anyone here have any experience with hughes sb stud girdle? i'm curious to how effective it is.

http://www.hughesengines.com/TechArticles/2mainbearingstudgirdles04232007.php

thanks for that, but i'v already read everything I can find. do you have first hand experience with it?

Yes I have. This is a topic where some say its worthless, some say it works. I feel the BB version is more functional as it can bolt to the pan rails.

I recently found myself in a position of not being able to get a block done right locally for the center 3 caps being 4 bolted.

So being an early race block of the blue high nickle 2 bolt caps I went with it for two reasons. Harmonics and a bit of modification that would slightly tie the main caps together as well.

Some spotface the caps, some dont as per hughes instructions.

Im sure you read the setup is set for some thermal expansion.

If you want to know more of what I did pm me, as outwardly what I have done "looks" like I simply bolted the girdle to the caps but its far more intricate then it looks.

I used the K1 kit with the 14:1 wiseco slugs. I have alot of time in this setup to see how it would pan out.

Twice it was ran to full temp and put under a load on a test stand then torn down for inspection.

Third time it was on the pump to a power level that many would not push a stock block to.

Post dyno inspection showed all the planning was worth the effort.

Im mopar to the core but stray away from the "It has to be this way" or the "How to books" are looked at like its a mopar bible.

Alot of thought and planning went into my little modifications as I would not risk a new rotating assembly or a race block on a hunch.

Its a tight fit and going by the expansion rates in the install booklet was helpful and gave me a good place to start.

Although built as a spray motor, I feel in its N/A form I wont push it any harder. When I get the time to yank it and get it to the proper shop for the 4 bolt caps, then I will spray it.

Girdles do work, maybe better in a different type of motorsport where you have to think out of the box but im comfortable with what I did.

We spun it to 7400 but in reality the best results are shift points at 6800 but I wanted to really put a load on it.

The top end is very unconventional but equal to or better then a indy top end.

By time I got this done and align honed it was just at the same as I pay to have a block 4 bolted and align bored and honed.

A local shop had the means to align hone but not the rest.

I put one in my 408......
What do you want to know ?

Is it worth the cost ? In my mind yes....
Dan

yes, is it worth the cost and did you machine the caps .060" as directions suggest?

Dave,
I feel thhat if the bottoom is tied together, stress to the crank and caps every time a cylinder fires is shared by the others, making it stronger overall, especially if there is Nitrous in the equation.....

Then again I may be wrong...............

As for installion and milling, I don't know, I left that to my machinist.

Dan


'67 Barracuda
best 60ft 1.30 sec 6.40sec 1/8 mile
pump gas, 10.8 cr
Indy heads

Ryan Johnson said they are pretty much worthless in a SB

I don't want to state who is right or wrong....

I just used my good sens to build a bullet proof bottom for 7000rpm engine and not worry....

The small block get a lot of twisting above 600hp,
and 7k, so I put every thing to keep it together....If they use it in big block, high rpm, it should as good in a lighter small block stroker....see my point ?

Too bad there are no tests or more infos on the matter......just experience

Dan

That is why I put one in my block....It all depends on the abuse you plan to put your engine to..........

Dan

the way I look at it, its not as effective as the big block girdle, but better than nothing. my 360 is short filled and with a girdle should be good enough for n/a 13-14:1 and 7000 shifts.

You bet !!

what kind of compression you runnin with that combo?

For what its worth. I sell both a 9 point and a 10 point girdle for early hemis. The bottom end is almost identical to a small block. Here is a write up when one was install on the early hemi EMC engine.

Tom Waters Girdle
by dan miller » 13 Nov 2009 10:17

We were having trouble with the front main cap moving around on our 354 EMC early hemi. The engine is partially filled, cyro treated, and has 4 bolt splayed main caps on the center three mains.

We had no issues up to about 550 horsepower. We noticed metal transfer on the front main cap at around 575 horsepower, and it started to become an issue at 600 horsepower. We installed a Tom Waters girdle and made 121 pulls, many over 650 horsepower. Upon tear down, we observed that the front main is now solid. Zero movement/issues.

We also installed one of Tom's girdles on our Junior Fueler, about 850 or so horsepower. At these power levels, main cap movement is a fact of life, and one just has to live with it. We only have about ten passes on it (and haven't torn it down yet), so it's probably too early to tell, but I'll advise when we see something. It might not cure things, but I'm betting that it will be of significant help.

A very nice product. Inexpensive, very high quality, came with all parts necessary, installed easily - a true bolt on. I highly recommend it.

Danny

UPDATE
We run the JrFueler @ approaching 900 hp, and have zero issues. The mains walk around a little, but much less with the girdle. We have about 40 passes on a new block, and there is main cap movement, but significantly less than without the girdle.

I'm running 10.8:1..........

To clarify mine had a minimal amount of cap walk on a few cylinders, and never really any signs of detonation on the plugs/pistons. However it DID have a lot of cylinder pressure that collapsed the piston.

But what was most alarming is the odd bearing wear that was obviously caused by the cap moving/crank bending. It was warn down to the "gold" in the bearing on the inner edge, opposite of each cylinder. Meaning that at/near TDC the rod had so much compression on it, it was actually pulling the caps off center, and literally "tilting" them on the compression stroke.

I haven't had the pan back off the car yet after the re-fresh, so I can't say how effective it was. But I will be VERY surprised if tying everything together didn't help the caps from waving in the wind, like they were doing the last time.

I'm running a bit less boost then I did before (16psi vs. 20psi before), but with more power (better heads/cam, makes about 80~100hp more), so I am certain it isn't any easier on the motor now then it was then.

*** SOLD *** I've got one for sale that's never been bolted on I'll sell for $175.00. PM me if you're interested.