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Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$ ( PICS) #485928
10/02/09 08:03 AM
10/02/09 08:03 AM
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Wichita,KS
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Blakcharger440 Offline OP
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Pulled the valve covers off to get the lash adjusted on my 512RB engine and noticed that the oil was blackened with a very fine dust. I then noticed that a couple of my rockers were just a little loose according to gap. The rocker assembly is a new Crane Gold Rocker 1.5 shaft kit. When the rocker assembly was pulled I noticed on a couple of the rockers that they were rubbing on the shafts causing a very fine aluminum dust to show up in my oil!
There isnt any damage to the pushrods or anything else that i could see and the rockers are not touching the retainers causing interference there either.
Since I was at a friends shop it was put back together,lash was set hot at .018 Intake/.020 Exhaust per the Hughes cam specs.I drove it home (about 2 miles) and parked it.
I pulled the valve covers and dumped the oil last night along with the filter.

I got on the phone and spoke with Summit about the Crane Gold Rocker set as I didnt even have 100 miles on the engine yet. They gave me almost full credit for the price of the Cranes. I then shelled out some more money and purchased a Harland Sharp 1.5 roller rocker kit.

My cam is a Hughes 579/587 256/260 with Smith brothers push rods and the Cranes were 1.5
I should be able to just install the Harland Sharp 1.5 Rockers and be fine shouldnt it???

As long as the rockers and stuff fit okay with no interference to the retainers?

Is there anything else I should know or any tips before installing the set of Harland Sharp 1.5 rocker shaft kit on my engine?

What should lash be cold if the Hughes cam specs are Hot .018 Intake/ .020 Exhaust????

OR do I really need to seriously think about pulling the engine out,disassembly,cleaning and putting it back together? Which everytime I think about just bums me out.

I would like to hear some input. Thanks guys.

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: Blakcharger440] #485929
10/02/09 09:07 AM
10/02/09 09:07 AM
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Illinois
moparmattkos Offline
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Um idk the exact info for that cam but that seems like a pretty tight lash to me


www.sikosracing.net Heads up Drag racing
Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: moparmattkos] #485930
10/02/09 09:38 AM
10/02/09 09:38 AM
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W. Kentucky
justinp61 Offline
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Quote:

Um idk the exact info for that cam but that seems like a pretty tight lash to me




The lash is correct, my Hughes 260/266 is the same. I set mine .015/.017 cold.

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: justinp61] #485931
10/02/09 09:48 AM
10/02/09 09:48 AM
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emarine01 Offline
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If the harland sharps are roller bearing and the cranes weren't you need the hardened rocker shafts,

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: emarine01] #485932
10/02/09 09:51 AM
10/02/09 09:51 AM
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acworth / N. georgia - south e...
cheapstreetdustr Offline
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also if your shafts are on backwards
you wont get oil to the lube them.
cheapst


365" Iron J heads,,3480lbs best 1.39 60ft on SS springs.10.54,124 mph ...6.67 1/8th et.average 60fts 1.46 w/ small cam &.063 no2 pill tagged & insured
[image][/image]
Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: emarine01] #485933
10/02/09 10:28 AM
10/02/09 10:28 AM
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Wichita,KS
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Blakcharger440 Offline OP
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Quote:

If the harland sharps are roller bearing and the cranes weren't you need the hardened rocker shafts,




I am getting the full Harland Sharp rocker kit which comes with the hardened shafts.

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: cheapstreetdustr] #485934
10/02/09 10:32 AM
10/02/09 10:32 AM
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Wichita,KS
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Blakcharger440 Offline OP
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Quote:

also if your shafts are on backwards
you wont get oil to the lube them.
cheapst




Yep, that is a good point and this was the first thing that was checked and the shaft oiling holes were pointed in the correct direction as the damage to the inside on some of the rockers prove that the shaft was installed correctly.

