Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: Kudakidd]
#289071
04/15/09 02:50 PM
04/15/09 02:50 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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needed all the time(w flat tappet cams)
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: imfixinmopars426]
#289076
04/16/09 09:57 AM
04/16/09 09:57 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,186 Wherever I am.
Junky
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,186
Wherever I am.
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Stock or mild builds with flat tappet cams like at least 1200 ppm zinc. Major builds more, due to stronger valve springs etc. I run 5W40 Shell Rotella T full synthetic which has close to 1400 ppm zinc. Most, if not all, heavy duty (diesel) motor oils have a good amount of zinc. Racing oils too, but may not be suitable for every day cruising. www.bobistheoilguy.com has tons of info.
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: Junky]
#289077
04/16/09 04:09 PM
04/16/09 04:09 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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I had same issue, started using Brad Penn 20/50 in a mildly built 440. Estimated 1500 ppm zinc and 1450 phosporus content. Did extensive research awhile back and found this to work for me. I was able to purchase from a local supplier.
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
#289078
04/16/09 04:37 PM
04/16/09 04:37 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134 Kelowna, B.C. Canada
DPelletier
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 15,134
Kelowna, B.C. Canada
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FWIW Pennzoil 25W-50 Racing Oil has 1960ppm of Zinc and 1800ppm of phosporous. Quaker State Q Racing Synthetic is almost identical at 2000/1800
I haven't researched every oil available, but I've seen nothing higher than these two.
Dave
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack
1974 'Cuda
2008 Ram 3500 Diesel
2006 Ram 3500 Diesel
2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel
2003 Ram 3500 Diesel
2006 Durango Limited
[url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: DPelletier]
#289079
04/16/09 05:58 PM
04/16/09 05:58 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 614 ont,canada
mopartuner
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 614
ont,canada
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What kind of store do you buy this type of oil at?
410 pump gas solis flat tappet cam 10.95 so far
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: mopartuner]
#289081
04/16/09 06:17 PM
04/16/09 06:17 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,884 Michigan
MNobody
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,884
Michigan
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Here's a response from Castrol i got.
Thank you for contacting Castrol,
The latest API SM/ILSAC GF-4 category calls for reduced Zinc and Phosphorus levels to allow extended catalyst life in current model vehicles. There appear to be field issues associated with the SM/GF-4 oil's level of antiwear in the classic car engines known as flat tappet cam engines. The current late model passenger car engines are not flat tappet cam engines and have no reported field issues related to the level of antiwear chemistry in the SM/GF-4 oils. Product Recommendations for Flat Tappet (Solid Lifter) Cam Engines: Castrol Syntec 5W-40 (min Zn = 0.10 wt % = 1000 ppm)(full synthetic) Castrol Syntec 20W-50 (Recent reformulation identified by "Recommended for Classic Cars" text on back label) (min Zn = 0.12 = 1200 ppm)(full synthetic) PREFERRED Castrol TWS Motorsport 10W-60 (BMW dealerships) (min Zn = 0.10 = 1000 ppm)(full synthetic) BMW Long Life 5W-30 (BMW dealerships)(min Zn = 0.095 = 950 ppm)(full synthetic) New Motorcycle Products, Expected to be Available Q2 2008: Castrol 4T 10W-40 and 20W-50 (min Zn = 0.10 wt % = 1000 ppm) Castrol Actevo X-Tra 10W-30, 10W-40, 20W-40 and 20W-50 (min Zn = 0.10 = 1000 ppm) Castrol Actevo X-Tra Offroad 10W-40 and 20W-50 (min Zn = 0.10 = 1000 ppm) Castrol Power RS GPS 10W-30, 10W-40 and 20W-50 (min Zn = 0.12 = 1200 ppm) PREFERED Castrol Power RS R4 10W-50 and 5W-40 (min Zn = 0.12 = 1200 ppm) PREFERED Castrol Power RS V-Twin 20W-40 and 20W-50 (min Zn = 0.12 = 1200 ppm) PREFERED Existing Motorcycle Products, Will Be Transitioning Out: Castrol Grand Prix 4-Stroke Motorcycle Oil 10W-40, 20W-50 (min Zn = 0.10 wt % = 1000 ppm) Castrol GO! 10W-40, 20W-50 Motorcycle Oil (min Zn = 0.10 = 1000 ppm)
Castrol Consumer Relations
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: MNobody]
#289082
04/16/09 06:19 PM
04/16/09 06:19 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,884 Michigan
MNobody
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master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,884
Michigan
