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Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question #760960 07/29/10 07:18 PM 07/29/10 07:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,041 Oregon A AndyF OP I Win
AndyF OP I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,041 Oregon	Anyone know when the Mopar cars switched from leaf springs to trailing arm rear suspension? I took some pictures of an older Grand National (maybe a Winston Cup) car this week and it still had leaf springs in it. The car is probably from the late 60's or early 70's. K frame car with torsion bars, Mopar power steering, etc. Obviously a factory frame car but heavily modified. The drive side torsion bar had a jack on it that could be adjusted by the driver to change the preload. Production lower control arms, drum brakes, tubular upper control arms, spline type anti-sway bar, etc. Pretty cool stuff to look at but the rear leaf springs surprised me. I just thought everyone had gone with the pickup truck type suspension back in the 60's.

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: AndyF] #760961 07/29/10 07:53 PM 07/29/10 07:53 PM
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Late '60's is when Junior Johnson started using the truck arms on Ford applications and they were mandated across the board shortly thereafter. Not sure of the exact year.

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question #760962 07/29/10 08:13 PM 07/29/10 08:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,041 Oregon A AndyF OP I Win
AndyF OP I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,041 Oregon	Here is a shot of the cage structure. The leaf spring hanger is just barely in the shot over to the bottom left corner. Not sure what year this car was built but it appeared to be a late 60's B body from what I could see. K frame is still there as is most of the front suspension, steering box, etc. Battery is behind the passenger front tire rather than in the back wheel well. 6112184-GNcage.jpg (1221 downloads)

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: AndyF] #760963 07/29/10 09:33 PM 07/29/10 09:33 PM
Joined: Dec 2004 Posts: 10,554 Rittman Ohio fourgearsavoy I Live Here
fourgearsavoy I Live Here Joined: Dec 2004 Posts: 10,554 Rittman Ohio	I believe Banjo Mathews started putting truck arms on B-bodies in late '67 Gus 64 Plymouth Savoy 493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow 5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box Dana 60

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: fourgearsavoy] #760964 07/29/10 10:26 PM 07/29/10 10:26 PM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,505 TN S SCATPACK 1 pro stock
SCATPACK 1 pro stock S Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,505 TN	Quote: I believe Banjo Mathews started putting truck arms on B-bodies in late '67 Gus Nope, in 1974 Petty and Baker in the K&K Charger along with the other Dodges were all using leaf springs. After Nascar mandated tiny carbs for the big blocks, K&K boycotted the rest of the year and that was the end of bib blocks in Nascar. But Nascar wasn't thru and mandated the truck control arms in 75 for all cars to remove the supposed leaaf spring advantage Petty enjoyed over the other makes. Petty won 13 races in 73 and Baker won another 4 giving Dodge 17 wins out of the 30 races ran that year. Can you imagine how quickly Nascar would change the rules if Dodge won 1/2 of the races this year. By the way, if your car still had the torsion bar adjusting bolts inside the driver compartment, it had to be a 69 or older as Nascar outlawed any thing that allowed the driver to adjust the suspension while racing in 70. It was considered an unfair advantage for the Mopars. Old Geezer Racing

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: SCATPACK 1] #760965 07/29/10 11:29 PM 07/29/10 11:29 PM
Joined: Aug 2009 Posts: 2,046 Mooresburg, Tn ' '72CudaRacer top fuel
'72CudaRacer top fuel ' Joined: Aug 2009 Posts: 2,046 Mooresburg, Tn	One of the funniest comments about those cars came from Buddy Baker a while back. He was ask how did he think the car that he set the closed course speed record with (now in the museum at Talladega) would do with todays knowledge, tires ect. His remark- "back then (1970) those cars were top shelf equipment. I look at that car in the museum now, and I wouldn't climb out of the electric chair to drive it today". My, how far they've come in 40 years

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: SCATPACK 1] #760966 07/30/10 12:33 AM 07/30/10 12:33 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,041 Oregon A AndyF OP I Win
AndyF OP I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,041 Oregon	Here is the torsion adjuster in front of the driver's seat. Guess the driver just carried a wrench with him and cranked the left side up or down as needed. 6112576-torsion.jpg (406 downloads)