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: Blakcharger440] #485935
10/02/09 10:35 AM
10/02/09 10:35 AM
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Blakcharger440 Offline OP
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On the Harland Sharp website it says oil restrictors may be necessary to main oil pressure.

Where do I get these oil restrictors at??? Or if I can make some is it very hard to do?

And how do I know if oil restrictors are needed...if my oil pressure is very low?

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: Blakcharger440] #485936
10/02/09 10:45 AM
10/02/09 10:45 AM
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Indiana
maxie Offline
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this may be a little off the wall, but I will share my stupidity to see if helps out another person.

I ran the crane golds and broke two of the shafts and couldnt figure out why. One broke while I was at the mopar nationals and we pulled the valve cover to see what had happened seen the shaft was broke again. I went and bought a set of harland sharps with all the mounting hardware and so on. Come to find out I was using to long of bolts. The bolts were bottoming out and the shaft wasnt secured inplace, just sort trapped in there.


Put on the harlands and never had it happen again, plus the HP gain.

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*! [Re: Blakcharger440] #485937
10/02/09 10:47 AM
10/02/09 10:47 AM
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gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4 Offline
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I would think that you used a stock non hardened shaft to ruin the crane rockers, Do you have aluminum heads? That lash setting seems tight ,might be for iron heads, when hot with aluminum heads your lash would open up about .006-7, iron would not. What was you oil pressure before? If it was good ,don't worry about restricting the oil to the heads.



it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*! [Re: rowin4] #485938
10/02/09 10:52 AM
10/02/09 10:52 AM
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Mt.Vernon ,Ohio
VernMotor Offline
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What are you torque to shafts to..should be 25lb

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*! [Re: rowin4] #485939
10/02/09 12:02 PM
10/02/09 12:02 PM
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Blakcharger440 Offline OP
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Quote:

I would think that you used a stock non hardened shaft to ruin the crane rockers, Do you have aluminum heads? That lash setting seems tight ,might be for iron heads, when hot with aluminum heads your lash would open up about .006-7, iron would not. What was you oil pressure before? If it was good ,don't worry about restricting the oil to the heads.






The shafts that I am using came with the Crane Gold Rocker kit.
I have aluminum Stealth heads.
My oil pressure was fine as it was 75 to 85.

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*! [Re: rowin4] #485940
10/02/09 12:11 PM
10/02/09 12:11 PM
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Blakcharger440 Offline OP
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Quote:

I would think that you used a stock non hardened shaft to ruin the crane rockers, Do you have aluminum heads? That lash setting seems tight ,might be for iron heads, when hot with aluminum heads your lash would open up about .006-7, iron would not. What was you oil pressure before? If it was good ,don't worry about restricting the oil to the heads.






I just spoke to a tech guy at Hughes Engines and he informed me that the lash should be .006 less than when hot for aluminum heads.

So cold mine should be .012 int/.014 ex and to re-check them with the engine hot to see if they are .018/.020 and if not adjust them so that they are.

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: maxie] #485941
10/02/09 12:22 PM
10/02/09 12:22 PM
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JohnRR Offline
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Quote:

this may be a little off the wall, but I will share my stupidity to see if helps out another person.

I ran the crane golds and broke two of the shafts and couldnt figure out why. One broke while I was at the mopar nationals and we pulled the valve cover to see what had happened seen the shaft was broke again. I went and bought a set of harland sharps with all the mounting hardware and so on. Come to find out I was using to long of bolts. The bolts were bottoming out and the shaft wasnt secured inplace, just sort trapped in there.


Put on the harlands and never had it happen again, plus the HP gain.




Unless I'm missing something here I can't see how that is possible unless, like the old ersons, the cranes used a smaller than factory diameter shaft , the ersons came with a spacer that went around the shaft to make it fit properly though ...

just thinking out loud ...

but good thing to make note of and check .

