Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
#2304586
05/14/17 11:00 PM
05/14/17 11:00 PM
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Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 170 Wisconsin
Medlock51
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OP
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Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 170
Wisconsin
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Okay... so I'm rebuilding an older dirt late model to run at my local half mile. Right now I have a SBM 383 that had some damage and I'm repairing it to run next season.
The original configuration of this motor was mostly Mopar.... 3.79 crank, 340 bushed rods, W-2 ported heads and an M-1 port matched intake, purple shaft solid flat tappet, Mopar adj. rockers (also came with a set of T&D's), 3/8" valves... you get the idea. The PO ran it no more than 6500-6700 RPM's. Dyno'd at 575 HP. The engine was run in an IMCA type modified.
Now that I'll be running with a faster crowd that 575 is a little on the lean side for HP. The guys are running up to a bit north of 750 HP and I see 8200 RPM's on some tachs. No place for heavy valves, stock rockers and such. Typically these are built by Clement, RCR, Yates or another big name shop. 30k engines are not uncommon.
So I'm thinking about building a 700 HP Gen 3 for 2019. There are several different routes to go with this... 362 spec engine, iron block/aluminum head combo @ 370 CI, IMCA mod engine (which I have... all iron, flat tappet cam), and an open class for unlimited cubes, all aluminum running a 15/16" restrictor plate. Gotta run a 4 barrel carb. I think I can get away with the stock crank trigger ignition with the MSD box set-up.
I think a cam change in my present combo could get me to 625-640 HP so I'll need a bit more to make it worth my trouble.
What I THINK I know...
Any 5.7 block should work.
Ported early heads can flow 300+ on the intake but the stock Apache's can beat that out of the box.
Stock PM rods won't make the cut.
Stock 5.7 crank is cast?
The oiling system is camshaft priority... that scares me in an endurance deal. Anyone mod the block to oil the crank first?
I'll need a solid roller... T&D and Jesel make rockers.
What I DON'T THINK I know...
Stock valve covers? Yes or no?
Stock cam tunnel is how big? Are roller bearings worth the cost?
How long are the stock valves? How big can the valve spring diameter be if the heads are cut? What's the max. lift the beehives can handle?
Mopar or Ritter intake?
Maximum bore size?
Half fill in the block needed?
I'll need 13 1/2 to 14-1 compression with methanol... any problems there?
This is a good start... I'll be back.
Last edited by Medlock51; 05/14/17 11:05 PM.
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Re: Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
[Re: Medlock51]
#2304633
05/15/17 12:32 AM
05/15/17 12:32 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225 Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
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Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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The newer 5.7 and apache valve covers are taller however Steff switched to indys for a reason but i dont know if he even tried the newer covers.
On methenol I would go 15+ on compression.
Cam tunnel IDK
Oiling, you will need to get tips from the factory stock guys that spin their junk to 8500
Not sure if there is much difference in intakes but the mopar ones are alot more money
Last edited by sixpackgut; 05/15/17 12:34 AM.
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135 Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
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Re: Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
[Re: Medlock51]
#2304668
05/15/17 01:49 AM
05/15/17 01:49 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225 Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
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Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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I bought my intake for $550. I bet 7500rpm with a hyd cam and 700hp is possible with stock rockers.
Last edited by sixpackgut; 05/15/17 01:54 AM.
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135 Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
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Re: Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
[Re: Medlock51]
#2304747
05/15/17 09:36 AM
05/15/17 09:36 AM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400 Trumbauersville PA
ric3xrt
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400
Trumbauersville PA
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I spent most of Sunday reading thru the GenIII section of fastmopar dot com http://www.fastmopar.com/forum/index.php?topic=1002.90I found a lot of good stuff in there, and of course the typical banter. I'm looking to do a 383 inch G3 myself , Bore 3.957 Stroke 3.9 and 6.125 rods. I'm thinking of something in the high .500s for lift and 220-230 @50. Not looking to make the kind of power you need but if I can get close to a solid high 500(575+) I'll be happy for now.
Truth has no agenda, but those with an agenda make their own truth. Some of us are so open minded they only see their View
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Re: Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
[Re: Medlock51]
#2304894
05/15/17 02:35 PM
05/15/17 02:35 PM
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Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 170 Wisconsin
Medlock51
OP
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OP
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Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 170
Wisconsin
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Good info.... This is mostly new to me. I'll need to think this over before I make a move but so far what I hear is promising.
I read that they have cam priority oiling.... Glad that's not correct.
Last edited by Medlock51; 05/15/17 05:14 PM.
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Re: Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
[Re: joshking440]
#2307857
05/20/17 11:57 AM
05/20/17 11:57 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,871 Smyrna, South Carolina
STEFF
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Steff,
Doesn't Jessel make a drop in solid lifter? Yes, they have a Dog Bone style at $230ish per lifter. Plus $350ish for the dog bones. I've talked to numerous lifter manufacturers including Morel and they all have a solid lifter in their plans but no time line as to when.
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Re: Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
[Re: WO23Coronet]
#2307861
05/20/17 12:04 PM
05/20/17 12:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,871 Smyrna, South Carolina
STEFF
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Smyrna, South Carolina
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From what I remember reading is the cross drilling causes oil starvation at high rpm on the Gen III's? From all the oiling issues that ever I've heard, and it's all third person, is all related to the factory cross drilled cranks. The Gen 3 aftermarket cranks available are not cross drilled. For the cost of an aftermarket crank, $750-850, to me, it's worth buying a new crank and keeping the stock stuff for lower rpm, street stuff.
Last edited by STEFF; 05/20/17 12:05 PM.
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Re: Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
[Re: STEFF]
#2308194
05/20/17 10:17 PM
05/20/17 10:17 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,590 Indy
joshking440
Lunch is on me!
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Lunch is on me!
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,590
Indy
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Steff,
Doesn't Jessel make a drop in solid lifter? Yes, they have a Dog Bone style at $230ish per lifter. Plus $350ish for the dog bones. I've talked to numerous lifter manufacturers including Morel and they all have a solid lifter in their plans but no time line as to when. Wooohaaaaa
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Re: Gen 3 questions... lots of them.
[Re: WO23Coronet]
#2309645
05/23/17 10:19 AM
05/23/17 10:19 AM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,254 Canada
WO23Coronet
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Posts: 4,254
Canada
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There was a guy who built a roundy round 5.7 on here and he posted the build/specs. He did run into a problem when it ate the crank but I think it had something to do with using the stock 6.1 crank and it being cross drilled? He switched to an aftermarket crank and it seemed to solve the problem. Mentioning that, is that the reason high RPM Gen III's were eating cranks? I know I read that this was a problem and the consensus was the cross drilled 6.1 crank From a thread on the Unlawful section, another member remembered his handle and it's member CHAPPER.
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