Electric Vehicle Charging

A friend of mine told me if you wanted to use a public charging station it costs .32 cents per minute that would be $19.20 an hour and $76.80 for 4 hours of charging, Is this correct ? If it is why would anybody want an electric car ?

They're pretty cheap to operate. For instance gasoline cost, @ $5.00 / gallon and 20 MPG, fuel cost alone is $0.25.

It costs $0.045 per mile to drive an electric car, on average, based on 277 different models. What is this? The most common cost per mile for an electric car is $0.0388. It costs from $0.0308 to $0.1132 per mile to drive an electric car.

I still regard them as commuter cars only.

ELECTRIC police cars are struggling to reach crime scenes and emergencies without running out of power.

Officers in rural areas cannot find charging points on patrol and are having to switch to petrol or diesel vehicles.

And if you don't think this is coming...

UK Proposes Law To Switch Off EV Home Chargers During Peak Hours

Did you copy and paste this? Because you have two different per mile cost claims for the electric car.

I did, I see an average, a median (most common) and a range given. What am I missing?

Yea, but wait until that EV battery dies. I understand the life expectancy is in the 5 to 8 year range.

There is no way to recycle them, and its nearly 1/2 the cost of the vehicle to replace the battery. I saw a new coverage that just outside Paris, there is a parking lot with over 100 5-6 year old city EV parked with dead batteries. They can't even scrap the cars because of the batteries, so they are just parking them in that parking lot just outside of town. The numbers keep growing.

Yes! A new green world, for now.

I don't see median called out or a range in the post. The term common cost isn't median

A link to the source might clarify

Batteries contain many toxic materials where the supplies are largely controlled by our adversaries. The strip mining required to produce one EV battery is substantial. Batteries discharge at temperature extremes and the placement of battery chargers for long haul trips are not convenient thus require serious planning on the part of EV owners. Range anxiety is real and justified Batteries that fail are warrantied but are replaced at the discretion of the manufacturer - so as your EV battery ages and fails you may get a used battery instead of a new one under warranty terms. For short trips at this point in development, EVs work in urban areas. But they currently do not work if your EV is a tow vehicle as range is reduced anywhere from 40-65 percent.

EVs in their current state - taken in total cradle to grave life cycle may account for more overall environmental damage than ICE vehicles.

When an EV is ready for trade in - the resale value may not be much with a older battery.

Charging times can be extensive depending on the Kwh limits involved with the battery deployed --- and the manufacturers can set max limits of the effectiveness of the charging cycle by limiting the charge to a lower than advertised Kwg charge rate.

These are only the tip of the iceberg in terms of EV trade offs compared to ICE vehicles. There are plenty of good videos showing the issues described - try ICE AGE TV on YouTube .. he has a F150 Lightning and several MACH-E Mustangs....

Charging is $1 an hour at local charging stations here in Oregon. Not sure where your friend got his info, maybe downtown Manhattan or something?

I can charge my Leaf at home for roughly $3 and that is good for 70 miles of driving. That is roughly the same as a car that gets 100 mpg with $5 per gallon gas. Electric cars have very low maintenance costs so that adds to the savings. I've owned my Leaf for 5 years and haven't had to spend any money on maintenance other than buying a new cabin air filter at 35K miles.

This is incorrect on both accounts. Battery life is definitely greater than 5-8yrs, and there are already companies that recycle ev batteries back into pure raw material for reuse. The secondary supportive industries will grow. I'd imagine folks in the early 1900s had concerns with the Ford Quadricycle that were addressed just the same. Quick Google search says Prius batteries are $2200-$4k to replace...how much is it to swap in a new gas motor to an average vehicle? Probably about the same.

A quick Google search also says that the average Prius battery lasts 8-10 yrs, or about 100,000 to 150,000 miles. The gas motor in my pickup is 22 years old and is pushing 320,000 miles. Never even had the valve covers off.

I have 2 thoughts on this:

1) Will the cost to charge that Leaf stay the same as more people charge more Leafs? doubtful!!
2) Those costs are based on the current $5/gal gas prices. Why are those prices so high? Couple years ago we had $2/gal gas.How would those calculations work then? Can you say agenda???

When will electric vehicles start to pay for the roads they drive on?

Never!

Even at $2 a gallon my Leaf was cheaper to drive than my Toyota 4Runner. A used Leaf is a great car to buzz around town in. Good car for a high school kid or someone who works from home. I use mine all the time for running errands around town. No warm up time, very quick 0-30 time, does fine on the freeway. Has about a 10 mile useful radius so it works best if you live in a city where all of your errands are close together. Won't work for everyone but it is a good second or third car for a family.

