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Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long #422024
07/28/09 06:30 PM
07/28/09 06:30 PM
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Posts: 923
Missouri
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convertriple Offline OP
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convertriple  Offline OP
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Missouri
I have less than 10 miles on my rebuilt 340 in an A-body, and it is pinging like crazy. I have it backed down to 28 degrees total timing and it still has a very slight hint of pinging. At 30 degrees total and above, pinging is quite noticeable.
Here's my specs:

340 stock stroke with 10.5 TRW L2316 pistons,
2.02/1.6 stainless valved, iron heads with pocket porting and a small amount of port cleanup.
Air gap dual plane intake with a 600 holley vac secondary which may get replaced with a 750 vacuum.
1 5/8 Hooker comp headers with full exhaust
older Mallory unilite distributor, all timing in by 3000
After cc'ing the heads, static compression figured at 9.5:1

I am running an 80's version of the MP 280/.474 cam, which may have different timing specs than the newer version (different part number). I seem to remember that this cam would "build" compression due to its valve timing, but its been a long time and my memory has seen better days. I ran this exact combination in the late 80's and it ran awesome. I guess gas quality has come WAY down in 20 years.

We ran cranking compression on two cylinders and they came in between 170 and 195 psi. I'm not sure if those levels are too high for 91 octane (best pump gas I can find).

Any ideas on how to eliminate the pinging so I can crank the timing back up to normal levels? This thing is a pig at 28 degrees.

I was thinking of a cam swap to lower cylinder pressure, but am wide open to other ideas.

Last edited by convertriple; 07/28/09 06:31 PM.
Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: convertriple] #422025
07/28/09 06:34 PM
07/28/09 06:34 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,295
dark side of the moon
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Dougsmopars Offline
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with 9.5 to 1 comp it should be fine with premium fuel. Sure you have good gas? Sounds like a new build. Try getting some new gas from another station. bad fuel is not uncommon

Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: Dougsmopars] #422026
07/28/09 06:51 PM
07/28/09 06:51 PM
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Upper Midwest
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MoparforLife Offline
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anything above about 165/170 lbs. clyinder pressure is playing with fire on pump premium.

Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: convertriple] #422027
07/28/09 07:06 PM
07/28/09 07:06 PM
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Indiana
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YO7_A66 Offline
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What is your jetting in the 600?
What is your initial timing?
Are you running vacuum advance? If so, how much?
What plugs (heat range) are you running?


1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: YO7_A66] #422028
07/28/09 07:24 PM
07/28/09 07:24 PM
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Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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with compression readings that high you have an actual CR of over 9.5 plus no quench. You'll need to proportion in some race gas asap, pinging does alot of damage in addition to killing performance


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: convertriple] #422029
07/28/09 07:36 PM
07/28/09 07:36 PM
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VA
DAMOPARS Offline
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Get 5 gallons of 110

Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: MoparforLife] #422030
07/28/09 07:51 PM
07/28/09 07:51 PM
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Mass
dgc333 Offline
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Quote:

anything above about 165/170 lbs. clyinder pressure is playing with fire on pump premium.




Not really, with a well sorted out engine 205-210 psi is not out of the question on pump gas.

I have 185-195 cranking psi (10.6:1 measured static compression)on my magnum headed 360 and I run it on 89 octane.

To the OP are you sure the timing mark on the balancer is accurate? If it's not in the right place you could have more timing than you think.

With 165/170 psi you should be able to run on 87 octane.


Dave Clement Pembroke, MA 03 PT Cruiser GT Turbo 99 Dakota SLT+ CC 4x4 68 Barracuda sport coupe http://home.comcast.net/~dgc333/
Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: dgc333] #422031
07/28/09 07:55 PM
07/28/09 07:55 PM
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Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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Quote:

I have 185-195 cranking psi (10.6:1 measured static compression)on my magnum headed 360 and I run it on 89 octane.


Do you have quench?


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: dgc333] #422032
07/28/09 08:00 PM
07/28/09 08:00 PM
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New Zealand
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solidcam Offline
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Might get away with that C.R with magnums.But the original poster has a slightly domed piston (TRW 10.5) and open chamber heads.I have run the exact same set-up and detonation was a major factor.With that combo as the original poster stated backing off the timing will result in poor performance,get the timing where it needs to be and use a higher octane fuel.

Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: RapidRobert] #422033
07/28/09 08:08 PM
07/28/09 08:08 PM
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Southern Cal
Noblewk Offline
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Quote:

with compression readings that high you have an actual CR of over 9.5 plus no quench. You'll need to proportion in some race gas asap, pinging does alot of damage in addition to killing performance




Wow!!!
How did you figure that he has no quench? He didn't state what heads he was using, what head gaskets nor how high out of the bore his pistons were.

Richen up your jets and make sure not running lean. A lean ping happens. Agree also that your balancer may have skipped. Use a piston stop and check it out.


66 Dart GT, 402 11.18:109 Best 63 1/2 Galaxie 500XL 406 4Speed 13.20:103 Best 2000 Ram 2005 Durango Hemi.
Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: Noblewk] #422034
07/28/09 08:21 PM
07/28/09 08:21 PM
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Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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Quote:

Wow!!!
How did you figure that he has no quench? He didn't state what heads he was using, what head gaskets nor how high out of the bore his pistons were.


My experience from his given info. If he does in fact have it I am sure he will let me know & we will go from there.


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: YO7_A66] #422035
07/28/09 09:06 PM
07/28/09 09:06 PM
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Posts: 923
Missouri
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convertriple Offline OP
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convertriple  Offline OP
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Quote:

What is your jetting in the 600?
What is your initial timing?
Are you running vacuum advance? If so, how much?
What plugs (heat range) are you running?




I am not sure offhand on the jetting, but the plugs look good. I am going to throw a 750 on this weekend and see if it gets any better, will mess more with jetting then.

Initial advance right now is about 10-11 with 17 centrifugal. I had started with 17 initial.
Tried with and without vacuum advance, definately worse with vacuum advance, so it was plugged on most tests including 28 degrees total run.
I am running one or two steps colder than stock on the plugs, been awhile since I bought the plugs, hard to remember.

Non-quench, non-magnum heads.
Balancer is correct, verified during the build.

Thanks for the help guys, I really appreciate it, keep it coming!

Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: convertriple] #422036
07/29/09 06:18 AM
07/29/09 06:18 AM
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Indiana
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YO7_A66 Offline
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""I am not sure offhand on the jetting""

That is where I would start. A lean carb will add pinging. Let us know what jets you have.


1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
Re: Help please! Pinging/Timing issue 340 - long [Re: YO7_A66] #422037
07/29/09 07:23 AM
07/29/09 07:23 AM
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Posts: 2,467
Answering the call of the wild
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ThermoQuad Offline
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Initial timing needs to be at least 15 Degrees BTDC. The rest of the curve should come in slow till all in at 2600 rpm. Total of 32.

Distributor needs to be check for proper phasing which has been covered before and beaten to death.
A properly phased/curved distributor is required or just keep chasing your tail.

Antifreeze should be 60% water 40% antifreeze
195 degree Thermostat

Quality spark plug wires like Firecores.

Once the initial timing/recurve/phasing and mixture adjustments etc have been resolved you can adjust the jetting.







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