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Piston to valve clearance question #3100533
12/07/22 10:15 PM
12/07/22 10:15 PM
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Detroit area
6PAX Offline OP
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I am using out-of-the box Edelbrock Performer RPM heads on my 400/470. The pistons are flat top and according to the stroker kit specs should be .002 below the deck. The head gaskets I used are the Fel-Pro 1009 which are supposed to be .039 compressed thickness. I am still trying to decide on the right cam to purchase and would like to know how much duration and/or lift I can run without risk of the valves contacting the piston. Is the duration or lift (or both) the critical factor for clearance and does anyone know how much duration/lift will work with my set-up? At this point I am open to either a hydraulic or solid flat tappet cam.

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: 6PAX] #3100536
12/07/22 10:26 PM
12/07/22 10:26 PM
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lewtot184 Offline
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more likely than not those 1009 gaskets will burn thru between the two inner cylinders; don't use them. lift/duration and lobe separation angle all effect piston to valve clearance.

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: lewtot184] #3100539
12/07/22 10:37 PM
12/07/22 10:37 PM
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6PAX Offline OP
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Prior to my buying those head gaskets, I asked here what gaskets I should get and those were recommended by several members.

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: 6PAX] #3100540
12/07/22 10:40 PM
12/07/22 10:40 PM
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Cab_Burge Offline
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The 1009 head gaskets were designed for the 383 and 426 W motors with the 4.250 stock bore size, lays yours on your block and if any part of them protrude into the bores now get another, different, set : scope twocents: Don't burn, torch, the heads and block up by burning those head gaskets up on your motor tsk scope twocents
Lots of other good choices out there for you up

Last edited by Cab_Burge; 12/07/22 10:41 PM.

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Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: 6PAX] #3100548
12/07/22 11:12 PM
12/07/22 11:12 PM
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BigDaddy440 Offline
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Last edited by BigDaddy440; 12/07/22 11:12 PM.

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Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: Cab_Burge] #3100563
12/08/22 07:25 AM
12/08/22 07:25 AM
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6PAX Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Cab_Burge
The 1009 head gaskets were designed for the 383 and 426 W motors with the 4.250 stock bore size, lays yours on your block and if any part of them protrude into the bores now get another, different, set : scope twocents: Don't burn, torch, the heads and block up by burning those head gaskets up on your motor tsk scope twocents
Lots of other good choices out there for you up


I don't understand. The bore of my 400 block is 4.377" (4.342" +.035" over) and the 1009's are 4.41" bore. What am I missing?

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/fel-1009#overview

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: 6PAX] #3100565
12/08/22 07:52 AM
12/08/22 07:52 AM
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lewtot184 Offline
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i've had to have alum heads welded back up from using those crummy gaskets. the minimum gasket i'd use is the 8519.

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: lewtot184] #3100568
12/08/22 08:20 AM
12/08/22 08:20 AM
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Apollo, PA.
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Locate the 1009 on the head and block and make sure that they don't overhang the bore or chamber. That's the issue with those. Otherwise an outstanding gasket in my opinion.

Duration is the biggest factor in valve clearance. If its standard aftermarket stroker forged pistons with valve pockets, your most likely ok up to the 270's at .050

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: 6PAX] #3100573
12/08/22 08:40 AM
12/08/22 08:40 AM
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Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak Offline
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Originally Posted by 6PAX


I don't understand. The bore of my 400 block is 4.377" (4.342" +.035" over) and the 1009's are 4.41" bore. What am I missing?

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/fel-1009#overview

The specs are misleading; the 1009 is questionable IMO on anything larger than 4.350. I've used them on 4.375", but my cylinders had absolutely no chamfer at the top that let the gasket overhang into the bores. Others haven't been so lucky and the torched gasket between cylinders is the result.

FWIW, the Fel-Pro marine gasket (17059?) has a true 4.500" bore and may be a better choice.

Last edited by Brad_Haak; 12/08/22 08:49 AM.

