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Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Performance Only] #1258432
06/29/12 09:29 AM
06/29/12 09:29 AM
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Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart Offline
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Those who don't mag their cranks may live to drive over one- not a good thing. After one major failure which took out a block, pan, rollercam, two rods and pistons, I check them every time they come out of the block. I found a small crack in an aftermarket crank with 100 runs on it, which surprised me.


8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Performance Only] #1258433
06/29/12 10:18 AM
06/29/12 10:18 AM
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,113
Lost in Pooler, GA
Gumbydammit Offline
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Lost in Pooler, GA
Was it an ex- fuel crank?


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Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Gumbydammit] #1258434
06/29/12 10:44 AM
06/29/12 10:44 AM
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Delray beach, Florida
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i don't know the full history of the crank in question. it's a factory forged 440 crank. i was told it had been in a motor that was sprayed with NO2. i don't know how much or how often though.
the plan was to use it in a fairly mild low deck combo after cutting the mains and counterweights down.
i sure can't blame a 40+ year old crank for finally giving out after being abused. i'm just glad the owner let us check it out before doing a bunch of work to it. no harm, no foul, we found a good useable crank for his project.


machine shop owner and engine builder
Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Performance Only] #1258435
06/29/12 10:57 AM
06/29/12 10:57 AM

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This is part of what shows that a builder cares and taking the time to post pics and discuss the issues is a big plus in my book.

Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: ] #1258436
06/29/12 11:00 AM
06/29/12 11:00 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,911
United Socialist States of Ame...
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tboomer Online work
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Yupp....That does show some class!


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Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: tboomer] #1258437
06/29/12 11:13 AM
06/29/12 11:13 AM
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Charleston
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sixpackgut Offline
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Charleston
this reminds me of when i first met Dan. I showed up with boxes of junk parts and he wouldn't let me leave till all the parts were checked out so he didn't have to make the dreaded, "yours parts are junk" call


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Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: sixpackgut] #1258438
06/29/12 11:24 AM
06/29/12 11:24 AM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
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Quote:

this reminds me of when i first met Dan. I showed up with boxes of junk parts and he wouldn't let me leave till all the parts were checked out so he didn't have to make the dreaded, "yours parts are junk" call




Ray, they weren't "junk" parts, just what i call "questionable". i remember looking at the crank though and spotted something right away. in the grinder it went for verification. i remember it like it was yesterday saying "yep, that's not good". but it got taken care of then and there. i really do hate to make those calls after the fact. i think your combo turned out pretty good when it was all said and done. ya just have to love those success stories,
thanks for the positive comments guys. i'm very passionate about what we do and want to do the best job possible to ensure our customers success. after all, our success always has and always will hinge on our customers success.


machine shop owner and engine builder
Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Performance Only] #1258439
06/29/12 12:46 PM
06/29/12 12:46 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 2,864
IN
Irun5snd8th Offline
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Wow I have never seen what that process looks like. Thanks for posting the pictures.


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Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Irun5snd8th] #1258440
06/29/12 06:56 PM
06/29/12 06:56 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 610
White Creek, NY
408cuda Offline
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White Creek, NY
Come on Dan, a little 320 and a shoe lace ought to clean that right up

Cool pic!

Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: 408cuda] #1258441
06/29/12 09:00 PM
06/29/12 09:00 PM
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Tracy, New Brunswick, Canada
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magnumcharger Offline
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Tracy, New Brunswick, Canada
Great thread! And good find!
I see cracks like that all the time, but on aircraft components. Scary stuff.

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Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: magnumcharger] #1258442
06/29/12 10:03 PM
06/29/12 10:03 PM
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florida/ Georgia
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Tom Fox Offline
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Hey Dan, That Crank Looks Familiar. Yes This Was Mine.

Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Tom Fox] #1258443
06/29/12 10:42 PM
06/29/12 10:42 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 382
Roseville MN
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72swgnr Offline
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Roseville MN
Dan what current do you use? AC or DC? DC can pick up shallow sub-surface indications while AC will normally only pick up indications that are open to the surface. Also product do you use to check alluminum heads/rods? I know alot of people have seen Magnaflux red dye penetrant but I'm willing to bet very few have seen flourecent penetrant which is actually way more sensitive then mag particle depending on the level of penetrant you use.


