Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
#3184407
10/16/23 04:50 PM
10/16/23 04:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,043 Slidell, La.
doctor_mopar
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I have almost finished my 340 bored .040 with 4 inch stroke scat cast steel crank . It has the scat ibeam rods, and diamond forged dish pistons. it is internally balanced . the actual compression ratio is 9.8 to 1 , with sidewinder aluminum heads .This is going in my 67 barracuda convertible street car with automatic transmission . The car is for street use , and I do not plan on reving the engine over 6,000 RPM , also it is a relatively light rotating assembly . The question is, will it hold up with stock main cap bolts . I had this professionally done by a machinist that does primarily race engines . Originally I had him assemble it with ARP main studs . He used their lube , and their higher torque spec .He measured the saddles and bearings , and the mains moved with the studs out of round too tight . It measured perfect with the stock bolts, so I told him to assemble it with the bolts , as I did not want to start over and Line bore for the studs . I felt that the motor built mild for my purpose would be fine. Now I am second guessing before i finish, looking for opinions . Thank You , Ron
Last edited by doctor_mopar; 10/16/23 04:51 PM.
------------------------ It doesn't matter what you do.........As long as you look good doing it !
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: doctor_mopar]
#3184425
10/16/23 06:32 PM
10/16/23 06:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419 Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
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they're not little tiny chevy bolts holding the mains in on there, don't worry about em
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: doctor_mopar]
#3184598
10/17/23 01:07 PM
10/17/23 01:07 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,043 Slidell, La.
doctor_mopar
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Thank You Guys for your input , experience , and opinions !! This helps me to feel more confident in my own opinion that the stock main bolts will be fine in this application ! I did have concerns going back to my own previous experiences back in the eighties when I raced a 340 in a Duster . I was running heavy pop up pistons with a 12:5 to 1 compression ratio , huge cam , shifting at 7200 RPM , and crossing the line at 7200. with 4:88 gears . I had a problem with main cap walk on the center main until I used main studs . I was only worried with this street 418 because of the long stroke , but since the rotating assembly is lighter, the compression lower, and rpm much lower, I don't believe it will be under the load that 340 was !
------------------------ It doesn't matter what you do.........As long as you look good doing it !
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#3184619
10/17/23 02:19 PM
10/17/23 02:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,875 Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
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Under high torsonal loads the crank tries to twist itself into an 'S' so you will tend to see the highest wear on the #3 because #2 and #4 main are constantly trying to see-saw between eachother.
You said you're running a cast steel crank so yours safest bet for longevity might be to cam it where the motor doesn't want to rev that high, if the heads can't pump up there the bottom end friction will start to act like a rev limiter.
The other thing is on the street your tires are the safety fuse, you're not really dead loading the motor because you'll break traction before you'll ever twist anything to failure.
I have a 427 ford windsor (4.04" bore and 4.17" stroke with 340 rods) in my cobra replica and that is a torque monster, rarely sees over 5800-6000 but in a 2400 pound car it doesn't need to. I pretty much build all my SB strokers (except my Rocky that spins 6800-7000) that way.
Last edited by Streetwize; 10/17/23 02:31 PM.
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Streetwize]
#3184708
10/17/23 09:50 PM
10/17/23 09:50 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 2,498 PA
moparacer
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340 block bored .040? Good thing it's mild because those cylinder walls might be a little thin.
67 Barracuda street/bracket car 11.27-119 68 Dart 502 BB 8.70s-152 414 cid SB Dragster 7.65-174
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: doctor_mopar]
#3184740
10/18/23 08:15 AM
10/18/23 08:15 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,758 Windsor, ON, Canada
Diplomat360
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As opposed to the others replying here, mine was a different experience.
These pics show cap-walk in a 360 SB (non-stroker) street engine. Nothing crazy here - stock crank with HP116CP pistons - other than all using ARP fasteners and the block having been machined correctly to true everything up. That was a flat tappet hydraulic cam with high-rev lifters, I regularly spun to 6500 RPM.
So did this cause any damage?
I do not think so, the crank came out looking very nice, no scoring on the journals, although the bearings did show a little wear and those locations coincided with where the cap-walk witness marks showed up.
