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Hemi Build #2282108
04/04/17 11:29 AM
04/04/17 11:29 AM
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Wheatfield, NY
Cuda340 Offline OP
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How would you build a nice street Hemi if you only had a stock brand new block. This is an older unused Mopar Performance water block P5007668(non-Siamese) that was just cleaned and magged. The bore is currently 4.250", so what bore, stroke combos work the best? What heads? Cam, Etc.? I would like to keep the internal oiling system if possible.

Hemi 2.jpgHemi 6.jpgHemi 4.jpgHemi 5.jpg
Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282109
04/04/17 11:30 AM
04/04/17 11:30 AM
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Wheatfield, NY
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.

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Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282110
04/04/17 11:37 AM
04/04/17 11:37 AM
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Stuttgart, Arkansas
rickseeman Offline
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You have to say how much horsepower you want and if the intake has to fit under a stock hood etc.


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Re: Hemi Build [Re: rickseeman] #2282112
04/04/17 11:42 AM
04/04/17 11:42 AM
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sixpacksteve Offline
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as the old saying goes: speed costs money son How fast do you want to go!


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Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282154
04/04/17 12:45 PM
04/04/17 12:45 PM
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Wheatfield, NY
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Haha, understood! How about 700+HP on pump gas and yes fit under a stock hood. This isn't going to be a "hypothetical" build this will be real. So lets spend some money!

Last edited by Cuda340; 04/04/17 12:49 PM.
Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282173
04/04/17 01:07 PM
04/04/17 01:07 PM
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Are you sure that is not a siamese bore block ? It has notches for rod clearance in stroked applications? Was there a yellow tag on the rear that said not to bore past a certian overbore size ?

700HP ... stroke it.... put a 4.25 arm in it with 2.2 rod journals for starters.

Dual quads or single carb ?


running up my post count some more .
Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282181
04/04/17 01:17 PM
04/04/17 01:17 PM
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Wheatfield, NY
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Yeah John, it is a water block small bore, not the Siamese version. This was made in about 2001 I believe. I was thinking at least a 4.25 crank, but was wondering if a 4.375" crank to get me over 500" is doable with the stock oiling system (or even worth it), I don't believe a 4.500" crank will fit with a stock pick up. There was no yellow tag, but if you look at the top picture I posted above it shows how (specs) the block came from MP. Overbore capacity is 4.31". This will be a dual quad motor.

Hemi 1.jpgHemi 2.jpg
Last edited by Cuda340; 04/04/17 01:19 PM.
Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282189
04/04/17 01:28 PM
04/04/17 01:28 PM
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California
mickm Offline
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You are defiantly going to need to bore and stroke to get 700 out of it. Well, I should say if you want a steerable 700... And then again, we all have a different opinion of steerable....

My build is a siamese block, 4.5X4.25, 540ci. Around 10.25:1, Stage V heads prepped by FHO, and the cam is roughly 248 @ .050 .605 I .580 E. Numbers probably aren't exact, but close enough. MSD with a Chrysler electronic distributor, Stage V intake with 2 Edelbrock 650's.

Dyno'd at 712 HP @ 6000. That was at 34 degrees timing. It was pulling 6-7 more hp per hundred RPM at 32 degrees, but that was the end of a long, long day, and it was good enough for me!

I chose a somewhat mild cam, for 540 inches, as I wanted power, but streetabliity. There are times when this car gets driven a lot.

Re: Hemi Build [Re: mickm] #2282199
04/04/17 01:38 PM
04/04/17 01:38 PM
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Wheatfield, NY
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Originally Posted By mickm
You are defiantly going to need to bore and stroke to get 700 out of it. Well, I should say if you want a steerable 700... And then again, we all have a different opinion of steerable....

My build is a siamese block, 4.5X4.25, 540ci. Around 10.25:1, Stage V heads prepped by FHO, and the cam is roughly 248 @ .050 .605 I .580 E. Numbers probably aren't exact, but close enough. MSD with a Chrysler electronic distributor, Stage V intake with 2 Edelbrock 650's.

Dyno'd at 712 HP @ 6000. That was at 34 degrees timing. It was pulling 6-7 more hp per hundred RPM at 32 degrees, but that was the end of a long, long day, and it was good enough for me!

I chose a somewhat mild cam, for 540 inches, as I wanted power, but streetabliity. There are times when this car gets driven a lot.


Did Tim at FHO build your Hemi? Roller Cam? What Rockers?

Last edited by Cuda340; 04/04/17 03:36 PM.
Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282215
04/04/17 02:05 PM
04/04/17 02:05 PM
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Minnesota
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a 4.25 crank with a 2.2 rod journals is about perfect for your application. It will fit with the internal oil pickup. A 4.375 might fit, depending on the block, so had the hole a little farther out. 700-800 horse should be easy with the right cam and heads, and decent compression.