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And here's one from Shell...I'm running Rotella 15-40 in mine. With the introduction a couple of years ago of ILSAC specification GF-4 and API specification SM for gasoline-only engine oils, the amount of phosphorous in the oil had to be reduced to prolong the life of catalytic converters. Zinc-based anti-wear compounds, which also contain phosphorous, were reduced as well. These zinc compounds work well to protect flat tappet engines from excessive wear, so the modern gasoline-only engine oils are not as effective in this regard as they once were. Diesel engine oils don't suffer from the same requirements to protect catalytic converters, so the amount of zinc-based anti-wear additives remained high. Products like Shell Rotella T Oils, which also carry API S-series licenses for gasoline engines, have found favor for flat tappet engines. There has been a recent change to the API specification required for oils used in 2007 big rig diesel engines to reduce particulate emissions, API CJ-4. As a result, the zinc content in Shell Rotella T Multigrade Oils has been reduced slightly from about 1400 ppm to about 1200 ppm. Even at these slightly decreased levels, Shell Rotella T Multigrade Oils still have at least 50% more of these anti-wear additives as most current gasoline-only engine oils. These levels of zinc have historically offered good protection in flat tappet applications. Regards, Edward Calcote http://www.shell.com/us/lubricants/
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: MNobody]
#289083
04/16/09 06:21 PM
04/16/09 06:21 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,884 Michigan
MNobody
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,884
Michigan
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Here's one from Kendall too..
Kendall® GT-1 High Performance Motor Oil is a high-quality engine oil specially designed for use in gasoline-fueled vehicles operating under high-temperature or severe driving conditions, such as towing heavy loads, as well as in competition engines and high-performance street engines. GT-1 High Performance Motor Oil is formulated to provide excellent wear protection, to minimize the formation of sludge and varnish, and to resist viscosity and thermal breakdown, even in severe service. It also protects against rust and bearing corrosion, and has good foam resistance. The SAE 20W-50 viscosity grade is fortified with additional zinc dialkyldithiophosphate (ZDDP) additive to provide enhanced wear protection and oxidation resistance for use in the most demanding applications. It is particularly recommended for use in turbocharged engines and in high-performance engines with flat-tappet camshafts, especially during the critical break-in period. Applications • Gasoline-fueled passenger cars, light trucks and sport utility vehicles that do not require an ILSAC GF-4 oil for warranty coverage • Competition engines and high-performance street engines • Nitromethane-fueled drag racing vehicles (Nitro 70 grade) • Gasoline engines where monograde engine oil is recommended GT-1 High Performance Motor Oil meets or exceeds the requirements of: • API Service SM, SL (all grades except SAE 50 & Nitro 70) Features/Benefits • Excellent resistance to viscosity and thermal breakdown at high temperatures • Protects against sludge and varnish formation • Excellent wear protection • Protects against rust and bearing corrosion • Good foam resistance • Formulated for engines equipped with turbochargers or superchargers • Enhanced wear protection for engines with flat-tappet camshafts (SAE 20W-50)
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: DPelletier]
#289084
04/16/09 07:20 PM
04/16/09 07:20 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436 Blair County,PA
62maxwgn
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
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Quote:
FWIW Pennzoil 25W-50 Racing Oil has 1960ppm of Zinc and 1800ppm of phosporous. Quaker State Q Racing Synthetic is almost identical at 2000/1800
I haven't researched every oil available, but I've seen nothing higher than these two.
Dave
Dave,are those numbers from actual oil analysis or advertised figures ? I had an analysis done on the Brad Penn,here are the numbers.
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Re: oil questions/ zinc......
[Re: 70rrclone]
#289087
04/16/09 09:30 PM
04/16/09 09:30 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,285 Pacific NW USA
CompSyn
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,285
Pacific NW USA
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Quote:
i hear that zinc has been removed from oil now.
do i need to swap to an oil with zinc or is zinc primarily needed for break in
thanks shane
After break-in, run one of these and don’t worry about additives.
AMSOIL Dominator® Synthetic 10W-30 or 15W-50 Racing Oil
Zinc content 1676 ppm Phosphorus content 1509 ppm
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