Using stock production block, no stroker kit, no power adders, a reasonable set of head and a relatively true Mopar, can good HP be made with either SB or BB to move a 3000 lbs car into the 9's and be a dependable lower maintenance car?

9s in the 1/8 mile or the 1/4?

1/4

I bought my first 440 "race" engine from a guy running Super Gas with it at 145 plus. Ported iron heads, stock block, stroke, etc. My Challenger was a bit (4-500pds.???) heavier than his Daytona and I ran a smaller cam but would run 10.0's at 135-137. I still have the oil pump and hand grinded upon Harland Sharp roller rockers from it. Sold the epoxied, cracked, etc. cyl. heads. This thankfully happened on the starting line after a .001 light...

It takes approx 725Hp to make a 3400lb car go 9.90, a stock block just won't take that kind of power, for any length of time. see the above post.

FWIW, I'd be surprised if this one made 600HP. It ran really good for a long time.

Remember the cam specs?

My math says 650 HP to go 9.90 in a 3400lb car

Your math is closer.

Absolutely I could do it with a 360 of you consider a 610 roller a small cam. I do.

Define "Big HP"
Define "Small cam"
Define "Reasonable heads"
Define "Dependable"
Define "Lower Maintenance"
Define "Into the Nines"

All these things mean different things to different people.

My old Edelbrock RPM headed 440 had the old NF-69 Ultradyne .640 lift solid, Isky ductile rockers, Ross 11.5 pistons. To some that's a small cam, to others it may be huge. It went one 9.96, and one 9.98 in my 2950lb Challenger, so you could say it went "into the nines", but I've got 600 time slips between 10.02 and 10.45.

"Dependable"? In 6 years of racing, every failure was directly attributable to my penchant to occasionally hit it with 275-475 horses worth of spray. The Isky ductiles never moved, and I only ran the valves three times in those six seasons.

"Lower maintenance"? Oil change every 75 passes, a set of plugs once a season. Keeping the air bleeds blown out on the dominator was more effort than anything else.

I'm going to say this as simply as I can. Every single stock stroke 440 block that has been broken at this horsepower level, has been broken by detonation, not because it was making too much power. Period. End of story. But racers prefer to blame the parts than own up to the fact that their tune-up was off. Not saying it wasn't a great tune-up on that cold day in October with mine shaft air and c-12 in the tank, but when you drag it back out in may and the DA is three thousand foot higher, and all you could grab was av-gas...you better back it off some.

If I was starting fresh right now with a stock stroke 440, I think I'd do the Trick Flow 240's a mid 650 lift solid, with another pair of isky ductile rockers, and keep the compression around 11 to 1. It wouldn't run 9s all year long at 3000lb pounds, but it would do it in cool air.

He said a 3000 pound car guys

HP that moves a 3000 lbs car into the 9's during the heat of the summer.
No B1 or Indy heads that are more than $2500.00 ready to run- not requiring special intake, rockers, headers, etc.
590 or less cam and flat tappet.
Your not under the hood after each pass adjusting valves and it doesn't eat parts after every 10-20 passes.
904 or 727.

Are you asking me? When I owned the engine it had this one. It still lives in my Dart street car! The guy I bought it from had something larger. It was some oddball thing I sold long ago.

Yes. Thought that might remember.

About 600-650 HP to do the job. Factory SB or BB not up to the task? I think this is why I'm looking to run the number w/o beating the motor up. John, wasn't your son running 10.00 with a stock 360 block and your magical heads?

Sure a MP purple .590 440 around 10.9 comp with a 4500 stall vert @ 3000#, no problem. SB, a lot tougher, most likely not.

You are adding to many rules but I will say yes I can with Edelbrock heads

My small block is .600 lift with crane golds, beehive springs and is street reliable.

As reliable as the .630-.650 lift solids we've been running in our big blocks have been, I'll likely never go smaller again.

Nines in the dog days of summer requires 9.60 capability in mine shaft conditions.


My Dad's Challenger is an old school example, but it had parts that made it a little more difficult than it has to be now.

Stock stroke 440, Indy SR heads with 1.5 crane golds (non-offset) Indy intake 10.50 dominator. 2 1/8 headers (likely too big) and the Hughes STL6872.
We ported the roofs of the SR heads to match the max wedge intake, but left the width alone. The car had a 2.03 low gear set glide, and a 5200 stall converter. With a 4.56 gear and 29.5-11.5 slicks, it was animal, running 9.60-9.70 in the 137 range.

Alas Dad wanted low tens, and a car that didn't move around on the track, so we put in 4.10's and 14X32 slicks. He was happy, his four sons...not so much. That motor would absolutely come alive from 6400 to 7200...fun stuff. Memory serves, with Dad aboard that car was around 2850 though.

Yes I'm sure it can be done but if it is your first rodeo it might take a few tries before you find the correct combo. My pump gas low deck 470 makes around 700 hp with out of the box Trick Flow 240 heads. I'm running a roller cam so you'll give up some power with a flat tappet but not a huge amount. A ported intake manifold is a good way to pick up some power. EFI would solve a bunch of issues and help make the engine really reliable. So yeah, I'd say it could be done but probably best to team up with someone who has done it before so you aren't doing all the R&D yourself.