Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: DemonDust]
#262545
03/25/09 10:36 PM
03/25/09 10:36 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Flaming River and they also have a splined one for the rack. I used 3/4" moly tubing for my shaft. I have 2 u-joints in my column to get it out of the way and a 3/4" oversized heim to hold the 1 point to the chassis
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: DemonDust]
#262546
03/25/09 10:47 PM
03/25/09 10:47 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591 Canton, Ohio
Sport440
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
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I got mine direct from Borgeson, but www.SpeedWaymotors.com is a good place to get them too. I needed two u jounts, one coming off the rack and one on the steering shaft, and a intermediate shaft between the two. Plus one 3/4 heim to stabilize it all to the shock tower. All in all my rack/pinion swap costed just over $400 bucs. $ 220 for the rack and $200 for all the other miscellaneous stuff. mike
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: DemonDust]
#262548
03/26/09 09:29 AM
03/26/09 09:29 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
Ok another dumb question.
After I cut the tapered end off, which way do i extend the arm. Do I go straight out (red) or continue at the same angle (blue)
Are those the wheels and tires your going to run, if so go with the red line
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: SportF]
#262550
03/26/09 10:29 AM
03/26/09 10:29 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
When re-welding, you need to continue the existing line from the center of the ball joint, otherwise your Ackerman will be off. And those ball joints are not cast iron, they are cast steel (and may be actaully forged, but that I don't know).
I disagree with you on the continue the same line for the steering arm.... the tie rod needs to end up at the same length as the lower control arm.... if he continues at the same angle(blue line) the tie rod will end up being shorter than the LCA (different arc's)
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#262551
03/26/09 10:40 AM
03/26/09 10:40 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207 Menomonee Falls
DemonDust
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
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Quote:
Quote:
When re-welding, you need to continue the existing line from the center of the ball joint, otherwise your Ackerman will be off. And those ball joints are not cast iron, they are cast steel (and may be actaully forged, but that I don't know).
I disagree with you on the continue the same line for the steering arm.... the tie rod needs to end up at the same length as the lower control arm.... if he continues at the same angle(blue line) the tie rod will end up being shorter than the LCA (different arc's)
Oh boy, everything was going so smoothly
Now we have disagreement, I'm not doubting you MR P but I'd like a tie breaker on this one. Just so I don't have to do this again.
You explanation makes sense to me Mr P.
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: DemonDust]
#262554
03/26/09 02:25 PM
03/26/09 02:25 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207 Menomonee Falls
DemonDust
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
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Mr P, your right If i extended it at an angle steering would also become a problem it would only turn so far. If you extend it straight out you lose nothing. Your right as I'm doing this it's getting easier and easier to understand. When I first started I got off track and irritated very easy and was ready to give up But with your patience you got me thru it and now I'm very happy with the results.
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: Sport440]
#262556
03/27/09 12:40 AM
03/27/09 12:40 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591 Canton, Ohio
Sport440
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
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Quote:
Your Rack is going to have to move back to take your almost maxed out inner tierod angle away. Look at your pic #4 When you turn your steering sharp left, look at the direction the outer steering arm takes.
It will swing to the rear of the car and if the rack arm is maxed out it will bend itself.
I admire what your doing but you need to put down the welder and do some more study. I dont have this rack thing down 100% myself.
Dont be like me and end up having to reposition your Rack 4 times. www.heidts.com and www.lonacreracing.com has some good info on positionening a rack.
With the A bodys you cant really get the rack exactly were it needs to be. So at best its a comprimise IMO The rack needs to be further Up and Back then you have it. But you see the problems with that no doubt. mike
Just a bump for you, to help connect some info. mike
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#262561
03/27/09 12:07 PM
03/27/09 12:07 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207 Menomonee Falls
DemonDust
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
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A new system is probably out of the question right now.
I think i have an idea what you are going to say though.....
Strut System right?
EDIT
I would although think about it for the future. Maybe a project for next winter. Money is a little short right now and I would like to get my car going if not to the strip at least on the road so I can enjoy it.
Last edited by R5P7Duster; 03/27/09 12:11 PM.
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: DemonDust]
#262562
03/27/09 12:25 PM
03/27/09 12:25 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
A new system is probably out of the question right now.
I think i have an idea what you are going to say though.....
Strut System right?
EDIT
I would although think about it for the future. Maybe a project for next winter. Money is a little short right now and I would like to get my car going if not to the strip at least on the road so I can enjoy it.
No I was thinking just a steering system, where your rack arms would hook to a pair of pivot arms and the other ends of the pivot arms would hook to your tie rods... I wish I knew how to draw on this puter
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Re: Pinto Duster steering part 2
[Re: DemonDust]
#262563
03/27/09 12:42 PM
03/27/09 12:42 PM
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 474 Alberta, Canada
451Guy
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 474
Alberta, Canada
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I have been watching this post with interest. I put a rack in my Demon a couple of winters ago. It was a long and drawn out process for me that involved lots of re-do's. As Mr. P said remove the torsion bars and the shock so that the lower control arm can move up and down freely. Mock up the rack and attach it to ball joints. Build your self a guage that you can put beside the tire to do some measuring off. Reinstall the tire and then jack up the tire through the entire travel and measure both the front and rear of the tire off the fixture to see what is happening with the toe as the tire moves up and down. The positioning of the rack will effect the toe issues as will the distance above or below the ball joint the heims are located. I would also attempt to get the attachment point for the rack to ball joint as close to the tire as possible. This will get you some ackerman and help when the car backs up. I built my own lower ball joints - I was not comfortable heating and bending or welding on the stock ones - Just me! My front end works okay after all the work. I was never able to eliminate the bump steer issue but I did limit it to the very top and the very bottom of the travel. I limited the front suspension both ways to compensate for it. I now have about 3 - 4 inches of front end travel. If I had it to do again I think I would have installed struts. Same travel no bump steer issues. That may still happen! Good Luck and I hope you have a beer fridge in the garage - Mine involved lots of head scratching and the odd frosty beverage
Thanx 451 Guy
512 cu in 71 Demon Super Street Car - NO LONGER - Broke Crank Best ET 9.57 @ 139.96
451 cu in Pump Gas - 71 Demon Super Street Car Best ET 9.99 @ 136.80
512 cu in 69 Charger R/T Best ET 11.39 @ 118.11
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