Mickm, I'm sure there is a reason you went with a small cam like that, but I think you are leaving 100 horsepower on the table.


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Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282276
04/04/17 03:35 PM
04/04/17 03:35 PM
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Wheatfield, NY
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Let's say the 4.375" crank will fit, is it at an advantage or a disadvantage over the 4.250" crank? What heads should I run Stage V? Roller cam?

Re: Hemi Build [Re: Hemi_Joel] #2282278
04/04/17 03:38 PM
04/04/17 03:38 PM
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Between a rock & a hard place
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I can tell you that a 4.375 crank with 2.200 rod journals will clear most blocks easily and allow the use of the internal pick up. At .030 over that = 505 inches.

Re: Hemi Build [Re: cudadoug] #2282290
04/04/17 04:03 PM
04/04/17 04:03 PM
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Chilliwack B.C. Canada
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I would run the 4.375 crank. Stage V heads are great or the new Edelbrocks look pretty good as well, might be cheaper to run the Edelbrocks I think. Plan on a 650ish solid Roller cam, you don't want to chance losing a flat lifter and damaging anything with the shrapnel. Stage V dual 4 intake works great. I would also plan on injecting it from the get go, it isn't 1971 anymore.

Sheldon


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Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282292
04/04/17 04:09 PM
04/04/17 04:09 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Two things to keep in mind when buying and building your motor, how much power will your car handle and how much power can you handle? work whistling
On that block, does the oil pump pick up screw into the block or is the block machine for the bolt on adapter like the Worlds blocks are? If bolt on try the 4.375 stroke with BB Chevy 2.200 rod journal sizes, if not use the 4.25 stroke with the BB Chevy H beam steel rods up
As far as the heads, intake, carb. sizes and camshaft buy bigger than needed for stock C.I. size motor twocents
I'm building a 572 C.I. pump gas hemiroid motor now for a local customer, it will be EFI with dual 4150 bolt pattern 1000 CFM dry throttle bodies with FHO prepare Stage V aluminum heads, FHO Stage V rocker arm assembly, EFI intake for the dual throttle bodies, solid roller cam and so on. I'm hoping and expecting 750 + HP and similar torque luck
I cam and do make more HP with wedge motors similarly equip than I can with 426 style Hemiroid motors whiney shruggy


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Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cab_Burge] #2282299
04/04/17 04:19 PM
04/04/17 04:19 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,368
Wheatfield, NY
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Originally Posted By Cab_Burge
Two things to keep in mind when buying and building your motor, how much power will your car handle and how much power can you handle? work whistling
On that block, does the oil pump pick up screw into the block or is the block machine for the bolt on adapter like the Worlds blocks are? If bolt on try the 4.375 stroke with BB Chevy 2.200 rod journal sizes, if not use the 4.25 stroke with the BB Chevy H beam steel rods up
As far as the heads, intake, carb. sizes and camshaft buy bigger than needed for stock C.I. size motor twocents
I'm building a 572 C.I. pump gas hemiroid motor now for a local customer, it will be EFI with dual 4150 bolt pattern 1000 CFM dry throttle bodies with FHO prepare Stage V aluminum heads, FHO Stage V rocker arm assembly, EFI intake for the dual throttle bodies, solid roller cam and so on. I'm hoping and expecting 750 + HP and similar torque luck
I cam and do make more HP with wedge motors similarly equip than I can with 426 style Hemiroid motors whiney shruggy


"On that block, does the oil pump pick up screw into the block or is the block machine for the bolt on adapter like the Worlds blocks are?"
I will have to check.

Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282339
04/04/17 05:25 PM
04/04/17 05:25 PM
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N.Y.
sixpacksteve Offline
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call Tim at FHO he'll tell you Exactly what you'll need even if he doesn't build it. (let him build it!)


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Re: Hemi Build [Re: sixpacksteve] #2282383
04/04/17 06:28 PM
04/04/17 06:28 PM
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Wheatfield, NY
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Originally Posted By sixpacksteve
call Tim at FHO he'll tell you Exactly what you'll need even if he doesn't build it. (let him build it!)


That call has been made, and he will get the nod.....

Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282631
04/05/17 01:43 AM
04/05/17 01:43 AM
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California
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Originally Posted By Cuda340
Originally Posted By mickm
You are defiantly going to need to bore and stroke to get 700 out of it. Well, I should say if you want a steerable 700... And then again, we all have a different opinion of steerable....