2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320
100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft)
weight reduction, wheels, tires, Hellcat air box: 1.661, 11.686 at 115.97 (DA 710 ft)

1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip [2008]
pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: Brad_Haak] #3100605
12/08/22 11:32 AM
12/08/22 11:32 AM
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lewtot184 Offline
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i wouldn't even use a 1009 on a 361 or 413.

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: 6PAX] #3100618
12/08/22 12:10 PM
12/08/22 12:10 PM
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jwb123 Offline
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As mentioned good idea to check that the gaskets actually fit the heads. Never had an issue with the fel-pro gaskets. BBM have 5 bolts around the cylinder they seldom blow a gasket unless mating surfaces are not flat. can be checked with straight edge and feeler gauges. what kind of compression are you running? up to 12 to 1 fel-pros have always worked good for me. Over that I use copper gaskets with o-rings. Old school I guess but top fuel cars still use copper gaskets and money is not really an object so they must be the best. And before people chime in about water leaks, if installed correctly they will not leak water. Height of the O-ring out of the block is where the problem happens on most installations that leak.

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: Brad_Haak] #3100625
12/08/22 12:27 PM
12/08/22 12:27 PM
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GomangoCuda Offline
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As Brad mentioned it's not the bore size that's important it's the bore chamfer size. Some have a chamfer that is big enough for the gasket to hang out. If the chamfer O.D. is bigger than the gasket I.D. then the gasket will burn and damage the block and head.


In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.
Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: GomangoCuda] #3100629
12/08/22 12:44 PM
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I guess I'm going to have to pull the heads back off and check as we put them on the motor about 3 years ago. The engine still hasn't been run and it is still on the stand. Being the engine hasn't been run, will the gaskets still be O.K. to use if the gasket is not intefering with the cylinder bore?

Last edited by 6PAX; 12/08/22 12:57 PM.
Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: 6PAX] #3100630
12/08/22 12:46 PM
12/08/22 12:46 PM
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Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak Offline
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Originally Posted by 6PAX
I guess I'm going to have to pull the heads back off and check as we put them on the motor about 3 years ago. The engine still hasn't been run and it is still on the stand. Being the engine hasn't been run, will the gaskets still be O.K. to use if the gasket is not into with the cylinder bore?

Yes


2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320
100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft)
weight reduction, wheels, tires, Hellcat air box: 1.661, 11.686 at 115.97 (DA 710 ft)

1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip [2008]
pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: GomangoCuda] #3100648
12/08/22 01:47 PM
12/08/22 01:47 PM
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Willie68coronet Offline
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Originally Posted by GomangoCuda
As Brad mentioned it's not the bore size that's important it's the bore chamfer size. Some have a chamfer that is big enough for the gasket to hang out. If the chamfer O.D. is bigger than the gasket I.D. then the gasket will burn and damage the block and head.


Yep. I have a 400 block that's bored to 4.375. I had to return Cometic's with a 4.410 I.D. The gaskets looked good on TFS 270's. But overhung the chamfer on the block just enough enough in most or all cylinders, that I exchanged them for the 4.5 bore gaskets.

Last edited by Willie68coronet; 12/08/22 01:49 PM.

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Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: 6PAX] #3100660
12/08/22 02:57 PM
12/08/22 02:57 PM
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Indiana
Gabby63 Offline
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I had tried the 1009 gasket at 4.375 , blew this gasket between cylinders . Went to the marine gasket after that , all was well . Gary

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: Gabby63] #3100806
12/09/22 09:10 AM
12/09/22 09:10 AM
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lewtot184 Offline
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back when i was messing with a 470 i found the fel-pro 1039 to be very reliable. never a torched head with the 1039. there's a lot of work and expense in patching up this problem; so why go there?

Re: Piston to valve clearance question [Re: lewtot184] #3102789
12/16/22 09:59 AM
12/16/22 09:59 AM
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I had a 440 block that was .030 over and I tried to run the 1009 gasket. The bore size wasn't the issue it was the large chamfer at the top of the cylinder that was the problem. They wouldn't work on that block







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