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raised cam block??? #1744865 02/02/15 02:08 PM 02/02/15 02:08 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi. J John Burdine OP pro stock
John Burdine OP pro stock J Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi.	are their any cons to a .250 raised cam block such as, lifter/push rod angle or anything I'm not aware of?

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: John Burdine] #1744866 02/02/15 05:14 PM 02/02/15 05:14 PM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,128 Salt Lake City C camastomcat top fuel
camastomcat top fuel C Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,128 Salt Lake City	Lifter angle usually changes from 45 to 48 degree or vice versa, pushrods are a bit shorter, need a belt drive for raised cam

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: camastomcat] #1744867 02/02/15 05:16 PM 02/02/15 05:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas Al_Alguire I Live Here
Al_Alguire I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas	Belt drive or KB Gear drive I believe are the only option for cam timing and they are proud of both. "I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know." "It's never wrong to do the right thing"

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Al_Alguire] #1744868 02/02/15 06:27 PM 02/02/15 06:27 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi. J John Burdine OP pro stock
John Burdine OP pro stock J Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi.	I think the Jesel for raised cam is $300 more.

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: John Burdine] #1744869 02/02/15 06:35 PM 02/02/15 06:35 PM
Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI MR_P_BODY Master
MR_P_BODY Master Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI	So John.. are you going with that much stroke where you need a raised cam block

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1744870 02/02/15 08:34 PM 02/02/15 08:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi. J John Burdine OP pro stock
John Burdine OP pro stock J Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi.	Quote: So John.. are you going with that much stroke where you need a raised cam block Maybe not, I just want to think things thru before I pull the trigger on a KB. either a 4.625 which I gather is no problem with Oliver rods, or maybe a 4.750, which sounds hit or miss with steel rods.

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: John Burdine] #1744871 02/02/15 08:40 PM 02/02/15 08:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI MR_P_BODY Master
MR_P_BODY Master Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI	Quote: Quote: So John.. are you going with that much stroke where you need a raised cam block Maybe not, I just want to think things thru before I pull the trigger on a KB. either a 4.625 which I gather is no problem with Oliver rods, or maybe a 4.750, which sounds hit or miss with steel rods. .. sounds like your building a biggie

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: John Burdine] #1744872 02/02/15 08:44 PM 02/02/15 08:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas Al_Alguire I Live Here
Al_Alguire I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas	4.75 and Olivers clear in mine with no issues. "I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know." "It's never wrong to do the right thing"

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Al_Alguire] #1744873 02/02/15 08:59 PM 02/02/15 08:59 PM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,128 Salt Lake City C camastomcat top fuel
camastomcat top fuel C Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,128 Salt Lake City	Quote: 4.75 and Olivers clear in mine with no issues. If you're talking about your predator deal, it's a raised cam right? Tony had to do some very light touch up with the 55mm cam we used. Personally, I wouldn't go 4.75 again unless it was a predator or like flow head, there's no need.

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Al_Alguire] #1744874 02/02/15 09:02 PM 02/02/15 09:02 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi. J John Burdine OP pro stock
John Burdine OP pro stock J Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi.	Quote: 4.75 and Olivers clear in mine with no issues. AL, that is a standard cam block/Predator deal?

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: camastomcat] #1744875 02/02/15 09:03 PM 02/02/15 09:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi. J John Burdine OP pro stock
John Burdine OP pro stock J Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,404 Chesterfield Twp. Mi.	Quote: Quote: 4.75 and Olivers clear in mine with no issues. If you're talking about your predator deal, it's a raised cam right? Tony had to do some very light touch up with the 55mm cam we used. Personally, I wouldn't go 4.75 again unless it was a predator or like flow head, there's no need. he had to do some touch up in a raised cam block?