Comparing a Leaf to a 4 Runner is apples and oranges. The 4 Runner has a lot more versatility. We may as well compare a bicycle to your Leaf and proclaim the bike the winner, especially with your Leaf's "10 mile useful radius".

Speaking of which, if your Leaf has only a 10 mile useful radius it's battery pack is virtually dead, new Leafs with the cheapest battery option get ~130 miles out of a charge. Which brings into call the cost to replace it. If you spring for the cheapest possible used battery pack, ~$2500-3500, plus labor at the shop to do it, another ~$2,000. there goes the mythical no maintenance costs. Don't tell me you can do the replacement yourself, 99% of the car people here can't and even less of the general public can. https://www.motorverso.com/nissan-leaf-battery-replacement-cost/#cost

For giggles I went to car-parts.com and looked up the price for a used battery pack, 2016 Leaf. Three listings given, two said call for price, the one listing a price was asking $3455.57US and it's in Quebec, no US shipping, lol. Anything newer has no price given and even less choices. 2015 Leaf shows a lot of choices, all US ones more expensive and they are 7 years old.

So if you can live with sticking your fingers in your ears and humming loudly so you can't hear the truth, yeah the Leaf wins.

Actually you've missed the entire point of having an older EV like a first gen Leaf. They are inexpensive to buy, inexpensive to use and super practical for short trips. A lot of people have a use for a vehicle like that. If you don't it doesn't matter, buy something that works for you. But a lot of people could use a very inexpensive, very low maintenance vehicle for short trips around town, to school or to work.

I got the point, it's the EV version of a clapped out beater. I learned long ago clapped out beaters are not a bargain.

I can change an EV or hybrid battery, I'm certified to do so, but I won't.

Nothing clapped out about it. The Leaf we have is fully equipped and everything works on it. It is a great little car for buzzing around town. My family uses it every day of the week. Super reliable, super low cost and maintenance costs are next to zero.

Have any aftermarket suppliers come up with a Lithium battery replacement for the original Leaf battery?

I work 7 miles from my house. If my beater PT Cruiser dies I would try a Leaf or something like that.

I don't know, I've never looked into it. Our Leaf is 8 years old and the battery still has about 90% capacity so I'm not worried about replacing it.

Yeah, 7 miles to work would be perfect for an electric car, even a short range car like the first generation Leaf. You can buy the older Leafs for under $5000 now and they are super cheap to operate. A 7 mile commute would be a piece of cake even if the battery was degraded some.

It costs me $3 to charge at home or $5 to charge at a public charger. Lots of places now offer free charging to employees or guests so that is another option.

You are off on something, if it has 90% battery left you have more than a 10 mile radius range.

If you only have a 10 mile radius range, you do not have 90% capacity left.

So which is it?

myself, i think the free, cheap charging will change once they get a grip on the majority of the public's cajone's. maybe the demand for gas will drop lowering the price

I'm not understanding this, it costs $3-$5 to go 10 miles?
What does "10 mile radius" equate to?

The total range on a $3 charge is about 70 miles which works out to roughly 100 miles/gallon at today's gas prices. The 10 mile radius is just a practical limit if you are going to be out running errands. With a short range EV you have to think ahead. The 2nd and 3rd gen vehicles out now have a lot longer range so you don't have to think about it so much but they are much more expensive vehicles.

If you are shopping for one of the earlier model year Nissan Leafs,
can the dealership run a scan
and give an estimate of the % capacity left in the original battery?

Are there other “known maintenance issues” to have a dealership check?

Does a Leaf have a OBD-II plug that an aftermarket reader can see diagnostics on?

I also have a leaf - a 2011 I bought just before the pandemic as my new teen driver wanted on. I paid $3,600 and the prior owner had just replaced the battery for $6K. This is the worst year - look for at least 2013 or up if you are in the market. They are harder to find now due to the vehicle shortages and high cost of gas. The battery capacity can be seen on the dash. After a full charge it will show you how many bars are left and the range. There is also LeafSpy app for your phone (with an OBD2 interface) that gives you lots of info.

For the money, I am thrilled with the car. I put tires on it and wipers and that's it. It was weird buying a car and not changing oil, plugs, antifreeze, etc... There is virtually nothing to do for maintenance. The early Leaf batteries have no cooling so they don't do great in hot climates. The range is short - mine is about 70 miles in town. When I hit the freeway, drop the range by almost a third. The newer ones, Leaf "Plus" have range over 200 miles so they would be more practical, but they cost real car money. My 2011 is a great extra car as it costs almost nothing to operate compared to my other vehicles. Also, if you are constantly chased by beautiful women, the Leaf will save you from that inconvenience.

Yes, there is a OBD plug in that you can access from a phone app that will tell you all of the details on a Leaf.