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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206271
01/27/09 09:07 PM
01/27/09 09:07 PM
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 984
San Diego CA
65 Hemi
super stock
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super stock
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 984
San Diego CA
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Make sure the flex plate bolts are all the way in the convertor and the convertor is all the way on the input shaft.
Doug
MOPAR or NO CAR!!!
1965 Dodge Coronet soon a 6.1 Hemi with a Magnson blower 810 hp on pump gas
1964 Dodge Polara 582" Indy alum Block 426-1RA heads,
1933 Plymouth PE all Steel, LT1 4L60E
1959 Plymouth Savoy 33,000 mile survivor
Old cars are never done. They are ongoing projects!
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: Pat7272]
#206273
01/27/09 09:26 PM
01/27/09 09:26 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 530
MI
kjh440
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 530
MI
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: Pat7272]
#206274
01/27/09 09:26 PM
01/27/09 09:26 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
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Drag Week Mod Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
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Last edited by sixpackgut; 01/27/09 10:28 PM.
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206276
01/27/09 09:32 PM
01/27/09 09:32 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,715
closer to Canadian beer!
torkrules
I'm neurotic
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I'm neurotic
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,715
closer to Canadian beer!
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Quote:
We just pulled the stroker motor off the engine stand to put in the car and i thought we should check the bellhousing to see if it was lined up correct and the crank will not spin 360 degrees around. it hits the same spot either way you spin it. it probably spins about 345 degrees from shere it stops around the other way until it hits.
i didnt build the motor a local race engine builder built it but i cant imagine this is normal? almost seems like one of the rod bolts or crank is hitting. its a 440 block stroked to 500"
any ideas?
I had the same problem with mine. In my case the crank counter weight was hitting a spot on the block. I had to grind the block to make clearance. I found it once I put the crank in. I guess the questions other have asked is valid. Did it turn before you put it in?
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206282
01/27/09 10:30 PM
01/27/09 10:30 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Since a local builder did the job, load it back up and take it back to him without opening it up... let him take care of it 
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: rowin4]
#206288
01/28/09 07:45 AM
01/28/09 07:45 AM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 21,345
Marysville, O-H-I-O
70Cuda383
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 21,345
Marysville, O-H-I-O
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If it was me, I would have just lost confidence in the engine builder, and I would let him know that. I'd call him and tell him that it won't turn over all the way, maybe take it and show him, and then tell him that you now have reason to doubt the quality of his work, and will be taking it somewhere else for a full inspection. you will deduct any cost from what you owe him. if you already paid him, then you could try to invoice him for it, or cancel the credit card payment in full, and work it out afterwards.
unless you are familiar with the builder, have done work with him before, or know his work from other buddy's or friends of yours. if it was my first time there, and I had no history with them, I'd be extremly suspect of the rest of their work.
but, then again, I had a machine shop hose me on SEVERAL items that I discovered during my build up.
For example:
A) I spec'd the pistons to be .005 in the hole. calculated it out, knowing the deck height, rod, stroke, compression height, etc. it should have been .005 in the hole. on mock up, they called me and said "it all spins pretty good, everything checks out great. by the way, this thing is zero deck" when iwas putting it together myself, I measured them, and they were not zero deck, they were where they should have been, .005 in the hole!
B) I asked them to mock it up for me and check piston to valve clearance, and tell me what length pushrods I needed. I ordered the size they told me I needed, and they were .500" too long! the valves wouldn't even close! (apparently they forgot to switch out the solid lifter they used during mock up, to a hydraulic lifter for checing pushrod length)
C) they said they put it all together and it spun around great. when I put it together, the crank wouldn't even move because the main bearings needed to be shaved to work with my crank
D) After lots of mis-communication, confusion, and lack of understanding on how I wanted it balanced, I fired them and picked up all my stuff. they quipped at me "by the way, that cam is no good. it won't make enough vacuum to shift your transmission" I reminded them that the flywheels are for manualtransmissions, flex plates are for automatics, and it's a mopar, there is no vacuum signal needed for the automatic transmission!
--there's more that I could go into, but, you get the idea
so, if they missed that one tiny thing (oil pick up--if that's what it is) ask yourself...what else did they miss?
