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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: JohnRR]
#1542740
12/05/13 11:01 AM
12/05/13 11:01 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,365
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,365
Marion, South Carolina [><]
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At this level, I'd think the only things that could really be "Mopar" about the block would be the water pump and possibly the distributor location?
I'll never be able to (or want to) afford something like this.
CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: an8sec70cuda]
#1542741
12/05/13 11:56 AM
12/05/13 11:56 AM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
camastomcat
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
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Dan. thanks for your interest in producing another option for a race block. The reason I run the Mopar stuff is, those are the parts I started with and have gathered over the years. Mopar has really done nothing for the T/D crowd, thus chasing many of us away from using Mopar stuff. The emblem means nothing to me. What means something is, a powerful enough motor to get me in the middle of the field, that can be bracket raced, live for 200 passes,and just need standard lifters/rings/valve springs/bearings/etc. Also, the cost of said motor should be under or around $35,000 like the other offerings out there. If I had something like that (1350-1400HP)I would sell my current stuff, and buy it. Until then, I will still qualify in the top half or be bumped out, or go back to S/C, because these classes are getting ridiculous for the N/A bunch. Thanks for trying,
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: camastomcat]
#1542742
12/05/13 01:30 PM
12/05/13 01:30 PM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
Performance Only
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
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Quote:
Dan. thanks for your interest in producing another option for a race block. The reason I run the Mopar stuff is, those are the parts I started with and have gathered over the years. Mopar has really done nothing for the T/D crowd, thus chasing many of us away from using Mopar stuff. The emblem means nothing to me. What means something is, a powerful enough motor to get me in the middle of the field, that can be bracket raced, live for 200 passes,and just need standard lifters/rings/valve springs/bearings/etc. Also, the cost of said motor should be under or around $35,000 like the other offerings out there. If I had something like that (1350-1400HP)I would sell my current stuff, and buy it. Until then, I will still qualify in the top half or be bumped out, or go back to S/C, because these classes are getting ridiculous for the N/A bunch. Thanks for trying,
We won't be doing cast aluminum blocks, they will be Billet blocks which raises the price of the engine significantly all by itslef. If all we could do is make 13-1400 HP I wouldn't even consider building it. Our goals are much higher than that in N/A form. Thanks for your comments.
machine shop owner and engine builder
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: Performance Only]
#1542743
12/05/13 02:38 PM
12/05/13 02:38 PM
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
dakotawilly
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 515
geezer acres rest home
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high end parts are just that,high end thoroughbred racing parts.the brand is the manufacturer,not the car manufacturer.what bolts up to it relates to what "brand" it is in terms of mopar,ford,or gm groupies are concerned.i still believe that just a basic quality aftermarket block,thats fits the needs of the masses at a reasonable comparable price would literaly fly off the shelves.there are countless aftermarket quality parts out there to fill that block with.but,without a good solid base block we are all limited to less than stellar output figures without a life insurance policy.a good block could be used even for a lower hp application,BUT,still have the ability to grow with your wallet....for the high end racers,cn makes a billet 4.800 hemi block with a list of options as long as your arm,if you have 10 grand "laying" around.....all that being said,if you feel you could produce a better product than whats available out there now,GO FOR IT,after all,there are those who buy sonnys 1003 ci "godfather" 2150 hp monster even at the 150,000 dollar price tag............
Last edited by dakotawilly; 12/05/13 03:19 PM.
SFI 25.5 depends,no leak,even at 213 mph....
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: Performance Only]
#1542748
12/05/13 04:25 PM
12/05/13 04:25 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
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Quote:
Quote:
I wish our hobby would embrace more items like this.
We had a 5" bore space 738" motor for sale for like mmmmm 5 years before it sold at a discounted price to a NSS racer....
That doesn't surprise me in the least. The big inch motors fit into a more specialized arena, so to speak.
As far as having plain old cast Mopar blocks to bolt parts on, you already have that. You can buy Indy blocks all day long. once you fix any machining errors you're good to go. They'll handle 1500-2000 HP, what more do you want?
I'm not sure why some people thing casting blocks is such an easy and inexpensive thing to do, because it's not. Just look at how many have tried and failed. One thing is for sure, I'm never going to go down that pothole filled road.
casting an engine whether it be iron or aluminum is expensive, not so much the molten material but in the amount of man hours and materials/equipment to build the core box's to cast them in, as far as a block of billet aluminum to machine a block, that by far isn't cheap either, then you have many man hours to make a program and one decmal point off with in that program and you could very easily have a big block of scrap and a pile of chips. 
Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: dartman366]
#1542749
12/05/13 05:10 PM
12/05/13 05:10 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I wish our hobby would embrace more items like this.