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: John Burdine] #1744876 02/02/15 11:12 PM 02/02/15 11:12 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas Al_Alguire I Live Here
Al_Alguire I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas	Mine is a raised cam deal, with a Jesel and 60MM bumpstick. Sorry I did not make that clear. Honestly if I do another predator I think we may go less stroke max bore the block can take and as much RPM as we can to make power. "I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know." "It's never wrong to do the right thing"

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: John Burdine] #1744877 02/02/15 11:46 PM 02/02/15 11:46 PM
Joined: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,049 San Jose Ca. boatracer572 super stock
boatracer572 super stock Joined: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,049 San Jose Ca.	Quote: Quote: Quote: 4.75 and Olivers clear in mine with no issues. If you're talking about your predator deal, it's a raised cam right? Tony had to do some very light touch up with the 55mm cam we used. Personally, I wouldn't go 4.75 again unless it was a predator or like flow head, there's no need. he had to do some touch up in a raised cam block? Non raised cam, oliver 2.200"rods,4.750"stroke 55mm cam with .540" lobe lift (1.028" at the valve )only a very small amount of materal needed to be removed from rods 1-3-5-7 to achive .060" cam to rod clearnce..... 8417292-securedownload(5).jpg (201 downloads) Last edited by boatracer572; 02/02/15 11:55 PM.

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: boatracer572] #1744878 02/03/15 12:55 AM 02/03/15 12:55 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,392 nielsville, minn. Q quickd100 master
quickd100 master Q Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,392 nielsville, minn.	4.75 stroke in a standard block is very doable with 2.2 pins. Dave

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: John Burdine] #1744879 02/03/15 01:28 AM 02/03/15 01:28 AM
Joined: Oct 2007 Posts: 472 Minnesota, USA humpty mopar
humpty mopar Joined: Oct 2007 Posts: 472 Minnesota, USA	Ditto on the only con, at least when I built mine, being lack of a timing chain option so need to go with a belt drive or timing gears. I'd go with the timing belt in any case. Much less resonating in the valve train (= durability) and it's nice to be able to phase the cam without removing it! Mine picked up 20+hp by retarding the cam a couple degrees on the dyno. Based on the low exhaust temps - we expect it would have picked up more by turning it back more if we had confidence in the piston to valve clearance :} My understanding is you can go with a much longer stroke crank too with the raised cam block. Good luck with your project!

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Al_Alguire] #1744880 02/03/15 02:04 AM 02/03/15 02:04 AM
Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,646 Plymouth Meeting, PA bigtimeauto Trophy Winner
bigtimeauto Trophy Winner Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,646 Plymouth Meeting, PA	Quote: Mine is a raised cam deal, with a Jesel and 60MM bumpstick. Sorry I did not make that clear. Honestly if I do another predator I think we may go less stroke max bore the block can take and as much RPM as we can to make power. that cam height and diameter work great on shortdecks with short strokes to! BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: bigtimeauto] #1744881 02/03/15 02:09 AM 02/03/15 02:09 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas Al_Alguire I Live Here
Al_Alguire I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas	IF I do another one that is exactly what we will do. Much smaller cube much high RPM deal. I wanted to try one of the "big" Mopar motors but cannot say I am sold yet. Then again MAYBE I need to look into a procharger "I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know." "It's never wrong to do the right thing"

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Al_Alguire] #1744882 02/03/15 02:49 AM 02/03/15 02:49 AM
Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,646 Plymouth Meeting, PA bigtimeauto Trophy Winner
bigtimeauto Trophy Winner Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,646 Plymouth Meeting, PA	Quote: IF I do another one that is exactly what we will do. Much smaller cube much high RPM deal. I wanted to try one of the "big" Mopar motors but cannot say I am sold yet. Then again MAYBE I need to look into a procharger You can really make some power with the short deck stuff.(and I'm using those junk indy heads) those long stroke tall deck engines are heavy and waste power. nothing better than short pushrods, a great line of site to the port and light weight. I'll take RPM power any day over low rpm. You won't ever be right again if you go blower, especially with the heads you have! BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: bigtimeauto] #1744883 02/03/15 01:13 PM 02/03/15 01:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas Al_Alguire I Live Here
Al_Alguire I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas	Oh I know I am low deck guy for sure. I have Indy heads too, just don't tell anyone. TO be honest this was not my idea originally to go big. I have been coerced into building a big mill, and have been skeptical from day one. My B1 is a low deck and does quite well and the 99 was a really short deck. Just wish I could have a bigger bore but being a Mopar it is what it is. I aint afraid of no RPM Looks like the boy and I will be ordering up a couple of KB blocks this year... "I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know." "It's never wrong to do the right thing"