Because of this I went to main studs on my W2 stroker build. The assembly difference was a 'day & night' kind of a thing: for the lack of better terms, the bottom end - as I was torquing down the studs - literally felt like a SOLID piece of iron! lol
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Diplomat360]
#3184741
10/18/23 08:17 AM
10/18/23 08:17 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,758 Windsor, ON, Canada
Diplomat360
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...and here are the matching bearing pics for both the mains and connecting rods
EDIT ==== OH, all this is after about 10 seasons (summary only) mostly street crusing and a few trips to the track! In total I put on about 10K KMs, so about 6K hard miles?
Last edited by Diplomat360; 10/18/23 08:19 AM.
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Diplomat360]
#3184847
10/18/23 02:05 PM
10/18/23 02:05 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,157 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
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Last edited by Cab_Burge; 10/18/23 02:06 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Streetwize]
#3184856
10/18/23 02:32 PM
10/18/23 02:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,043 Slidell, La.
doctor_mopar
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Ref Sreetwize post . The cam is relatively mild for the 418 . It is a comp Hydraulic Nostalgia Series . 239/246 duration at .050 . Lift 484 . It is rated for 2,500 - 6400 powerband . I figure a little lower with the big motor . Should be just right . Car will always be run on street tires > I was thinking along the same lines you mention .
Last edited by doctor_mopar; 10/18/23 02:33 PM.
------------------------ It doesn't matter what you do.........As long as you look good doing it !
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#3184873
10/18/23 04:01 PM
10/18/23 04:01 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,758 Windsor, ON, Canada
Diplomat360
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oh?...they are not ideal for sure, but really that bad you think? 1) MAINS (B - means Block, C - means Cap) 1 - 0.0037 2 - 0.0037 3 - 0.0035 4 - 0.0034 5 - 0.0034 2) RODS (R - means Rod, C - means Cap) 1 - 0.0018 2 - 0.0023 3 - 0.0018 4 - 0.0024 5 - 0.0018 6 - 0.0025 7 - 0.0018 8 - 0.0023 I used a high volume oil pump (not high pressure), and ran 10w30 oil (VR1) the last three seasons and 10w40 Delvac earlier on. Oil pressure was always good. The mains were SealedPower 3/4 grove 120M (which had that flat non-zinc finish, so it looks a bit green/brown in the pics, you can see it clearly in #3), and rods were SealedPower 8-2130CP10 (with the zinc plating that still remained on some of them), with the crank being 10/10. If anything I would say that the rod bearings show more wear on the ROD side of the bearing as opposed to the CAP side, therefore in my amateour way of thinking that'd be a result of not enough oil film during the power stroke??? maybe detonation??? (i'm fishin' here...lol)
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Diplomat360]
#3184938
10/18/23 09:24 PM
10/18/23 09:24 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,157 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
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Last edited by Cab_Burge; 10/18/23 09:26 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#3186101
10/24/23 08:38 AM
10/24/23 08:38 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,875 Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
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Intersestingly, Nicks Garage on youtube just tested a 390" 318 with ported factory Iron heads, 10.2:1 with a Performer RPM and a really mild 231/237 @.050 hydraulic flat tappet with factory 340 Manifolds and it made 405 hp at 5400 and 440+ LB/Ft through the middel and I would think his dyno is very conservative (or at least real).
I would think headers alone would put it at least at 460 lb/ft and +430 hp at about 5600. It any event it's a sweet hard pulling street combination, probably enough to put an A body with decent traction in the 11's and a mid 70's D-100 in the 12's.
it's funny, I commented on one of his more recent videos that most people (that actually watch dyno videos on youtube) would really like to know more specifics about the head and cam specs...and (Thank you Nick!) it looks like he took that advice to heart,
Last edited by Streetwize; 10/24/23 08:45 AM.
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Re: Mild 418 stroked 340 block with stock main bolts
[Re: Diplomat360]
#3186269
10/24/23 08:12 PM
10/24/23 08:12 PM
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,552 Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy
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In that pic of the cap walk block is that a Heli-coil on the main cap threads? There really should be at least a solid insert like a Time-sert. I could be wrong but the one on the left looks like it's been repaired. Gus
64 Plymouth Savoy 493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow 5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box Dana 60
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