**Photobucket sucks**
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: turbobitt]
#206292
01/28/09 11:44 AM
01/28/09 11:44 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,542
BROOK PARK, OH
WILD BILL
Senior Member of the Junior Dragster Club
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Senior Member of the Junior Dragster Club
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,542
BROOK PARK, OH
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Did you check and make sure they took the piston stop out if they did degree the cam 
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206294
01/28/09 02:14 PM
01/28/09 02:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,978
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,978
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
we were just looking into the spark plug hole with a light shining in through the valve when it opens i can see half the piston and there was nothing i could see. i thought something may have fell into the exhaust valve and onto the piston. we even turned the motor on its side so if there was anything there on it it should slide over to the side i could see.
the guy that built it says it spun when it left so if he takes it apart and there was nothing he did we would have to pay him. i dont blame him for that but if it was something we dropped in and he pulled the heads to get it the gaskets are $130 for the heads plus labor so i just wanted to be sure there wasnt something dropped in it.
If you have him do it be there when he disassembles it because if you aren't the next phone call will be looking for money because it wasn't his fault . 
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: JohnRR]
#206295
01/28/09 02:52 PM
01/28/09 02:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 27,347
Today? Who Knows?
1_WILD_RT
Management Trainee
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Management Trainee
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 27,347
Today? Who Knows?
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Quote:
Quote:
we were just looking into the spark plug hole with a light shining in through the valve when it opens i can see half the piston and there was nothing i could see. i thought something may have fell into the exhaust valve and onto the piston. we even turned the motor on its side so if there was anything there on it it should slide over to the side i could see.
the guy that built it says it spun when it left so if he takes it apart and there was nothing he did we would have to pay him. i dont blame him for that but if it was something we dropped in and he pulled the heads to get it the gaskets are $130 for the heads plus labor so i just wanted to be sure there wasnt something dropped in it.
If you have him do it be there when he disassembles it because if you aren't the next phone call will be looking for money because it wasn't his fault .
 There's a reason I put my own stuff together...After some of the stuff I've seen I wish I could do all the machine work but thats just not realistic...
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: 1_WILD_RT]
#206296
01/28/09 02:59 PM
01/28/09 02:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 3,957
West Coast, CA
Troy
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 3,957
West Coast, CA
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Make sure the flex plate bolts to crank are not to long.
Don't ask me how I know....
....there is nothing like driving my 1968 Hemi Dart around town and having people looking at you like you're nuts!!
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: sixpackgut]
#206297
01/28/09 04:32 PM
01/28/09 04:32 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 189
long island new york
kingdust
member
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member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 189
long island new york
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Ihave to assume you didn't turn the motor over on the stand,and I can't believe the guy who builds race engines would give you the motor that way! You mentioned bellhousing,if you put the flywheel on maybe the bolts are hitting the block, if not I would pull the pan down and see what's going on!
LIFE IS A LESSON,YOU LEARN IT WHEN YOUR THROUGH!
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206298
01/28/09 05:14 PM
01/28/09 05:14 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 189
long island new york
kingdust
member
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member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 189
long island new york
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In my last post I said I can't believe an engine builder would give you the motor that wouldn't turn over. Their are engine builders who rip people off and I know few on long island who since moved out of state because nobody would deal with them anymore. That's why I said take the pan down and see for yourself and then take it back so he can't BS you! Good luck.
LIFE IS A LESSON,YOU LEARN IT WHEN YOUR THROUGH!
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206303
01/28/09 06:58 PM
01/28/09 06:58 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
polyspheric
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
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Call him up, tell him what happened.
When he's done "explaining", tell him he has 24 hours to come over and pick it up, take it back to his shop, R&R it with new oil, gaskets, etc. and deliver it back again.
Unless, of course he wants to pay you $75. an hour to do his work for him?
If he refuses I'd like to know about it.
Wayyy too many "famous name shops" have screwed up like this (including for magazine projects) and they were very careful not to let it get out.
I shoot my own dog.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: polyspheric]
#206304
01/28/09 07:10 PM
01/28/09 07:10 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
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I'd reserve all judgement until the problem is found.Like what has been said,be there as it is being dis-assembled.Don't be surprised if some thing is found on top of a piston.Do you have or have access to a borescope?Do you know which cylinder is near the top of it's stroke when it locks?You can determine this by turning the engine until it stops,back it up and put your finger over the plug hole to feel pressure.  Also if it's a blower motor,check your pully bolts on the front of the crank and make sure one is not interfearing on the timing cover.Check the same on the blower. 