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: bigtimeauto] #1744884 02/03/15 01:18 PM 02/03/15 01:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2010 Posts: 803 Idabel,Oklahoma G Gary Robbins super stock
Gary Robbins super stock G Joined: Jan 2010 Posts: 803 Idabel,Oklahoma	Quote: Quote: IF I do another one that is exactly what we will do. Much smaller cube much high RPM deal. I wanted to try one of the "big" Mopar motors but cannot say I am sold yet. Then again MAYBE I need to look into a procharger You can really make some power with the short deck stuff.(and I'm using those junk indy heads) those long stroke tall deck engines are heavy and waste power. nothing better than short pushrods, a great line of site to the port and light weight. I'll take RPM power any day over low rpm. You won't ever be right again if you go blower, especially with the heads you have! Guess I have a power waster with my raised deck over squared combo...shift at 7800rpm and my engine builder says to go higher as were still making over 1000hp N/A at 8200rpm 8417756-engine001.jpg (153 downloads)

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Gary Robbins] #1744885 02/03/15 01:23 PM 02/03/15 01:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas Al_Alguire I Live Here
Al_Alguire I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas	I will see soon enough I suppose. We have had to make a lot of changes to my stuff to make everyone happy. It should hit the dyno in the next couple months and will surely let everyone know what it makes. "I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know." "It's never wrong to do the right thing"

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Gary Robbins] #1744886 02/03/15 01:43 PM 02/03/15 01:43 PM
Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,441 Mo. S supercomp master
supercomp master S Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,441 Mo.	Quote: Quote: Quote: IF I do another one that is exactly what we will do. Much smaller cube much high RPM deal. I wanted to try one of the "big" Mopar motors but cannot say I am sold yet. Then again MAYBE I need to look into a procharger You can really make some power with the short deck stuff.(and I'm using those junk indy heads) those long stroke tall deck engines are heavy and waste power. nothing better than short pushrods, a great line of site to the port and light weight. I'll take RPM power any day over low rpm. You won't ever be right again if you go blower, especially with the heads you have! Guess I have a power waster with my raised deck over squared combo...shift at 7800rpm and my engine builder says to go higher as were still making over 1000hp N/A at 8200rpm I that a SELF 2 piece intake?

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: supercomp] #1744887 02/03/15 04:50 PM 02/03/15 04:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2010 Posts: 803 Idabel,Oklahoma G Gary Robbins super stock
Gary Robbins super stock G Joined: Jan 2010 Posts: 803 Idabel,Oklahoma	Quote: Quote: Quote: Quote: IF I do another one that is exactly what we will do. Much smaller cube much high RPM deal. I wanted to try one of the "big" Mopar motors but cannot say I am sold yet. Then again MAYBE I need to look into a procharger You can really make some power with the short deck stuff.(and I'm using those junk indy heads) those long stroke tall deck engines are heavy and waste power. nothing better than short pushrods, a great line of site to the port and light weight. I'll take RPM power any day over low rpm. You won't ever be right again if you go blower, especially with the heads you have! Guess I have a power waster with my raised deck over squared combo...shift at 7800rpm and my engine builder says to go higher as were still making over 1000hp N/A at 8200rpm I that a SELF 2 piece intake? Kind of a oddball piece as it fits a raised block with no spacers...Koffels had Brodix cast it and it had no logos of anyone's...It's the prototype that was floating around a few years ago at the Nats when I stumbled on to it...Never understood why it wasn't put into production as it works really well !!! Self split it as was to large to port correctly...Self's are the designer of the 2 piece(bolt together) manifold that Brodix sells for SBC !! 8417888-engine004.jpg (67 downloads) Last edited by Gary Robbins; 02/03/15 04:52 PM.