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: SCATPACK 1] #760967 07/30/10 12:37 AM 07/30/10 12:37 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,041 Oregon A AndyF OP I Win
AndyF OP I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,041 Oregon	Here is another GN era car. This one is a little different but roughly the same era. This car has the K frame moved up into the frame and welded in place. 6112582-GNroller.jpg (545 downloads)

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: AndyF] #760968 07/30/10 01:37 AM 07/30/10 01:37 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,468 So Cal autoxcuda Too Many Posts
autoxcuda Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,468 So Cal	Quote: Here is another GN era car. This one is a little different but roughly the same era. This car has the K frame moved up into the frame and welded in place. Hey, I've seen that before. Nothing like picking up a possible wing car for under $3K. Seller advertised it as a kit car. IIRC, I yanked the buyer out of his swap spot to check this cool car out. Later I heard he bought it and drug it home.

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: AndyF] #760969 07/30/10 01:51 AM 07/30/10 01:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,468 So Cal autoxcuda Too Many Posts
autoxcuda Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,468 So Cal	Quote: Anyone know when the Mopar cars switched from leaf springs to trailing arm rear suspension? I took some pictures of an older Grand National (maybe a Winston Cup) car this week and it still had leaf springs in it. The car is probably from the late 60's or early 70's. K frame car with torsion bars, Mopar power steering, etc. Obviously a factory frame car but heavily modified. The drive side torsion bar had a jack on it that could be adjusted by the driver to change the preload. Production lower control arms, drum brakes, tubular upper control arms, spline type anti-sway bar, etc. Pretty cool stuff to look at but the rear leaf springs surprised me. I just thought everyone had gone with the pickup truck type suspension back in the 60's. I really don't think any Mopar GN cars ran trailing arms. Even the last Arrington cars. I'd ask Aero426 (Doug Schleinger) The 1974 Petty Catalog shows leafs and T-bars. His last Charger in 1976 had leafs. The Petty Magnum had leafs. In Stock Car Racing It said he ran 8 3/4 rear ends adapted to the Chevy Monte Carlos truck arm cars he ran after he stopped running the Dodge Magnums. Just to use up the 100's of gearsets and parts he had on hand.

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question #760970 07/30/10 04:04 AM 07/30/10 04:04 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,468 So Cal autoxcuda Too Many Posts
autoxcuda Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,468 So Cal	Quote: Late '60's is when Junior Johnson started using the truck arms on Ford applications and they were mandated across the board shortly thereafter. Not sure of the exact year. No. Petty ran leafs on his last Mopar in 78.

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: autoxcuda] #760971 07/30/10 11:23 PM 07/30/10 11:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 971 Mooresville, NC A70Runner super stock
A70Runner super stock Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 971 Mooresville, NC	I am restoring a Jimmy Means 1976 Laguna stock car (Started as a older 73-74 Monte Carlo/Chevelle Old #12 car which is pretty Ironic considering I work on the 12 car now) Anyway...It has a truck arm susspention. I think back then it was all by who built the chassis. Who's car was it? Looks petty blue or Marcis blue hard to tell in the pictures. "People Think I'm Insane Because I Am Frowning All The Time" Black Sabbath

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: A70Runner] #760972 07/31/10 01:01 PM 07/31/10 01:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,129 Vermont T TrWaters top fuel
TrWaters top fuel T Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,129 Vermont	The Chrysler kit cars of the late 70's all used torsion bars and leafs. TR Waters

Re: Winston Cup (or GN) rear suspension question [Re: '72CudaRacer] #760973 12/31/14 05:12 PM 12/31/14 05:12 PM
Joined: Mar 2012 Posts: 113 s.e. MI O odcics2 member
odcics2 member O Joined: Mar 2012 Posts: 113 s.e. MI	Quote: One of the funniest comments about those cars came from Buddy Baker a while back. He was ask how did he think the car that he set the closed course speed record with (now in the museum at Talladega) would do with todays knowledge, tires ect. His remark- "back then (1970) those cars were top shelf equipment. I look at that car in the museum now, and I wouldn't climb out of the electric chair to drive it today". My, how far they've come in 40 years Thought everyone knew the real #88 is in Detroit, being restored... check this out!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdwhM5xB-8Y turn up the sound!

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