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Finally got out to the track last night!!...Updated!!! #1052027
08/13/11 11:51 AM
08/13/11 11:51 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
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Toronto
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mshred Offline OP
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mshred  Offline OP
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And I had a blast!!! The car does need to be tuned more, but that is why I went, to try and dial it in. However, as much as fun as it was, I believe there is still more in the car due to the mph I was getting (I cant seem to find a chart that converts mph to ideal e/t, but i did do the 1320/mph calculation to get close). Im thinking I am having some suspension issues and possibly need to alter the jetting in the carburetor. I was getting about 13-13.2 AFR according to my wideband in 4th gear at about 4900-5300rpms (kinda hard to watch the gauge during the rest of the run, and i cant datalog it right now since the cord i have doesnt work). Anyways here is a rundown of the night...my foot did not come off the throttle on any of the shifts, and I had a blast! Stick cars rule!

Pass#1- Caltracs with 0 preload (bars just touching), rancho rear shocks on 7, 9psi in my e/t streets (no tubes, and yes, its a crappy gauge so the numbers are abnormally low- on my buddies decent analog gauge that equates to 14 psi in the tires), half tank of gas, launching at 4000rpm off the two step and shifting at about 6000rpm
R/T .000
60' 1.88
1/4 12.936
MPH 107.15

Pass #2- Same as Pass #1
R/T .285
60' 1.888
1/4- 12.932
MPH- 106.72

Pass #3- Same as first two passes, this time leaving off the two step at 4500rpm
R/T .278
60' 1.807
1/4 12.734
MPH- 107.59

Pass #4 Same as all other passes, 5000rpm launch
R/T .505
60' 1.753
1/4 12.67
MPH 107.94

Pass #5 (best pass of the night)- Same as pass #4, but rear shocks tightened two clicks to 9 (max)
R/T .390
60' 1.742
1/4 12.615
MPH 108.43

Pass #6- Same as pass #5 but tried lowering 8psi instead of 9psi in the tires (according to my crappy gauge). Blew the tires right off and almost went straight into the wall. I got out of it in a hurry and ended up with a 14.49 e/t and 89mph...just happy it wasnt a disaster

Pass #7- Same as pass #5
R/T .145
60' 1.776
1/4 12.71
MPH 107.69

What do you guys think? I feel the car has more E/T in it, especially after that surprising mph on pass #5. I am getting some air under the front tires on launch, but I kept feeling a bog from start to end of night (why I kept raising my launch rpms). It got better the higher i went, but it was still there ever so slightly. I also think I need to possibly add some preload to the bars. Also, how normal is it to have fire coming out the exhaust sitting on the two step and powershifting?

Im going back out to the track next week, so any suggestions for tuning are appreciated! Overall I am VERY happy with how the car is performing and I'd like to give a big thanks to everybody on here who has given me a hand with all the questions ive asked, and most of all Brian at IMM engines (member OU812) for setting me up with a killer head and cam combo that is what really make this engine what it is. I built this engine for 3k, with a bone stock bottom end, and I couldnt be happier, especially considering I think it still has more in it. I drive it everywhere and constantly get asked if its a big block lol

Thanks everybody

Last edited by mshred; 08/21/11 01:25 PM.
Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052028
08/13/11 11:57 AM
08/13/11 11:57 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
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Mr.Yuck  Offline
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Brookeville, Md
you need more air in those tires...your mph should be good for low low 12's.

what is the set-up? engine car? It's hard to lookat the gauges...lol I was just keeping an eye on my fuel pressure and tach last night. I think I might add a shift light under the cowl so all I see is a flash.


[IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/pui5j.jpg[/IMG]
Coming soon!!!!
Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: Mr.Yuck] #1052029
08/13/11 12:05 PM
08/13/11 12:05 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
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mshred Offline OP
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mshred  Offline OP
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Quote:

you need more air in those tires...your mph should be good for low low 12's.

what is the set-up? engine car? It's hard to lookat the gauges...lol I was just keeping an eye on my fuel pressure and tach last night. I think I might add a shift light under the cowl so all I see is a flash.




