Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Body roll on shut down.. #1528921
11/05/13 01:13 PM
11/05/13 01:13 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
StandOnIt Offline OP
super stock
StandOnIt  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
I'm having a serious problem here. My son has been driving the car this season and has told me the car is "loose" in the shut down. I told him, "race cars are loose up there because of the slicks". I drove it this weekend and it liked to scared me to death. The rear of the car is rocking back and forth like the rear is trying to come around. Kinda like a dog wagging its tail. Its a 76 Volare w/ sb motor. Ladder bar coilover rear, hoosier light weight radial slicks with hoosier front runners. I did move the front toe "in" a little and my son said it helped a little but when I made a hit in it, I almost started screaming cause it got so loose with me. Is it the light weight radials? Rear coilovers going bad? I did just put a set of Calvert front shocks on it. Could the front be too soft? Somebody help me before me someone else gets hurt..lol


76' Volare, 5.9 magnum w/Iron heads. New best 10.68 at 123 mph 1/4 mile.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: StandOnIt] #1528922
11/05/13 01:18 PM
11/05/13 01:18 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
B
BJS racing Offline
top fuel
BJS racing  Offline
top fuel
B

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
How much tire pressure are you running? You likely have the tire pressure to low.


Back in the swing of things at Painless again! Great to be back!
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528923
11/05/13 01:41 PM
11/05/13 01:41 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
StandOnIt Offline OP
super stock
StandOnIt  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
Quote:

How much tire pressure are you running? You likely have the tire pressure to low.




tried from 19lbs all the way to 22lbs. Still does it. When I put the car on the scales, she was 2975 lbs with 625ish per rear wheel. I have 130# springs on the coilovers. I tried to rock the car side to side at the trailer and it didn't seem loose when parked.


76' Volare, 5.9 magnum w/Iron heads. New best 10.68 at 123 mph 1/4 mile.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: StandOnIt] #1528924
11/05/13 01:47 PM
11/05/13 01:47 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
B
BJS racing Offline
top fuel
BJS racing  Offline
top fuel
B

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
What tires are you running? What kind of track locator are you using on the car? diagnal or wish bone and does it have rod ends, urethane bushings, solid rod ends?

Last edited by BJS racing; 11/05/13 01:49 PM.

Back in the swing of things at Painless again! Great to be back!
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528925
11/05/13 01:52 PM
11/05/13 01:52 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
B
BJS racing Offline
top fuel
BJS racing  Offline
top fuel
B

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
do you by chance have a picture of the ladder bar set up on your car? Sounds kinda like the rear suspension may be moving side to side like the locating device is loose or something may be failing. Has it done this all year or been getting worse?


Back in the swing of things at Painless again! Great to be back!
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528926
11/05/13 02:06 PM
11/05/13 02:06 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
StandOnIt Offline OP
super stock
StandOnIt  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
Quote:

do you by chance have a picture of the ladder bar set up on your car? Sounds kinda like the rear suspension may be moving side to side like the locating device is loose or something may be failing. Has it done this all year or been getting worse?



I drove it early this season and it didn't do all that. It had the regular radial slicks on it tho. It also didn't have the calverts on the front end either. I checked the locater bar and the ladder bars, rocked the car side to side and watched the rear susp for movement, nothing...

I should really park it for the rest of the season and completely rebuild the front susp and go thru it with a fine tooth comb but we have 2 races left and my son is sitting close to the top in points and could actually take track champion on his rookie year. I hate to have to take that from him because of a simple adjustment to the car...

Last edited by StandOnIt; 11/05/13 02:09 PM.

76' Volare, 5.9 magnum w/Iron heads. New best 10.68 at 123 mph 1/4 mile.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: StandOnIt] #1528927
11/05/13 02:12 PM
11/05/13 02:12 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,675
Columbia, CT
M
moper Offline
I Live Here
moper  Offline
I Live Here
M

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,675
Columbia, CT
Does he need to counter-steer or does the back just wiggle? What sort of ET/MPH we talking here? What size wheel and tire package in the back?


