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Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant #1568563 01/25/14 05:30 PM 01/25/14 05:30 PM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass K kotacars OP member
kotacars OP member K Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass	I know this is not a apples to apples comparison but I am interested to see what would happen not enough mopars running a modern suspension without cutting the car all up

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568564 01/25/14 06:22 PM 01/25/14 06:22 PM
Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours Supercuda About to go away
Supercuda About to go away Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours	Quote: I know this is not a apples to apples comparison but I am interested to see what would happen not enough mopars running a modern suspension without cutting the car all up Define modern suspension. Lots of well handling Mopars out there using upgraded stock type suspensions. They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: Supercuda] #1568565 01/25/14 06:34 PM 01/25/14 06:34 PM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass K kotacars OP member
kotacars OP member K Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass	Lots of well handling? Define what you would call well handling? If it can keep pace with a mark stielow Camaro then I would define that as well handling

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568566 01/25/14 06:58 PM 01/25/14 06:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,467 So Cal autoxcuda Too Many Posts
autoxcuda Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,467 So Cal	Road course or autocross or both? I think Tim's car is focused all on road course. Of course Tim's car is actually Valiant. The Stielow "Camaro" is 100% fabricated custom chassis vehicle that just happens to by-the-way have Camaro body hung over it. With the aero and no compromise chassis, I'd guess the Stielow "Camaro" would be faster on a road course. I have no idea if Tim's Valiant would keep pace or not.

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: autoxcuda] #1568567 01/25/14 07:01 PM 01/25/14 07:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass K kotacars OP member
kotacars OP member K Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass	Both and stielows cars use all detroit speed parts but still has factory firewall and floor

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568568 01/25/14 07:53 PM 01/25/14 07:53 PM
Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours Supercuda About to go away
Supercuda About to go away Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours	According to CarCraft the suspension consists of: Mark's car was a shell when he bought it, so rather than finding a stock subframe assembly, he went straight to the good stuff, calling friends Kyle and Stacy Tucker at Detroit Speed and Engineering to place an order for their front clip. While he was on the phone, Mark ordered a QuadraLink rear suspension kit as well as the rear minitub kit and front and rear sway bars for good measure. With adjustable, tubular control arms on all four corners working in conjunction with remote reservoir double-adjustable shock absorbers, Mark's car represents the ultimate in first-gen F-car handling. They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568569 01/25/14 09:38 PM 01/25/14 09:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,388 Pikes Peak Country T TC@HP2 master
TC@HP2 master T Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,388 Pikes Peak Country	Define which Stielow Camaro you want to talk about first. The guy has built fifteen of them. FWIW, I seem to recall a recent comparions of Stielow's Red Devil (maybe his most famous one) to a modern ZL1. Net result was you could buy 2.5 new ZL1s and have some change left over for a daily driver compared to what it took to build the Red Devil Camaro.

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568570 01/25/14 09:39 PM 01/25/14 09:39 PM
Joined: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,302 Nebraska 72Swinger master
72Swinger master Joined: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,302 Nebraska	Quote: Both and stielows cars use all detroit speed parts but still has factory firewall and floor Making the recesses to allow the triangulated 4 link upper mounts to clear is not a stock floor in my book. A more fair comparison would be the Red Devil against John Sandberg's AAR. That would be a nice a$$ kickn to witness. Mopar to the bone!!!

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: 72Swinger] #1568571 01/25/14 10:44 PM 01/25/14 10:44 PM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass K kotacars OP member
kotacars OP member K Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass	As usual you mopar guys totally missed this one stielows car has all stock sheet metal yes it has been mini tubed and has notches in the floor pans but do what he has within the same paramiters to a mopar the answer is no one has

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: TC@HP2] #1568572 01/25/14 10:45 PM 01/25/14 10:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,000 Oregon A AndyF I Win
AndyF I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,000 Oregon	Tim probably has about $40K in his Valiant, Stielow's cars are usually $100K+ type of rides. Tim's Valiant is still in my shop at the moment. It is getting close to firing up for the year, just need a few more parts to show up. The front suspension has a ton of custom built parts on it this time around so it will be interesting to see how it works. He finally got to a point where the stock stuff just didn't cut it anymore. The front suspension is now Kit Car style with a spline drive anti-sway bar built into the K-frame.

