada
69chargeryeehaa
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,220
toronto canada
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Quote:
the fuel line is well away from any hot spot but it does tuck in the front below the alternator and sneaks in between the distributor and head. i have rerouted it twice in an effort to keep it away from the block and the head.
i have not tried a one inch spacer. i was considering a heat sheild/spacer set up like this:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MRG-3710/
but then i saw this valley pan and got to thinking: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEL-1215/
i would use it without the paper gaskets.
i got rid of my off-idle stumble by using stiffer rod springs and a little richer on both stepups on the rods. it would be nice to lean it out a little as the plugs read rich.
Ben
I tried tuning out the off idle stumble with the metering rods and springs, ect...my jetting was spot on, but it just had this tiny little stumble that would not go away with my taller tires on it was noticeable (28" tall and 3.23 gear) with stock magnums the stumble was gone... anyways back on topic, your fuel line routing sounds stock...that's should be ok....do you have the exhaust heat ports blocked in the manifold? that can cause it to run a little hotter...but honestly i was almost ready to accept the problem until i saw the 1" spacer kinda like this one: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-8711/ but with the removable center...that really did it for me, absolutely no problem at all no matter how hot it is outside.... i would try the spacer first, it's really easy to install and since you have a truck it should not give you hood clearance issues like i had; i had to use a drop base to clear the hood...also my heat crossover ports are blocked....almost considered a must with after market intake i would think?
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Re: Edelbrock gets hot
[Re: 69chargeryeehaa]
#942564
03/04/11 04:33 PM
03/04/11 04:33 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 114 Gainesville, FL
CSSRegistry
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OP
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Posts: 114
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Quote:
I tried tuning out the off idle stumble with the metering rods and springs, ect...my jetting was spot on, but it just had this tiny little stumble that would not go away with my taller tires on it was noticeable (28" tall and 3.23 gear) with stock magnums the stumble was gone... anyways back on topic, your fuel line routing sounds stock...that's should be ok....do you have the exhaust heat ports blocked in the manifold? that can cause it to run a little hotter...but honestly i was almost ready to accept the problem until i saw the 1" spacer kinda like this one: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-8711/ but with the removable center...that really did it for me, absolutely no problem at all no matter how hot it is outside.... i would try the spacer first, it's really easy to install and since you have a truck it should not give you hood clearance issues like i had; i had to use a drop base to clear the hood...also my heat crossover ports are blocked....almost considered a must with after market intake i would think?
Quote:
This is what I personally would do, block off the heat crossover and run a short four hole spacer to help throttle response. I look at it this way, an aluminum intake is supposed to help keep the fuel and air mixture cool, why heat it up with a crossover?
aside from the valley pan with the heat riser blocked off what is the best way to block it? weld up the manifold?
i would hate to make a "permanent" change like that and chance warping the intake.
i'll probably try the spacer - i have plenty of vertical room but i do have one small interference issue with the cowl mounted hood centering pin.
it sits just above the air cleaner:
thanks for the advice!
Ben
1963-1967 Dodge Custom Sports Special
and High Performance Package REGISTRY
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Re: Edelbrock gets hot
[Re: dcr]
#942567
03/04/11 06:24 PM
03/04/11 06:24 PM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,216 Under My Car
Mopar_Country
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Apr 2010
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Under My Car
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"my question is: if i buy a valley pan that blocks off the intake cross-over-heat riser would i expect any negative effects from doing so?" No, it might take a touch longer to warm up is all. And nice truck!
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Re: Edelbrock gets hot
[Re: Mopar_Country]
#942569
03/04/11 07:51 PM
03/04/11 07:51 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 114 Gainesville, FL
CSSRegistry
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Posts: 114
Gainesville, FL
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"And nice truck"
Thanks man - it was a labor of love.
1963-1967 Dodge Custom Sports Special
and High Performance Package REGISTRY
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Re: Edelbrock gets hot
[Re: CSSRegistry]
#942572
03/04/11 08:53 PM
03/04/11 08:53 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312 Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
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Just wondering about timing and maybe it's a little lean. Running either not enough timing at idle or not enough fuel under load can cause your problems. Got a fuel pressure gauge you can see when it acts up? Those blue pumps want to move a lot of gas, If there a restriction on the suction side they will vapor lock pretty easy nowadays with todays gas. Too much fuel pressure will also cause your problem. 220 degrees is too hot, it shouldn't go from 180-220, something up. Unless you just got done climbing Peaks Pike or something. Just a couple things to check.
Last edited by Challenger 1; 03/04/11 09:01 PM.
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Re: Edelbrock gets hot
[Re: CSSRegistry]
#942578
03/04/11 11:23 PM
03/04/11 11:23 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 114 Gainesville, FL
CSSRegistry
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Thanks for all the input so far.
Re: temp. I guess i need to clarify what i mean by 180-220+
I drive the truck somewhere. I turn it off for 5 or 10 minutes. During that time the water in the block heats up since it is not circulating. I get back in the truck and turn the key on - I do not start it. The temp reads 180-220+. I start the truck and within a couple minutes it is reading a steady 180 in normal traffic. Carb bogs at heavy throttle but drive normally under light throttle. After a few minutes of normal small town traffic it clears up and then i am able to floor it without a bog.
Ben
1963-1967 Dodge Custom Sports Special
and High Performance Package REGISTRY
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