Just to give you guys who are interested an idea how the magnaflux works. You have a few different ways you can magnatize a part. 1. you can use a hand yoke. The advantage of these is they are portable and can get into smaller areas. You can use a yoke for pretty much any part you want to mag. but you can only cover a 6" area at a time. The second way of magnatizing a part is to use a magnaflux bench. The advantage of these are you can control the amount of amperage that you put into a part. You also can magnetize a whole part at once which saves time and money if you have multiple parts to do. Third way is you can use another type of magnaflux machine that uses cables. (kind of like welding cables) The advantage of these is they are fairly portable and can do very large parts.

Now for how the process works its pretty simple you magnetize a part while applying flourescent particles. These particles are made up of kerosene/water and iron. If there is a crack in the part it will break the magentic field and cause the flourescent particles to line up along the break, when this happens you get indications that look like the pictures that Dan posted.

Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Tom Fox] #1258444
06/29/12 11:23 PM
06/29/12 11:23 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
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Quote:

Hey Dan, That Crank Looks Familiar. Yes This Was Mine.




and it still is. it would make a fine mailbox post. your replacement, which was magged and then shot blasted, made it's way into the crank grinder this morning and finished up.


machine shop owner and engine builder
Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Performance Only] #1258445
06/29/12 11:48 PM
06/29/12 11:48 PM
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FastOne Offline
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Thanks for the Post Dan, it's very important info & is a reminder to never assume anything when building an engine

Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: FastOne] #1258446
06/30/12 06:53 AM
06/30/12 06:53 AM
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Posts: 2,578
sweden
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1Fast340 Offline
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sweden
good post and cool to see a pic of it broken in 3 places thats quite bad,or good that it didnt brake killing alot of other parts in the process atleast.

does people/builders still weld cracked cranks?

Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: 1Fast340] #1258447
06/30/12 09:27 AM
06/30/12 09:27 AM
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OZ
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OZ
Its a little difficult to see but Im assuming the crank is OEM journal? With that being said there's proof for the need of large radii fillets, Chrysler done real bad with their under cut design.

Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: CRIKEY] #1258448
06/30/12 04:18 PM
06/30/12 04:18 PM
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Posts: 16,924
NC
440Jim Offline
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I agree having a crank magnaflux tested for cracks when the engine is apart is a very good idea (recommended).

Back in the years I ran a 3.915" offset ground factory 440 forged crank, it was cracked (not as bad as that one) after running 2-3 years.

Then in 2006 I built a new engine using a new Callies 4.250" stroke crank I bought from Dan. That crank was tested in Jan 2011 and was completely crack free after 5 years and over 600 passes. So it went back in for more service. The steel rods were tested also, and were good to go; while it was apart I put new rod bolts in them.


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Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Performance Only] #1258449
06/30/12 04:43 PM
06/30/12 04:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,767
Rio Linda, CA
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Quote:

i don't know the full history of the crank in question. it's a factory forged 440 crank.




So it has the notorious undercuts at the side of the journal complete with the visible chatter marks? I've seen (and run) some with similar cracks that weren't very deep. (I know, any crack.....)


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Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: Performance Only] #1258450
06/30/12 06:06 PM
06/30/12 06:06 PM
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Posts: 2,119
sc
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tjmarcus1 Offline
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Quote:

i wonder if a should have posted this in the Question and Answer forum where their might be more interest? i didn't think about that until i got a call from a member here asking why i even posted it.



are you serious? thanks dan for posting that! Man, i thought that was what this board is for.

Re: Magnaflux and why we recommend it. [Re: tjmarcus1] #1258451
07/01/12 12:09 AM
07/01/12 12:09 AM
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Not2farfromNashville, TN
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I think it's a good idea to put this entire thread in the Q&A forum too.


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