Well, art is art, isn't it? Still, on the other hand, water is water! And east is east and west is west and if you take cranberries and stew them like applesauce they taste much more like prunes than rhubarb does. Now, uh... Now you tell me what you know.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528928
11/05/13 02:13 PM
11/05/13 02:13 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
StandOnIt Offline OP
super stock
StandOnIt  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
Quote:

What tires are you running? What kind of track locator are you using on the car? diagnal or wish bone and does it have rod ends, urethane bushings, solid rod ends?




Hoosier light weight radials 29.5 / 9
CE track locator diag solid ends with bearings
solid subframe / body mounts. everything solid.


76' Volare, 5.9 magnum w/Iron heads. New best 10.68 at 123 mph 1/4 mile.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: moper] #1528929
11/05/13 02:18 PM
11/05/13 02:18 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
StandOnIt Offline OP
super stock
StandOnIt  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
Quote:

Does he need to counter-steer or does the back just wiggle? What sort of ET/MPH we talking here? What size wheel and tire package in the back?




serious counter steer, Its actually pretty violent.
10.70's at 122 mph
15" Welds with 29.5 x 9" radial


76' Volare, 5.9 magnum w/Iron heads. New best 10.68 at 123 mph 1/4 mile.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: moper] #1528930
11/05/13 02:20 PM
11/05/13 02:20 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
B
BJS racing Offline
top fuel
BJS racing  Offline
top fuel
B

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
Are you sure it is in the back of the car you are actually feeling it? Not control arm bushings or alignment that is bad. If it wasn't doing it at the begining of the year and it is now then something is wearing down or broken. I would jack the car up and unload the rear suspension and recheck the diagonal and rod ends on the ladder bars. Also is the diagonal held on by bolt in mounts that attach to the brackets or are they weld on mounts? If they are the bent bolt on type they may be shifting down track creating this problem.


Back in the swing of things at Painless again! Great to be back!
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528931
11/05/13 02:25 PM
11/05/13 02:25 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
StandOnIt Offline OP
super stock
StandOnIt  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
Quote:

Are you sure it is in the back of the car you are actually feeling it? Not control arm bushings or alignment that is bad. If it wasn't doing it at the begining of the year and it is now then something is wearing down or broken. I would jack the car up and unload the rear suspension and recheck the diagonal and rod ends on the ladder bars. Also is the diagonal held on by bolt in mounts that attach to the brackets or are they weld on mounts? If they are the bent bolt on type they may be shifting down track creating this problem.




Yes, it is the bolt in brackets. I will pull it out of the trailer and get her in the air to see whats moving. Someone else told me they put the light weights on a Monte Carlo and it tried to get on the roof when he tried to stop it. Others say they have had zero problems from them.


76' Volare, 5.9 magnum w/Iron heads. New best 10.68 at 123 mph 1/4 mile.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: StandOnIt] #1528932
11/05/13 02:31 PM
11/05/13 02:31 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
B
BJS racing Offline
top fuel
BJS racing  Offline
top fuel
B

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
A radial willy typically have a stiffer sidewall than a bias drag slick so you should have less rock from the sidewalls with the tire you are running. you should also pull the bolts out on the locator and the front mounts to make sure that the bolt has been eating away at the brackets because the bolt is to short. If the hole is oblonged then that will cause exactly what you have going on. The "kit" ladder bar and 4 link systems typically have too short of bolts in them. The shoulder of the bolt should go all the way through both sides of the bracket and use washers to keep the nut from bottoming out on the bolt before everything is tight.


Back in the swing of things at Painless again! Great to be back!
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528933
11/05/13 02:36 PM
11/05/13 02:36 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
B
BJS racing Offline
top fuel
BJS racing  Offline
top fuel
B

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
When you check it out take some pics if you can. If anything looks out of wack then maybe we can see it in the pics. And hey who doesn't like to see the rear end of something so nice?


Back in the swing of things at Painless again! Great to be back!
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528934
11/05/13 02:37 PM
11/05/13 02:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,251
fredericksburg,va
C
cudaman1969 Offline
master
cudaman1969  Offline
master
C

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,251
fredericksburg,va
Change items that you installed till the problem stops and check everything that moves in suspension. Sounds like front shocks affecting front end on the drop.

Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: StandOnIt] #1528935
11/05/13 02:43 PM
11/05/13 02:43 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
top fuel
Duner  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Mine acted just like that for quite a while. It would go down the track straight (pretty much anyway) - then when you backed out of the throttle it would get seriously upset. I thought it was my tires or something - but took a pass on street tires and it still did it. Everything appeared tight and didn't look like anything had moved. I measured it and the rearend was out of square. I'm on leaf springs and it actually ripped the locater hole in the spring pad to move itself out of square. It was off by 1/4".

Once I got it all squared-up it drove fine again.

It won't cost anything to put a tape on it. Have somebody help you measure diagonally from corner to corner, and if it's off it will show up quickly.

Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: Duner] #1528936
11/05/13 02:55 PM
11/05/13 02:55 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
StandOnIt Offline OP
super stock
StandOnIt  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
Quote:

Mine acted just like that for quite a while. It would go down the track straight (pretty much anyway) - then when you backed out of the throttle it would get seriously upset. I thought it was my tires or something - but took a pass on street tires and it still did it. Everything appeared tight and didn't look like anything had moved. I measured it and the rearend was out of square. I'm on leaf springs and it actually ripped the locater hole in the spring pad to move itself out of square. It was off by 1/4".

Once I got it all squared-up it drove fine again.

It won't cost anything to put a tape on it. Have somebody help you measure diagonally from corner to corner, and if it's off it will show up quickly.




I actually had that problem a few years ago. The rear was out so bad it was eating one of the rear tires. I had a friend take it to the Dodge dealership where he works and put it on the machine to straighten it up. Like yours, this one runs thru there straight and smooth as can be. Let off the gas and world war 3 starts. I will check the locator bolts and brackets first, prob just change them all for good measures. They are the "kit" ones on there. When I started this project, it was supposed to just be an 11.90's basic bracket beater. I never meant for it to run this fast..


76' Volare, 5.9 magnum w/Iron heads. New best 10.68 at 123 mph 1/4 mile.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528937
11/05/13 02:58 PM
11/05/13 02:58 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
StandOnIt Offline OP
super stock
StandOnIt  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,086
Baton Rouge, La.
Quote:

A radial willy typically have a stiffer sidewall than a bias drag slick so you should have less rock from the sidewalls with the tire you are running. you should also pull the bolts out on the locator and the front mounts to make sure that the bolt has been eating away at the brackets because the bolt is to short. If the hole is oblonged then that will cause exactly what you have going on. The "kit" ladder bar and 4 link systems typically have too short of bolts in them. The shoulder of the bolt should go all the way through both sides of the bracket and use washers to keep the nut from bottoming out on the bolt before everything is tight.




The light weight radials have a super soft sidewall. Just like the regular slicks I used to run. The regular radial slicks have a heavier sidewall.


76' Volare, 5.9 magnum w/Iron heads. New best 10.68 at 123 mph 1/4 mile.
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: StandOnIt] #1528938
11/05/13 03:01 PM
11/05/13 03:01 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
B
BJS racing Offline
top fuel
BJS racing  Offline
top fuel
B

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,224
Arlington, Tx.
Quote:

I never meant for it to run this fast..




Oh the heart break!

Thats what we all say. Well maybe not. We mostly say I think there is a little more there! Let us know what you find. One other thing. When you get on the brakes does it feel like on side of the front is dropping further then the other? If the shocks are not equal it can have the same affect.


Back in the swing of things at Painless again! Great to be back!
Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: BJS racing] #1528939
11/05/13 03:31 PM
11/05/13 03:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 531
USA
5
540DUSTER Offline
mopar
540DUSTER  Offline
mopar
5

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 531
USA
measure the toe pattern of each wheel,sounds like a bump steer problem to me.

Re: Body roll on shut down.. [Re: 540DUSTER] #1528940
11/05/13 03:40 PM
11/05/13 03:40 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
P
Polarapete Offline
top fuel
Polarapete  Offline
top fuel
P

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
I have never had a F-body, but the front suspension is not the same old torsion bar deal we are all familiar with. All I know is that the local (Kirkland, WA) PD had some and they spent a lot of time in the alignment shops trying to get them right before they gave up on them. I would try a cop sway bar up front if you can find one.


1986 Dodge Ramcharger 440 2wd, Bracket Racer Under Construction
1998 Ram 2500 QuadCab, new daily driver.
2008 Honda Element
2014 Carry-On 7x14 Cargo Trailer
Page 1 of 2 1 2






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1