Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: A/MP]
#2469427
03/20/18 10:54 PM
03/20/18 10:54 PM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,074 Manitoba Canada
67autocross
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,074
Manitoba Canada
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9s in the 1/8 mile or the 1/4?
A new iron curtain drawn across the 49th parallel
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: A/MP]
#2469450
03/20/18 11:44 PM
03/20/18 11:44 PM
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,176 East Coast
A/MP
OP
super stock
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OP
super stock
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,176
East Coast
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: A/MP]
#2469474
03/21/18 12:25 AM
03/21/18 12:25 AM
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,176 East Coast
A/MP
OP
super stock
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OP
super stock
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,176
East Coast
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: jwb123]
#2469477
03/21/18 12:28 AM
03/21/18 12:28 AM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457 Washington
madscientist
master
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master
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457
Washington
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It takes approx 725Hp to make a 3400lb car go 9.90, a stock block just won't take that kind of power, for any length of time. see the above post. My math says 650 HP to go 9.90 in a 3400lb car
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: madscientist]
#2469479
03/21/18 12:29 AM
03/21/18 12:29 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,313 Charlotte, NC
LSP
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,313
Charlotte, NC
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It takes approx 725Hp to make a 3400lb car go 9.90, a stock block just won't take that kind of power, for any length of time. see the above post. My math says 650 HP to go 9.90 in a 3400lb car Your math is closer.
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: LSP]
#2469482
03/21/18 12:36 AM
03/21/18 12:36 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,172 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,172
PA.
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Absolutely I could do it with a 360 of you consider a 610 roller a small cam. I do.
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: A/MP]
#2469487
03/21/18 12:42 AM
03/21/18 12:42 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,448 Phoenix, AZ
MoparBilly
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,448
Phoenix, AZ
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Define "Big HP" Define "Small cam" Define "Reasonable heads" Define "Dependable" Define "Lower Maintenance" Define "Into the Nines"
All these things mean different things to different people.
My old Edelbrock RPM headed 440 had the old NF-69 Ultradyne .640 lift solid, Isky ductile rockers, Ross 11.5 pistons. To some that's a small cam, to others it may be huge. It went one 9.96, and one 9.98 in my 2950lb Challenger, so you could say it went "into the nines", but I've got 600 time slips between 10.02 and 10.45.
"Dependable"? In 6 years of racing, every failure was directly attributable to my penchant to occasionally hit it with 275-475 horses worth of spray. The Isky ductiles never moved, and I only ran the valves three times in those six seasons.
"Lower maintenance"? Oil change every 75 passes, a set of plugs once a season. Keeping the air bleeds blown out on the dominator was more effort than anything else.
I'm going to say this as simply as I can. Every single stock stroke 440 block that has been broken at this horsepower level, has been broken by detonation, not because it was making too much power. Period. End of story. But racers prefer to blame the parts than own up to the fact that their tune-up was off. Not saying it wasn't a great tune-up on that cold day in October with mine shaft air and c-12 in the tank, but when you drag it back out in may and the DA is three thousand foot higher, and all you could grab was av-gas...you better back it off some.
If I was starting fresh right now with a stock stroke 440, I think I'd do the Trick Flow 240's a mid 650 lift solid, with another pair of isky ductile rockers, and keep the compression around 11 to 1. It wouldn't run 9s all year long at 3000lb pounds, but it would do it in cool air.
"Livin' in a powder keg and givin' off sparks"
4 Street cars, 5 Race engines
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: jwb123]
#2469488
03/21/18 12:43 AM
03/21/18 12:43 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,172 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,172
PA.
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It takes approx 725Hp to make a 3400lb car go 9.90, a stock block just won't take that kind of power, for any length of time. see the above post. He said a 3000 pound car guys
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: A/MP]
#2469494
03/21/18 12:54 AM
03/21/18 12:54 AM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,363 Cotati, CA
Dave Hall
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,363
Cotati, CA
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Are you asking me? When I owned the engine it had this one. It still lives in my Dart street car! The guy I bought it from had something larger. It was some oddball thing I sold long ago.
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: A/MP]
#2469498
03/21/18 01:06 AM
03/21/18 01:06 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591 Canton, Ohio
Sport440
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
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Using stock production block, no stroker kit, no power adders, a reasonable set of head and a relatively true Mopar, can good HP be made with either SB or BB to move a 3000 lbs car into the 9's and be a dependable lower maintenance car? Sure a MP purple .590 440 around 10.9 comp with a 4500 stall vert @ 3000#, no problem. SB, a lot tougher, most likely not.
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: Sport440]
#2469510
03/21/18 01:30 AM
03/21/18 01:30 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,172 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,172
PA.
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You are adding to many rules but I will say yes I can with Edelbrock heads
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: CAN YOU MAKE BIG HP WITH A SMALL CAM
[Re: A/MP]
#2469515
03/21/18 01:39 AM
03/21/18 01:39 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,448 Phoenix, AZ
MoparBilly
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,448
Phoenix, AZ
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My small block is .600 lift with crane golds, beehive springs and is street reliable.
As reliable as the .630-.650 lift solids we've been running in our big blocks have been, I'll likely never go smaller again.
Nines in the dog days of summer requires 9.60 capability in mine shaft conditions.
My Dad's Challenger is an old school example, but it had parts that made it a little more difficult than it has to be now.
Stock stroke 440, Indy SR heads with 1.5 crane golds (non-offset) Indy intake 10.50 dominator. 2 1/8 headers (likely too big) and the Hughes STL6872. We ported the roofs of the SR heads to match the max wedge intake, but left the width alone. The car had a 2.03 low gear set glide, and a 5200 stall converter. With a 4.56 gear and 29.5-11.5 slicks, it was animal, running 9.60-9.70 in the 137 range.
Alas Dad wanted low tens, and a car that didn't move around on the track, so we put in 4.10's and 14X32 slicks. He was happy, his four sons...not so much. That motor would absolutely come alive from 6400 to 7200...fun stuff. Memory serves, with Dad aboard that car was around 2850 though.
"Livin' in a powder keg and givin' off sparks"
4 Street cars, 5 Race engines
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