Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: Dynoguy]
#3056821
07/06/22 05:32 PM
07/06/22 05:32 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,228 Colleyville
3hundred
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,228
Colleyville
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They're pretty cheap to operate. For instance gasoline cost, @ $5.00 / gallon and 20 MPG, fuel cost alone is $0.25. It costs $0.045 per mile to drive an electric car, on average, based on 277 different models. What is this? The most common cost per mile for an electric car is $0.0388. It costs from $0.0308 to $0.1132 per mile to drive an electric car. I still regard them as commuter cars only. ELECTRIC police cars are struggling to reach crime scenes and emergencies without running out of power. Officers in rural areas cannot find charging points on patrol and are having to switch to petrol or diesel vehicles. And if you don't think this is coming... UK Proposes Law To Switch Off EV Home Chargers During Peak Hours
'68 Fury Convertible '69 300 Convertible '15 Durango 5.7 Hemi '16 300 S Hemi
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: 3hundred]
#3056823
07/06/22 05:38 PM
07/06/22 05:38 PM
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,289 nowhere
Sniper
master
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master
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,289
nowhere
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They're pretty cheap to operate. For instance gasoline cost, @ $5.00 / gallon and 20 MPG, fuel cost alone is $0.25. It costs $0.045 per mile to drive an electric car, on average, based on 277 different models. What is this? The most common cost per mile for an electric car is $0.0388. It costs from $0.0308 to $0.1132 per mile to drive an electric car. I still regard them as commuter cars only. ELECTRIC police cars are struggling to reach crime scenes and emergencies without running out of power. Officers in rural areas cannot find charging points on patrol and are having to switch to petrol or diesel vehicles. And if you don't think this is coming... UK Proposes Law To Switch Off EV Home Chargers During Peak Hours Did you copy and paste this? Because you have two different per mile cost claims for the electric car.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: Sniper]
#3056839
07/06/22 06:06 PM
07/06/22 06:06 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,228 Colleyville
3hundred
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,228
Colleyville
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They're pretty cheap to operate. For instance gasoline cost, @ $5.00 / gallon and 20 MPG, fuel cost alone is $0.25. It costs $0.045 per mile to drive an electric car, on average, based on 277 different models. What is this? The most common cost per mile for an electric car is $0.0388. It costs from $0.0308 to $0.1132 per mile to drive an electric car. I still regard them as commuter cars only. ELECTRIC police cars are struggling to reach crime scenes and emergencies without running out of power. Officers in rural areas cannot find charging points on patrol and are having to switch to petrol or diesel vehicles. And if you don't think this is coming... UK Proposes Law To Switch Off EV Home Chargers During Peak Hours Did you copy and paste this? Because you have two different per mile cost claims for the electric car. I did, I see an average, a median (most common) and a range given. What am I missing?
'68 Fury Convertible '69 300 Convertible '15 Durango 5.7 Hemi '16 300 S Hemi
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: 3hundred]
#3056879
07/06/22 08:35 PM
07/06/22 08:35 PM
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,289 nowhere
Sniper
master
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master
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,289
nowhere
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They're pretty cheap to operate. For instance gasoline cost, @ $5.00 / gallon and 20 MPG, fuel cost alone is $0.25. It costs $0.045 per mile to drive an electric car, on average, based on 277 different models. What is this? The most common cost per mile for an electric car is $0.0388. It costs from $0.0308 to $0.1132 per mile to drive an electric car. I still regard them as commuter cars only. ELECTRIC police cars are struggling to reach crime scenes and emergencies without running out of power. Officers in rural areas cannot find charging points on patrol and are having to switch to petrol or diesel vehicles. And if you don't think this is coming... UK Proposes Law To Switch Off EV Home Chargers During Peak Hours Did you copy and paste this? Because you have two different per mile cost claims for the electric car. I did, I see an average, a median (most common) and a range given. What am I missing? I don't see median called out or a range in the post. The term common cost isn't median A link to the source might clarify
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: Sniper]
#3056888
07/06/22 08:58 PM
07/06/22 08:58 PM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,593 USA
VS29H0B
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,593
USA
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Batteries contain many toxic materials where the supplies are largely controlled by our adversaries. The strip mining required to produce one EV battery is substantial. Batteries discharge at temperature extremes and the placement of battery chargers for long haul trips are not convenient thus require serious planning on the part of EV owners. Range anxiety is real and justified Batteries that fail are warrantied but are replaced at the discretion of the manufacturer - so as your EV battery ages and fails you may get a used battery instead of a new one under warranty terms. For short trips at this point in development, EVs work in urban areas. But they currently do not work if your EV is a tow vehicle as range is reduced anywhere from 40-65 percent.