Last edited by B G Racing; 01/28/09 07:14 PM.
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: B G Racing]
#206307
01/28/09 09:00 PM
01/28/09 09:00 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 3,095
Idaho
Runner
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 3,095
Idaho
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Quote:
I'd reserve all judgement until the problem is found.Like what has been said,be there as it is being dis-assembled.Don't be surprised if some thing is found on top of a piston.Do you have or have access to a borescope?Do you know which cylinder is near the top of it's stroke when it locks?You can determine this by turning the engine until it stops,back it up and
put your finger over the plug hole to feel pressure. Also if it's a blower motor,check your pully bolts on the front of the crank and make sure one is not interfearing on the timing cover.Check the same on the blower.
everyones always so quick to pass judgement.
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: Runner]
#206308
01/28/09 09:08 PM
01/28/09 09:08 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,397
Toronto Ontario, Can
Glen440
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,397
Toronto Ontario, Can
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Its how they handle the problem that will tell alot about them. It could be a number of minor things.
87 dakota 6.1 hemi
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: Runner]
#206309
01/29/09 01:46 AM
01/29/09 01:46 AM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 21,345
Marysville, O-H-I-O
70Cuda383
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 21,345
Marysville, O-H-I-O
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Quote:
Quote:
I'd reserve all judgement until the problem is found.Like what has been said,be there as it is being dis-assembled.Don't be surprised if some thing is found on top of a piston.Do you have or have access to a borescope?Do you know which cylinder is near the top of it's stroke when it locks?You can determine this by turning the engine until it stops,back it up and
put your finger over the plug hole to feel pressure. Also if it's a blower motor,check your pully bolts on the front of the crank and make sure one is not interfearing on the timing cover.Check the same on the blower.
everyones always so quick to pass judgement.
When you spend nearly $4500 in parts, and pay an engine shop $1500 for machine work, assembly, clearancing, etc. you tend to get a little jumpy when something's not right. If I'm going to spend $6000 on an engine build, that's something I don't want to do twice. I know everyone is human and we all make mistakes, but you have to wonder, if they missed something simple, what else did they miss? (that is, unless it was your fault because you dropped a nut down the intake or whatever)
**Photobucket sucks**
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: Mr 5 Speed]
#206311
01/29/09 11:13 AM
01/29/09 11:13 AM
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,499
God's Country Maryland
GODSCOUNTRY340
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,499
God's Country Maryland
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360 degrees crank rotation the piston comes up once, not twice. You're thinking of camshaft rotation.
I love the smell of Deer guts in the morning, it smells like... VICTORY!
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: GODSCOUNTRY340]
#206314
01/29/09 11:32 AM
01/29/09 11:32 AM
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,949
land of 10,000______'s
BDS871Cuda
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,949
land of 10,000______'s
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720 degrees of crank for every 360 of cam.
It could be 1 of a 100 things. Give this shop
some time to get it figured out.
I've seen Jason Line make mistakes (very few)
and he get's it figured out.
Will soon find out.
Snap your neck, mega G-force launch, is all I want!
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206316
01/29/09 01:44 PM
01/29/09 01:44 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
the motor got dropped off at the builder today and he didnt find anything on the piston laying. said it looks like something is hitting in the bottom end.
he is going to tear it down today and work on it until its fixed.
Glad to see it wasnt your fault, he'll fix you up,
he doesnt want to have anything bad said about him.
Its probably like Chuck said that the crank is crashing
the pick up
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206317
01/29/09 02:12 PM
01/29/09 02:12 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
polyspheric
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
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everyone screws up once in a while
He did, but you didn't (unless you still owe him money).
It's nice if he fixes it - but who pays you for your wasted time and trouble?
When it's fixed he owes you a favor, money, or a discount on future work (if he's smart that will be his choice)
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206319
01/29/09 10:08 PM
01/29/09 10:08 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,542
BROOK PARK, OH
WILD BILL
Senior Member of the Junior Dragster Club
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Senior Member of the Junior Dragster Club
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,542
BROOK PARK, OH
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 Never would have guessed that
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206321
01/29/09 10:43 PM
01/29/09 10:43 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,446
NJ-USA
HPMike
master
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master
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,446
NJ-USA
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Quote:
got a call. the builder said it was the timing gear on the crank for the gear drive. it was broke and came apart when he took the cover off.
we didnt even mess with it so thats pretty wild.
it was a milodon gear drive. never heard of that breaking on a motor that was never even cranked before!
he said he looked at his notes and he set the valve lash so he would have had to turn the motor when he built it and it was fine then. i am not sure who is going to pick up the bill for the tear down and reassembly. he called milodon to see what they said.