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: Blakcharger440] #485942
10/02/09 01:10 PM
10/02/09 01:10 PM
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Been there with you, black aluminum all over the place with new rockers and cam. Did it twice matter of fact cause I figured it was me, not the parts. Shafts shot, rockers shot. Came to the conclusion of not enough oil to the top end. Duh!

Now I assume you oil through the heads.

What I found was that the cam bearing had a misalignment with the oil holes in the block and maybe with the holes in that cam journal. The bottom hole is nice and wide, but the top holes are not. Gives you a misleading idea of how much room for error. it showed lots of oil while priming the oils system but not when running.

I pulled the cam, no damage. Did not want to mess with the cam bearing, so I chamfered the oil hole in the cam journal, increasing the "pulse width" of the oil shot going to the heads and rockers. Problem solved.

Change your oil a bunch o times to get rid of the Al fines.

I have crane golds, Eddie Heads, Hughes 242 solid cam.


Dallas

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: Blakcharger440] #485943
10/02/09 01:11 PM
10/02/09 01:11 PM
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maximum entropy Offline
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could there have been day-bree in the shafts? i've not seen it in the cranes, but several other brands i've seen all manor of machining/polishing detritus within the shafts. were they disassembled completely (including end plugs) and cleaned before installation?


for what is the good life if not doing things thoughtfully?
Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: maximum entropy] #485944
10/02/09 01:18 PM
10/02/09 01:18 PM
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ademon Offline
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good tip by Mr71bee, i had two engines done and both times i had them tweek the cam bearing to open up more of the oil hole. have to double check everything!!

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: Mr71Bee] #485945
10/02/09 06:25 PM
10/02/09 06:25 PM
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Wichita,KS
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Blakcharger440 Offline OP
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Quote:

Been there with you, black aluminum all over the place with new rockers and cam. Did it twice matter of fact cause I figured it was me, not the parts. Shafts shot, rockers shot. Came to the conclusion of not enough oil to the top end. Duh!

Now I assume you oil through the heads.

What I found was that the cam bearing had a misalignment with the oil holes in the block and maybe with the holes in that cam journal. The bottom hole is nice and wide, but the top holes are not. Gives you a misleading idea of how much room for error. it showed lots of oil while priming the oils system but not when running.

I pulled the cam, no damage. Did not want to mess with the cam bearing, so I chamfered the oil hole in the cam journal, increasing the "pulse width" of the oil shot going to the heads and rockers. Problem solved.

Change your oil a bunch o times to get rid of the Al fines.

I have crane golds, Eddie Heads, Hughes 242 solid cam.


Dallas




Yes I have Stealth heads on the car. My oil pressure seems to be fine so how would I have not gotten oil to the rocker shafts when pressure seemed OK?

So how do I know and find out if my cam bearings are the cause of my problem. Wouldnt my cam,lifter and pushrods have failed also if they werent getting enough oil?

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: Blakcharger440] #485946
10/02/09 08:13 PM
10/02/09 08:13 PM
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602heavy Offline
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Spin the motor till #8 ex valve is fully open , remove bolt from rocker shaft pedestal (pas side) & prime oil pump with a drill , you will know for sure if #4 cam bearing is'nt aligned.

Same goes for drivers side , spin motor till #7 ex valve is fully open (or there abouts) & prime with drill.

Re: Went to adjust lash & Crane Gold rockers !#&$^.%(*!!!! [Re: 602heavy] #485947
10/03/09 09:32 AM
10/03/09 09:32 AM
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JohnRR Offline
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Quote:

Spin the motor till #8 ex valve is fully open , remove bolt from rocker shaft pedestal (pas side) & prime oil pump with a drill , you will know for sure if #4 cam bearing is'nt aligned.

Same goes for drivers side , spin motor till #7 ex valve is fully open (or there abouts) & prime with drill.




I'd only loosen that bolt so there is a gap between the bolt and the holddown and not remove it , when you spin the pump a stream of oil will be hitting the hood and covering the engine compartment.

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