My build is a siamese block, 4.5X4.25, 540ci. Around 10.25:1, Stage V heads prepped by FHO, and the cam is roughly 248 @ .050 .605 I .580 E. Numbers probably aren't exact, but close enough. MSD with a Chrysler electronic distributor, Stage V intake with 2 Edelbrock 650's.

Dyno'd at 712 HP @ 6000. That was at 34 degrees timing. It was pulling 6-7 more hp per hundred RPM at 32 degrees, but that was the end of a long, long day, and it was good enough for me!

I chose a somewhat mild cam, for 540 inches, as I wanted power, but streetabliity. There are times when this car gets driven a lot.


Did Tim at FHO build your Hemi? Roller Cam? What Rockers?


I had long conversations with Tim about exactly what I wanted, then he packaged everything he had up and sent it out, and then I assembled the engine.

Tight lash roller cam, I forget what rockers. I wanted stock valve covers, and I think Tim chose something else for me as StageV won't fit under stock covers.

Re: Hemi Build [Re: Hemi_Joel] #2282632
04/05/17 01:47 AM
04/05/17 01:47 AM
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California
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Originally Posted By Hemi_Joel


a 4.25 crank with a 2.2 rod journals is about perfect for your application. It will fit with the internal oil pickup. A 4.375 might fit, depending on the block, so had the hole a little farther out. 700-800 horse should be easy with the right cam and heads, and decent compression.

Mickm, I'm sure there is a reason you went with a small cam like that, but I think you are leaving 100 horsepower on the table.


Yes, I defiantly am. As I mentioned in the last post, long conversations with Tim. In the end we went with that cam because:

1) I didn't want to be messing with new lifters all the time. So I have good lifters and a relatively mild cam with mild ramps.
2) I wanted it to be drivable, my version of drivable. Car gets driven a lot at times, about to take it down to LA, ~400 miles. With the 2X4's I would get ~14mpg on the highway. Not bad. Will be interesting to see what it does with the six pack.
3) I can only fit 275/60 tires under there. As it is these are useless in 1st and 2nd. I didn't plan on anymore frame modifications, so knew I wouldn't even be able to hook this power well, so with the above 2 factors, this was good enough for me! up

Re: Hemi Build [Re: mickm] #2282644
04/05/17 02:25 AM
04/05/17 02:25 AM
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Originally Posted By mickm
Originally Posted By Hemi_Joel


a 4.25 crank with a 2.2 rod journals is about perfect for your application. It will fit with the internal oil pickup. A 4.375 might fit, depending on the block, so had the hole a little farther out. 700-800 horse should be easy with the right cam and heads, and decent compression.

Mickm, I'm sure there is a reason you went with a small cam like that, but I think you are leaving 100 horsepower on the table.


Yes, I defiantly am. As I mentioned in the last post, long conversations with Tim. In the end we went with that cam because:

1) I didn't want to be messing with new lifters all the time. So I have good lifters and a relatively mild cam with mild ramps.
2) I wanted it to be drivable, my version of drivable. Car gets driven a lot at times, about to take it down to LA, ~400 miles. With the 2X4's I would get ~14mpg on the highway. Not bad. Will be interesting to see what it does with the six pack.
3) I can only fit 275/60 tires under there. As it is these are useless in 1st and 2nd. I didn't plan on anymore frame modifications, so knew I wouldn't even be able to hook this power well, so with the above 2 factors, this was good enough for me! up


That, my friends is a FFFFFFUN street car!

Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282717
04/05/17 10:30 AM
04/05/17 10:30 AM
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Great Neck,LI,new york
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Not hard to fit a 4.5 stroke in a siamesed bore with a little clearancing.

ShortBlock Rod3.jpgShortBlock2.jpg

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Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282746
04/05/17 11:34 AM
04/05/17 11:34 AM
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Stuttgart, Arkansas
rickseeman Offline
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700 hp out of a 528 with Edelbrock heads will be easy and fun. The Edelbrock intake fits under the hood with the dual inline quads.


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Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282758
04/05/17 12:04 PM
04/05/17 12:04 PM
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Posts: 2,368
Wheatfield, NY
Cuda340 Offline OP
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Hemiitis, This block is not a Siamese bore. Wish it was, then I could go with a 4.500" arm.

Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282759
04/05/17 12:05 PM
04/05/17 12:05 PM
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Wheatfield, NY
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Mickm, thanks for taking the time to give me a good write up!

Re: Hemi Build [Re: Cuda340] #2282760
04/05/17 12:05 PM
04/05/17 12:05 PM
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Wheatfield, NY
Cuda340 Offline OP
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Cab, the pickup tube does screw into this block, no plate.

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