That's interesting...
That gear on those units are very beefy. Seems inconceivable, but? One of the necessary steps to set up a Milodon is to remove the factory timing cover pins in the block, set the "lash" between the gears and redrill the block to accept the oversize pins. I would imagine that if this wasn't done(or done improperly) that you could have a problem. Possibily some debris wound up wedging itself between the gears?? All speculation without actually seeing it.
Keep us posted.
MB
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: aarcuda]
#206324
01/29/09 11:13 PM
01/29/09 11:13 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 94
North West,Ohio
SSDA3426
member
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member
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 94
North West,Ohio
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Quote:
SO much better that you found it now than at 6500 rpm later
Aint That The Truth......
Some things MULTI-MAKES Builders just don't know what to look at....I can't tell ya how many people that have called me or bought at swap meets from me a Flex Plate Because Their ENGINE BUILDER NEEDS IT TO BALANCE THE ASSEMBLY.....CHEVY BOYZ!!
Like one of the other members was saying Muscle Motors are on their Game.I have learned little things here and there working with them and being Sponsored By them over the years...Little things that even you yourself as a Professional Engine Builder wouldn't think of...Mike Really Knows what he's doing...
Good Luck!!
SS 
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206325
01/29/09 11:50 PM
01/29/09 11:50 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 189
long island new york
kingdust
member
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member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 189
long island new york
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like some one else said, better now than through the traps! if they determine that it was a defective gear he might try and hit you with a labor cost. but if he did install it incorrectly and if he's honest and wants your business again he will say, listen i made a mistake and i'll take care of it. keep us posted good luck.
LIFE IS A LESSON,YOU LEARN IT WHEN YOUR THROUGH!
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: kingdust]
#206326
01/30/09 12:18 AM
01/30/09 12:18 AM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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any chance you could take a picture of that gear and post it? it's hard to imagine one of those breaking.
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: Dodgeman67]
#206337
01/31/09 12:24 PM
01/31/09 12:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,635
Oakland, MI
dizuster
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,635
Oakland, MI
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Quote:
I hope he pulled the timing cover first and didn't pull the heads off first?
Excellent point. Would anyone here pull the timing cover off the motor before the heads? I sure wouldn't....unless there was something suspect there I knew about...
In the end it's all how he fixes the problem. Within' 2 days of you having the issue, the problem has already been found, and the new parts are on the way. As long as there is a $0 bill to go with it, that's about as much as you could ask for out of anyone...
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: dirt]
#206342
02/22/09 10:37 AM
02/22/09 10:37 AM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,619
Norwich CT USA
Defbob
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,619
Norwich CT USA
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Quote:
got a call. the builder said it was the timing gear on the crank for the gear drive. it was broke and came apart when he took the cover off.
we didnt even mess with it so thats pretty wild.
it was a milodon gear drive. never heard of that breaking on a motor that was never even cranked before!
he said he looked at his notes and he set the valve lash so he would have had to turn the motor when he built it and it was fine then. i am not sure who is going to pick up the bill for the tear down and reassembly. he called milodon to see what they said.
Tom had a similar incident. The snout on the 440source crank was on the higher end of the tolerance and we installed the lower Milodon gear. When we went to install the blower hub it wouldn't go on. so he tried to tap the lower gear off with a 1lb ball peen hammer and a chisel and the gear split in half. little too much tension from the tight fit I guess, oops. the gear was hard to install originally. He got another lower gear and he polished down the snout on the crank.
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Re: new 500" stroker motor wont spin clear around?
[Re: Quicktree]
#206343
02/22/09 10:49 AM
02/22/09 10:49 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,542
BROOK PARK, OH
WILD BILL
Senior Member of the Junior Dragster Club
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Senior Member of the Junior Dragster Club
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 10,542
BROOK PARK, OH
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Quote:
sounds like he took good care of you. to the builder.
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Would love to see a picture of that sprocket 
