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Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
#1067872
09/02/11 10:28 PM
09/02/11 10:28 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
Bob_Coomer
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
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I have had several of these new style Hyd flat tappet cams, sure they run OK but the valve train noise is horrible...
I know they recommend adjustable valve train in most case's but this doesnt help.. FACT..
Simply put, take a stock low mile engine with ZERO valve train noise add some old Ductile Iron Isky rockers and you now have a cam that sounds like s solid lift version...
Most shrug the noise off with a answer "Its the nature of these Cams"
Bull crap..
Or
"all these large cams do that"
Bull..
The last MP 509 Hyd cam I installed on a 493 RB engine with Edelbrock heads was quite as a mouse.
Problem is this cam I put in the car, sounds worse than a MP 590 cam with .035 inch lash LOL.
So what gives? why do these cams do this? I have had 3-4 cams do this in the past 10 years... Three have been COMP Cams, One was a Lunati bracket Master from personal experience..
[color:"red"]65 Hemi Belvedere coming soon [/color]
[color:"#00FF00"]557" Indy engine 1.07 60ft 144mph in the 8th 2100 lbs package [/color]
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#1067875
09/02/11 11:29 PM
09/02/11 11:29 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,300
Northern Indiana
Dunnuck Racing
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,300
Northern Indiana
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Fast rate of lift camshafts and too much spring pressure will overide the hydraulic mechanism. Some of the cheaper lifters can't handle it.  Keith
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#1067876
09/02/11 11:36 PM
09/02/11 11:36 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,501
Gainesville,FL
goldmember
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,501
Gainesville,FL
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There are good hyd cams that are quiet,but I've seen (or heard!) a lot of hyd cams that make a lot of noise and often have issues before they get to 6000 rpm's without spending more $$$ and time than any hyd cam should receive. Why anyone would grind them is anyone's guess,but my is the cam grinders have realized the public will buy what looks good(aggressive on paper) whether it works in an engine or not. There is MUCH more to a cam than what can be seen in the lobe charts and the few reference points given by the maker(often not accurate either). Most of the noise complaints are caused by the closing ramp(or lack of),but that doesn't show up in the lobe specs.
Last edited by goldmember; 09/02/11 11:42 PM.
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#1067878
09/03/11 07:47 AM
09/03/11 07:47 AM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,336
South-Central (Sebring), FL
Commando1
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master
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,336
South-Central (Sebring), FL
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Quote:
I have had several of these new style Hyd flat tappet cams, sure they run OK but the valve train noise is horrible..
And I thought it was just me.
Makes me feel better about my last build. Thanks. 
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Dunnuck Racing]
#1067879
09/03/11 10:48 AM
09/03/11 10:48 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
Fast rate of lift camshafts and too much spring pressure will overide the hydraulic mechanism.
Some of the cheaper lifters can't handle it.
Keith
This and everyone that I know wants something that will
be fast in the engine so they go with the bigger
lifts and of course they want they want the maintenance
free of the hyd cam when in reality they should have
gone with the flat tappet
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: rickstershemi]
#1067882
09/03/11 01:24 PM
09/03/11 01:24 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
Bob_Coomer
OP
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OP
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
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How do the older MP cams differ? Wish I had my old 528 solid cam laying around, pretty much gave it away figured I would never use that ole thing... That ole 528 solid is one heck of a street cam...
[color:"red"]65 Hemi Belvedere coming soon [/color]
[color:"#00FF00"]557" Indy engine 1.07 60ft 144mph in the 8th 2100 lbs package [/color]
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#1067883
09/03/11 01:29 PM
09/03/11 01:29 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
polyspheric
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
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Higher idle speed
Higher viscosity
Higher low speed pressure (pump size?)
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: polyspheric]
#1067884
09/03/11 01:40 PM
09/03/11 01:40 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
Bob_Coomer
OP
master
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OP
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
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I used the matching lifters from Comp, the cup seat looks to be about .100 shorter than the cam and lifters that cam out of it..
I thought about pulling the intake and throw these lifters in.. just to see.
[color:"red"]65 Hemi Belvedere coming soon [/color]
[color:"#00FF00"]557" Indy engine 1.07 60ft 144mph in the 8th 2100 lbs package [/color]
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#1067885
09/03/11 01:46 PM
09/03/11 01:46 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,943
San Angelo, Texas, U.S.A.
1968RR
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,943
San Angelo, Texas, U.S.A.
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I've been using Comp's XE295HL cam (and the Pro Magnum lifters) for over two years now and I've got lots of lifter noise. I've checked and rechecked the preload, and everything is set right. The engine runs well, but the cam/lifters are loud (especially when cold). I thought that the new HS rockers I've added might help a little, but no dice.
"When I'm in a slump, I comfort myself by saying if I believe in dinosaurs, then somewhere, they must be believing in me. And if they believe in me, then I can believe in me." - Mookie Wilson
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: 1968RR]
#1067886
09/03/11 01:54 PM
09/03/11 01:54 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
Bob_Coomer
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,293
Rock Springs
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Its aggravating me... I think its Unacceptable..
The Ford and Chevy guys dont have this problem. Im sorry Id give up a little power not to hear that noise... [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean]?
[color:"red"]65 Hemi Belvedere coming soon [/color]
[color:"#00FF00"]557" Indy engine 1.07 60ft 144mph in the 8th 2100 lbs package [/color]
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Bob_Coomer]
#1067887
09/03/11 02:47 PM
09/03/11 02:47 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 21
Mississauga, On.
Duster 371
member
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member
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 21
Mississauga, On.
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Bob... I couldn't agree more. But its not the the Mopar cams, installed an extremely mild Comp Cam in my Big Block Vette and the valve train was so noisy, i thought the lifters were bad. So after another set of new lifters and multiple adjustments....same crap! 
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Duster 371]
#1067888
09/03/11 02:56 PM
09/03/11 02:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,989
Anoka County, MN
Leigh
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,989
Anoka County, MN
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Quote:
Bob... I couldn't agree more.
But its not the the Mopar cams, installed an extremely mild
Comp Cam in my Big Block Vette and the valve train was so
noisy, i thought the lifters were bad. So after another set
of new lifters and multiple adjustments....same crap!
 +1. I have a Comp 268H in a +.030 BBC, that not only is noisy, it's a stone. I run the recommended Comp springs, and Delphi lifters. By the way, they are no quieter than the Comp lifters, that came with the cam.
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Re: Who do all these modern flat Hyd sound like crap?
[Re: Duster 371]
#1067889
09/03/11 03:07 PM
09/03/11 03:07 PM
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,501
Gainesville,FL
goldmember
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 4,501
Gainesville,FL
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Quote:
Bob... I couldn't agree more.
But its not the the Mopar cams, installed an extremely mild
Comp Cam in my Big Block Vette and the valve train was so
noisy, i thought the lifters were bad. So after another set
of new lifters and multiple adjustments....same crap!
Your correct it's NOT limited to mopar cams. It's a potential problem with any camshaft design. The first time I ran into this was around 79/80 when a certain company released a line of cams that are still being sold today,the first batches were very annoying,but a little revamp and things were quiet again.
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