EVs in their current state - taken in total cradle to grave life cycle may account for more overall environmental damage than ICE vehicles.
When an EV is ready for trade in - the resale value may not be much with a older battery.
Charging times can be extensive depending on the Kwh limits involved with the battery deployed --- and the manufacturers can set max limits of the effectiveness of the charging cycle by limiting the charge to a lower than advertised Kwg charge rate.
These are only the tip of the iceberg in terms of EV trade offs compared to ICE vehicles. There are plenty of good videos showing the issues described - try ICE AGE TV on YouTube .. he has a F150 Lightning and several MACH-E Mustangs....
Last edited by VS29H0B; 07/06/22 09:15 PM.
Like the women I have dated --- Always looking for a better deal ....
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: Dynoguy]
#3056893
07/06/22 09:11 PM
07/06/22 09:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,050 Oregon
AndyF
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,050
Oregon
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A friend of mine told me if you wanted to use a public charging station it costs .32 cents per minute that would be $19.20 an hour and $76.80 for 4 hours of charging, Is this correct ? If it is why would anybody want an electric car ? Charging is $1 an hour at local charging stations here in Oregon. Not sure where your friend got his info, maybe downtown Manhattan or something? I can charge my Leaf at home for roughly $3 and that is good for 70 miles of driving. That is roughly the same as a car that gets 100 mpg with $5 per gallon gas. Electric cars have very low maintenance costs so that adds to the savings. I've owned my Leaf for 5 years and haven't had to spend any money on maintenance other than buying a new cabin air filter at 35K miles.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: poorboy]
#3056913
07/06/22 09:52 PM
07/06/22 09:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,113 Usa
A39Coronet
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,113
Usa
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Yea, but wait until that EV battery dies. I understand the life expectancy is in the 5 to 8 year range.
There is no way to recycle them, and its nearly 1/2 the cost of the vehicle to replace the battery. I saw a new coverage that just outside Paris, there is a parking lot with over 100 5-6 year old city EV parked with dead batteries. They can't even scrap the cars because of the batteries, so they are just parking them in that parking lot just outside of town. The numbers keep growing.
Yes! A new green world, for now. This is incorrect on both accounts. Battery life is definitely greater than 5-8yrs, and there are already companies that recycle ev batteries back into pure raw material for reuse. The secondary supportive industries will grow. I'd imagine folks in the early 1900s had concerns with the Ford Quadricycle that were addressed just the same. Quick Google search says Prius batteries are $2200-$4k to replace...how much is it to swap in a new gas motor to an average vehicle? Probably about the same.
Last edited by A39Coronet; 07/06/22 09:53 PM.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: A39Coronet]
#3056931
07/06/22 10:38 PM
07/06/22 10:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,125 Tucson, AZ
Ramrod39
My New Title
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My New Title
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,125
Tucson, AZ
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This is incorrect on both accounts. Battery life is definitely greater than 5-8yrs, and there are already companies that recycle ev batteries back into pure raw material for reuse. The secondary supportive industries will grow. I'd imagine folks in the early 1900s had concerns with the Ford Quadricycle that were addressed just the same. Quick Google search says Prius batteries are $2200-$4k to replace...how much is it to swap in a new gas motor to an average vehicle? Probably about the same.
A quick Google search also says that the average Prius battery lasts 8-10 yrs, or about 100,000 to 150,000 miles. The gas motor in my pickup is 22 years old and is pushing 320,000 miles. Never even had the valve covers off.
Last edited by Ramrod39; 07/06/22 10:39 PM.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: AndyF]
#3056947
07/06/22 11:45 PM
07/06/22 11:45 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,954 WI
Dcuda69
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,954
WI
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A friend of mine told me if you wanted to use a public charging station it costs .32 cents per minute that would be $19.20 an hour and $76.80 for 4 hours of charging, Is this correct ? If it is why would anybody want an electric car ? Charging is $1 an hour at local charging stations here in Oregon. Not sure where your friend got his info, maybe downtown Manhattan or something? I can charge my Leaf at home for roughly $3 and that is good for 70 miles of driving. That is roughly the same as a car that gets 100 mpg with $5 per gallon gas. Electric cars have very low maintenance costs so that adds to the savings. I've owned my Leaf for 5 years and haven't had to spend any money on maintenance other than buying a new cabin air filter at 35K miles. I have 2 thoughts on this: 1) Will the cost to charge that Leaf stay the same as more people charge more Leafs? doubtful!! 2) Those costs are based on the current $5/gal gas prices. Why are those prices so high? Couple years ago we had $2/gal gas.How would those calculations work then? Can you say agenda???