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Gary Robbins] #1744888 02/04/15 12:26 AM 02/04/15 12:26 AM
Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,646 Plymouth Meeting, PA bigtimeauto Trophy Winner
bigtimeauto Trophy Winner Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,646 Plymouth Meeting, PA	Quote: Quote: Quote: IF I do another one that is exactly what we will do. Much smaller cube much high RPM deal. I wanted to try one of the "big" Mopar motors but cannot say I am sold yet. Then again MAYBE I need to look into a procharger You can really make some power with the short deck stuff.(and I'm using those junk indy heads) those long stroke tall deck engines are heavy and waste power. nothing better than short pushrods, a great line of site to the port and light weight. I'll take RPM power any day over low rpm. You won't ever be right again if you go blower, especially with the heads you have! Guess I have a power waster with my raised deck over squared combo...shift at 7800rpm and my engine builder says to go higher as were still making over 1000hp N/A at 8200rpm and so does mine, just that its smaller BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: bigtimeauto] #1744889 02/04/15 01:07 AM 02/04/15 01:07 AM
Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,890 North Alabama M Monte_Smith master
Monte_Smith master M Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,890 North Alabama	If the extra coin for the belt drive is not a problem...........there is NO downside to the raised cam block, regardless of stroke. Raised cam, with a 60mm blank would be my choice Monte

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Monte_Smith] #1744890 02/04/15 02:58 AM 02/04/15 02:58 AM
Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 6,257 gulfport, ms, west mi rowin4 master
rowin4 master Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 6,257 gulfport, ms, west mi	The Jesel belt drive will set you back $1500 and the cam maybe another $1000. it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: rowin4] #1744891 02/04/15 01:23 PM 02/04/15 01:23 PM
Joined: Mar 2006 Posts: 9,910 Eighty Four, PA B G Racing master
B G Racing master Joined: Mar 2006 Posts: 9,910 Eighty Four, PA	The cam core for the 48 degree is also more expensive. [IMG]http://i430.photobucket.com/albums/qq21/ajcasini/max_zpsdppwd9km.jpg[/IMG]

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: B G Racing] #1744892 02/04/15 02:48 PM 02/04/15 02:48 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas Al_Alguire I Live Here
Al_Alguire I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas	A 60MM core is expensive period!!! Then when you start wanting swapped firing orders etc they can get dang hard to come by for a Mopar. Let me know where I can get one for $1000 and I'm all over that. And NO I would go to LSM again "I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know." "It's never wrong to do the right thing"

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: Al_Alguire] #1744893 02/04/15 05:08 PM 02/04/15 05:08 PM
Joined: Mar 2006 Posts: 9,910 Eighty Four, PA B G Racing master
B G Racing master Joined: Mar 2006 Posts: 9,910 Eighty Four, PA	Even with the standard cam journals expect to pay around $400 for the 48* cam.The belt drive is north of $1400. Last edited by B G Racing; 02/04/15 05:09 PM. [IMG]http://i430.photobucket.com/albums/qq21/ajcasini/max_zpsdppwd9km.jpg[/IMG]

Re: raised cam block??? [Re: B G Racing] #1744894 02/04/15 07:00 PM 02/04/15 07:00 PM
Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,646 Plymouth Meeting, PA bigtimeauto Trophy Winner
bigtimeauto Trophy Winner Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,646 Plymouth Meeting, PA	when it comes to max performance there can't be a budget point. BB, TT5,Procharged 3300lb Street Car 4.79/154

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