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: AndyF] #1568573 01/25/14 10:52 PM 01/25/14 10:52 PM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass K kotacars OP member
kotacars OP member K Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass	So is it like a firm feel road race k frame? Show us what you did?

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568574 01/25/14 10:58 PM 01/25/14 10:58 PM
Joined: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,302 Nebraska 72Swinger master
72Swinger master Joined: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,302 Nebraska	Quote: As usual you mopar guys totally missed this one stielows car has all stock sheet metal yes it has been mini tubed and has notches in the floor pans but do what he has within the same paramiters to a mopar the answer is no one has You obviously havent seen Sandberg's Cuda with it stock sheetmetal. And what do you mean "As usual you mopar guys totally missed this one" ?? If not a Mopar guy then why are you here posting? And the by the way, Mopars dont need completely new suspensions put under them to run with new cars like GM cars do so NO, your not gonna see anyone do what Stielow did. Mopar to the bone!!!

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: 72Swinger] #1568575 01/25/14 11:04 PM 01/25/14 11:04 PM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass K kotacars OP member
kotacars OP member K Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass	Well my personel car has many old school nascar tricks and then some plus a 630 hp small block will pull to 180mph on the straights with a lot left but not enough suspension to take it there so stock mopar spindles or control arms will not take it to the next level

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568576 01/25/14 11:59 PM 01/25/14 11:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,467 So Cal autoxcuda Too Many Posts
autoxcuda Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,467 So Cal	Quote: Well my personel car has many old school nascar tricks and then some plus a 630 hp small block will pull to 180mph on the straights with a lot left but not enough suspension to take it there so stock mopar spindles or control arms will not take it to the next level Quote: So is it like a firm feel road race k frame? Show us what you did? 406ciW5, that sounds cool. Show us what you did.

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: 72Swinger] #1568577 01/26/14 12:05 AM 01/26/14 12:05 AM
Joined: Aug 2005 Posts: 5,999 Salem Grizzly Moparts Proctologist
Grizzly Moparts Proctologist Joined: Aug 2005 Posts: 5,999 Salem	Quote: And the by the way, Mopars dont need completely new suspensions put under them to run with new cars like GM cars Bang on the money. Edit Agree with Steve: can you post some pics of your car and what you got going on there? Last edited by Grizzly; 01/26/14 12:09 AM. Mo' Farts Moderated by "tbagger".

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: Grizzly] #1568578 01/26/14 12:35 AM 01/26/14 12:35 AM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass K kotacars OP member
kotacars OP member K Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass	I would say something very similar as what AndyF has going on

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568579 01/26/14 01:18 AM 01/26/14 01:18 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,467 So Cal autoxcuda Too Many Posts
autoxcuda Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,467 So Cal	Quote: I would say something very similar as what AndyF has going on Cool, lets see some pictures 406ciW5 and share some ideas.

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: autoxcuda] #1568580 01/26/14 02:14 AM 01/26/14 02:14 AM
Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 780 Woodinville, WA Viol8r super stock
Viol8r super stock Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 780 Woodinville, WA	Those two cars are not even on the same planet, sorry to say. We competed at Optima and he had us covered by 18 seconds on a 2.2 mile course. We were the fastest Mopar there. Not saying the Valiant couldn't put it to us, but ..... The craftsmanship and engineering on his cars are second to none. We are 10 years from having something that can run with cars like that. I have in the realm of 100k in mine......You can double that in Stielows. 700hp, anti-loc, traction control, please! 1968 Pro-Touring Dodge Charger *2011 Optima Ultimate Street Car Challenge Invitee http://www.popularhotrodding.com/features/1203phr_1968_dodge_charger/index.html

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: Viol8r] #1568581 01/26/14 09:17 AM 01/26/14 09:17 AM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass K kotacars OP member
kotacars OP member K Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 126 mass	I would not say that mopars are 10 years form having that technology the new hemi can make that power and detoit speed is doing a charger with all there suspension tricks

Re: Mark stielow Camaro vs tim werners valiant [Re: kotacars] #1568582 01/26/14 03:00 PM 01/26/14 03:00 PM
Joined: Sep 2005 Posts: 1,328 St. Louis, MO mopardamo pro stock
mopardamo pro stock Joined: Sep 2005 Posts: 1,328 St. Louis, MO	Hello, Yeah I have been looking at their Charger project. Lots of tricks. I'd also like to hear more about your ride. Damon

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