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: Dcuda69]
#3056951
07/06/22 11:51 PM
07/06/22 11:51 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 529 SW CO
HemiSportFury
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 529
SW CO
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When will electric vehicles start to pay for the roads they drive on?
'64 Sport Fury, 528 Hemi, FiTech EFI, 4-speed, 4.10 Dana 60 '57 Belvedere 2dr sedan, current project in process '19 Cherokee Trail Hawk Elite '03 Ram 2500 CTD HO, 6-speed 214,000 miles and still going strong
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: HemiSportFury]
#3056960
07/07/22 12:30 AM
07/07/22 12:30 AM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 16,491 On the run…
BloFish
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 16,491
On the run…
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When will electric vehicles start to pay for the roads they drive on? Never!
It really doesn't matter whether you win or lose… as long as you look good doing it!
‘65 A100 ‘69 ‘Cuda ‘73 Vega GT ‘06 Mega Cab ‘14 Mercedes SLK
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: Dcuda69]
#3056963
07/07/22 12:50 AM
07/07/22 12:50 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,050 Oregon
AndyF
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,050
Oregon
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A friend of mine told me if you wanted to use a public charging station it costs .32 cents per minute that would be $19.20 an hour and $76.80 for 4 hours of charging, Is this correct ? If it is why would anybody want an electric car ? Charging is $1 an hour at local charging stations here in Oregon. Not sure where your friend got his info, maybe downtown Manhattan or something? I can charge my Leaf at home for roughly $3 and that is good for 70 miles of driving. That is roughly the same as a car that gets 100 mpg with $5 per gallon gas. Electric cars have very low maintenance costs so that adds to the savings. I've owned my Leaf for 5 years and haven't had to spend any money on maintenance other than buying a new cabin air filter at 35K miles. I have 2 thoughts on this: 1) Will the cost to charge that Leaf stay the same as more people charge more Leafs? doubtful!! 2) Those costs are based on the current $5/gal gas prices. Why are those prices so high? Couple years ago we had $2/gal gas.How would those calculations work then? Can you say agenda??? Even at $2 a gallon my Leaf was cheaper to drive than my Toyota 4Runner. A used Leaf is a great car to buzz around town in. Good car for a high school kid or someone who works from home. I use mine all the time for running errands around town. No warm up time, very quick 0-30 time, does fine on the freeway. Has about a 10 mile useful radius so it works best if you live in a city where all of your errands are close together. Won't work for everyone but it is a good second or third car for a family.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: AndyF]
#3057032
07/07/22 08:51 AM
07/07/22 08:51 AM
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,289 nowhere
Sniper
master
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master
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,289
nowhere
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Even at $2 a gallon my Leaf was cheaper to drive than my Toyota 4Runner. A used Leaf is a great car to buzz around town in. Good car for a high school kid or someone who works from home. I use mine all the time for running errands around town. No warm up time, very quick 0-30 time, does fine on the freeway. Has about a 10 mile useful radius so it works best if you live in a city where all of your errands are close together. Won't work for everyone but it is a good second or third car for a family.
Comparing a Leaf to a 4 Runner is apples and oranges. The 4 Runner has a lot more versatility. We may as well compare a bicycle to your Leaf and proclaim the bike the winner, especially with your Leaf's "10 mile useful radius". Speaking of which, if your Leaf has only a 10 mile useful radius it's battery pack is virtually dead, new Leafs with the cheapest battery option get ~130 miles out of a charge. Which brings into call the cost to replace it. If you spring for the cheapest possible used battery pack, ~$2500-3500, plus labor at the shop to do it, another ~$2,000. there goes the mythical no maintenance costs. Don't tell me you can do the replacement yourself, 99% of the car people here can't and even less of the general public can. https://www.motorverso.com/nissan-leaf-battery-replacement-cost/#costFor giggles I went to car-parts.com and looked up the price for a used battery pack, 2016 Leaf. Three listings given, two said call for price, the one listing a price was asking $3455.57US and it's in Quebec, no US shipping, lol. Anything newer has no price given and even less choices. 2015 Leaf shows a lot of choices, all US ones more expensive and they are 7 years old. So if you can live with sticking your fingers in your ears and humming loudly so you can't hear the truth, yeah the Leaf wins.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: AndyF]
#3057193
07/07/22 03:26 PM
07/07/22 03:26 PM
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,289 nowhere
Sniper
master
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master
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,289
nowhere
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Actually you've missed the entire point of having an older EV like a first gen Leaf. They are inexpensive to buy, inexpensive to use and super practical for short trips. A lot of people have a use for a vehicle like that. If you don't it doesn't matter, buy something that works for you. But a lot of people could use a very inexpensive, very low maintenance vehicle for short trips around town, to school or to work. I got the point, it's the EV version of a clapped out beater. I learned long ago clapped out beaters are not a bargain.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: Sniper]
#3057238
07/07/22 05:44 PM
07/07/22 05:44 PM
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,640 in a cattle trailer down by th...