We had a 5" bore space 738" motor for sale for like mmmmm 5 years before it sold at a discounted price to a NSS racer....
That doesn't surprise me in the least. The big inch motors fit into a more specialized arena, so to speak.
As far as having plain old cast Mopar blocks to bolt parts on, you already have that. You can buy Indy blocks all day long. once you fix any machining errors you're good to go. They'll handle 1500-2000 HP, what more do you want?
I'm not sure why some people thing casting blocks is such an easy and inexpensive thing to do, because it's not. Just look at how many have tried and failed. One thing is for sure, I'm never going to go down that pothole filled road.
casting an engine whether it be iron or aluminum is expensive, not so much the molten material but in the amount of man hours and materials/equipment to build the core box's to cast them in, as far as a block of billet aluminum to machine a block, that by far isn't cheap either, then you have many man hours to make a program and one decmal point off with in that program and you could very easily have a big block of scrap and a pile of chips.
Casting,billit or what ever,it's still going to be a limited market.As Josh mentioned you can sit on these specilized blocks till you find sonone who needs it or give it away.To jump into that market is as I said before financial suicide.But heck if you want to put a rope around your neck and jump off a stool then have at.I'll hold my breath untill I see your first production run.  No I won't,I can't hold my breath that long.J/K  Good luck anyway.  
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: B G Racing]
#1542750
12/05/13 06:04 PM
12/05/13 06:04 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008
Sweet Home Alabama
MRMOPAR622
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008
Sweet Home Alabama
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Now I know why us Mopar Racers don't have the all the parts chevy & ford have.We are all still stuck in the  era.
Last edited by MRMOPAR622; 12/05/13 06:05 PM.
"To Be The Man'You Have Got To Beat The Man"
"T/D and Pro-Bracket Racer"
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: MRMOPAR622]
#1542751
12/05/13 06:14 PM
12/05/13 06:14 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
Now I know why us Mopar Racers don't have the all the parts chevy & ford have.We are all still stuck in the era.
Its not so much that but if you could sell 1000
vs 50 then you could sell at a lesser price and
in the end do more development
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1542752
12/05/13 06:20 PM
12/05/13 06:20 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
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Quote:
Quote:
Now I know why us Mopar Racers don't have the all the parts chevy & ford have.We are all still stuck in the era.
Its not so much that but if you could sell 1000
vs 50 then you could sell at a lesser price and
in the end do more development
It's not that we are stuck in the era,but some of us remenants of the  era.
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: B G Racing]
#1542754
12/05/13 06:51 PM
12/05/13 06:51 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,890
North Alabama
Monte_Smith
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,890
North Alabama
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Here are my thoughts.......to the masses, what makes an engine a Ford, Chevy or Mopar boils down to the basic appearance of the block. Al is right, in that all these BIG aftermarket motors are exactly that, aftermarket motors........BUT.....you can get one of these blocks based on a Ford or Chevy. A 5.300 bore space Chevy, still LOOKS like a big Chevy, just based on the appearance of the block. Same for the Ford. Technically there is already a 5.0 bore space block out there you COULD call a Mopar, because it has a Mopar water pump face, is a skirted block and has a flat pan rail. Of course it's a CN billet, but there IS one.
Now for the heads. A GOOD head for ANY of these big bore space motors is going to be a symmetrical, spread port, wedge head. A configuration that came on NOTHING from the factory, but I guess is closer to a BBF than anything if you got right down to it............Now the Mopar guys are going to scream HEMI, but a TRUE HEMI head is NOT going to happen, nor is it needed. The Sonny's Hemi and the 99Hemi both are WAY closer to wedge than Hemi, so you can just forget the quest for the REAL big bore hemi.......So that brings us to this point. There are already some GREAT 5.0 spore space heads out there, so trying to make something LOOK like a Mopar is a frivolous thought. You are NOT going to make something WAY better than is already out there.
So to answer the original question that started this thread.......yeah, I would buy a 5.0 bore space block based from a Mopar......if I could get my choice of head bolt patterns and use some of the existing 5.0 heads out there........But NOT because it has a Mopar water pump and NOT because it had a Mopar trans pattern or something silly like that. The reason would be the skirted, cross bolted design of the block
Monte
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Re: 5" bore space Mopar blocks
[Re: 68CudaB1]
#1542755
12/05/13 07:01 PM
12/05/13 07:01 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,890
North Alabama
Monte_Smith
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,890
North Alabama
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Quote:
Heck, Best Machine had trouble selling the 5 pairs of B1 PSO heads they did, I don't see the demand for a 5" block.
Because at the end of the day, those heads STILL bolt on a bore limited, 4.800 bore space block. If that head was cast in a 4.840 to bolt on the Indy or other 4.840 block, THEN you would have something.
Monte
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