Guitar Jones
Paddle faster! I hear banjo music!
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Paddle faster! I hear banjo music!
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,640
in a cattle trailer down by th...
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Even at $2 a gallon my Leaf was cheaper to drive than my Toyota 4Runner. A used Leaf is a great car to buzz around town in. Good car for a high school kid or someone who works from home. I use mine all the time for running errands around town. No warm up time, very quick 0-30 time, does fine on the freeway. Has about a 10 mile useful radius so it works best if you live in a city where all of your errands are close together. Won't work for everyone but it is a good second or third car for a family.
Comparing a Leaf to a 4 Runner is apples and oranges. The 4 Runner has a lot more versatility. We may as well compare a bicycle to your Leaf and proclaim the bike the winner, especially with your Leaf's "10 mile useful radius". Speaking of which, if your Leaf has only a 10 mile useful radius it's battery pack is virtually dead, new Leafs with the cheapest battery option get ~130 miles out of a charge. Which brings into call the cost to replace it. If you spring for the cheapest possible used battery pack, ~$2500-3500, plus labor at the shop to do it, another ~$2,000. there goes the mythical no maintenance costs. Don't tell me you can do the replacement yourself, 99% of the car people here can't and even less of the general public can. https://www.motorverso.com/nissan-leaf-battery-replacement-cost/#costFor giggles I went to car-parts.com and looked up the price for a used battery pack, 2016 Leaf. Three listings given, two said call for price, the one listing a price was asking $3455.57US and it's in Quebec, no US shipping, lol. Anything newer has no price given and even less choices. 2015 Leaf shows a lot of choices, all US ones more expensive and they are 7 years old. So if you can live with sticking your fingers in your ears and humming loudly so you can't hear the truth, yeah the Leaf wins. I can change an EV or hybrid battery, I'm certified to do so, but I won't.
"Follow me the wise man said, but he walked behind"
'92 D250 Club Cab CTD, 47RH conversion, pump tweaks, injectors, rear disc and hydroboost conversion. '74 W200 Crew Cab 360, NV4500, D44, D60 and NP205 divorced transfer case. Rear disc and hydroboost conversion. 2019 1500 Long Horn Crew Cab 4WD, 5.7 Hemi.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: Sniper]
#3057249
07/07/22 06:51 PM
07/07/22 06:51 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,050 Oregon
AndyF
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,050
Oregon
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Actually you've missed the entire point of having an older EV like a first gen Leaf. They are inexpensive to buy, inexpensive to use and super practical for short trips. A lot of people have a use for a vehicle like that. If you don't it doesn't matter, buy something that works for you. But a lot of people could use a very inexpensive, very low maintenance vehicle for short trips around town, to school or to work. I got the point, it's the EV version of a clapped out beater. I learned long ago clapped out beaters are not a bargain. Nothing clapped out about it. The Leaf we have is fully equipped and everything works on it. It is a great little car for buzzing around town. My family uses it every day of the week. Super reliable, super low cost and maintenance costs are next to zero.
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Re: Electric Vehicle Charging
[Re: AndyF]
#3057253
07/07/22 06:55 PM
07/07/22 06:55 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162 USA
360view
Moparts resident spammer
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Moparts resident spammer
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
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I can charge my Leaf at home for roughly $3 and that is good for 70 miles of driving. That is roughly the same as a car that gets 100 mpg with $5 per gallon gas. Electric cars have very low maintenance costs so that adds to the savings. I've owned my Leaf for 5 years and haven't had to spend any money on maintenance other than buying a new cabin air filter at 35K miles.
Have any aftermarket suppliers come up with a Lithium battery replacement for the original Leaf battery?
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