Hey man, I am currently uploading some vids on youtube right now that I will post shortly that give a better idea of how it was leaving...it was 9psi on my crappy gauge, but 14 on a good one. I was told that these tires will like somewhere around 14-16psi in them, so i think im close. On my best pass it almost seemed like hooked and then bogged...But it definitely didnt like less than that though since pass #6 was a writeoff when i tried

Setup is a 71 plymouth scamp, all steel 3400lbs me in it. 91 360 hydraulic roller motor, stock bottom end, RHS heads prepped by Brian at IMM, custom hydr. roller cam from Brian at IMM, 750HP holley carb, 4.10 dana 60, A833 4 gear with a centerforce clutch and a v-gate

Car has caltracs, stock 6cyl springs, ranchos out back, /6 t-bars up front with RMS adjustable UCA's and calvert 90/10 shocks, on a 28x12.5 ET street tire

Yea watching the gauges is hard, all I really got to look at was my rpm's coming to the traps and a quick peak at my AFR coming to the traps as well. I wish I had gotten a playback tach when I bought one..Im going to try and get the proper chord for my AFR gauge for this coming weekend as im going to the track again and would like to datalog

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052030
08/13/11 12:09 PM
08/13/11 12:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,935
United Socialist States of Ame...
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tboomer Offline
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Glad you had fun!! I would invest in a good tire gauge..Keep playing with it and you will drop your et!!


Need your rear end checked out? Contact Grizzly!!
Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: tboomer] #1052031
08/13/11 12:11 PM
08/13/11 12:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
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mshred Offline OP
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mshred  Offline OP
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Quote:

Glad you had fun!! I would invest in a good tire gauge..Keep playing with it and you will drop your et!!




thanks! I ordered a Moroso tire gauge earlier in the week, but it didnt come in on time for the track. I should have it though for this next weekend coming up

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052032
08/13/11 12:11 PM
08/13/11 12:11 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,682
On the parachute mount
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n20mstr Offline
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On the parachute mount
sounds good
work on that 60 foot and you going low 12s for sure

i think you can loosen the rear shocks a lil.

on Joes car on motor we run the rear shocks on 3 and it dont spin at all....you do have a stick but i think you can loosen them a tad


....BAD A$$ STREET CAR.....
Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052033
08/13/11 12:14 PM
08/13/11 12:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
If it bogged you might need more pump shot???

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: n20mstr] #1052034
08/13/11 12:21 PM
08/13/11 12:21 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
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mshred Offline OP
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Quote:

sounds good
work on that 60 foot and you going low 12s for sure

i think you can loosen the rear shocks a lil.

on Joes car on motor we run the rear shocks on 3 and it dont spin at all....you do have a stick but i think you can loosen them a tad




Hey Tony, thanks! I talked with Joe on facebook about the duster, he's haulin with it man!

Im getting some vids up so i will post them here and you guys can take a look. The time's got better when I stiffened the shocks up to 9 from the 7 I had them on. And I've seen other stick guys say they needed them stiff too. Maybe next time out I will try them on 5 or 3 and just see what happens though

What did Joe 60 on the motor again? I did a calculation of 1320/ my best mph (108.43) and it says that everything perfect I should be able to run a 12.1 or around there. If I can do that I will be one happy kid lol

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: Mr.Yuck] #1052035
08/13/11 12:24 PM
08/13/11 12:24 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
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mshred Offline OP
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Quote:

If it bogged you might need more pump shot???




pump shot as in squirter, or as in pump cam?

its got 35 squirters in it right now, primary and secondary. 3.5PV and 75 primary jet, 76 secondary jet. Used to have a 78 secondary in it, but it was running quite a bit richer with that in it. Once I get some solid AFR numbers I think I will have a better direction for jetting

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052036
08/13/11 12:31 PM
08/13/11 12:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
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Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Quote:

Quote:

If it bogged you might need more pump shot???




pump shot as in squirter, or as in pump cam?

its got 35 squirters in it right now, primary and secondary. 3.5PV and 75 primary jet, 76 secondary jet. Used to have a 78 secondary in it, but it was running quite a bit richer with that in it. Once I get some solid AFR numbers I think I will have a better direction for jetting




I'd think you need more rear jet. I ran 74/80 in a very mild 340 w/ 28 squirts... try 82's. I'd think that thing would need more than 78's. why is the PV so low, what's the vacuum at idle? I don't know much about AFR gauges, had one in a boosted car but never saw the need w/ a carb...just simple I guess.

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052037
08/13/11 12:40 PM
08/13/11 12:40 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,746
Ontario, Canada
Dodgem Offline
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Well friday night at cayuga is not known for great traction especially after the street cars (especially front drives) have a couple hours to drag water up to the line!


What were your 1/8 mile times and MPH's?

Last edited by Dodgem; 08/13/11 12:41 PM.
Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: Mr.Yuck] #1052038
08/13/11 12:41 PM
08/13/11 12:41 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
M
mshred Offline OP
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mshred  Offline OP
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

If it bogged you might need more pump shot???




pump shot as in squirter, or as in pump cam?

its got 35 squirters in it right now, primary and secondary. 3.5PV and 75 primary jet, 76 secondary jet. Used to have a 78 secondary in it, but it was running quite a bit richer with that in it. Once I get some solid AFR numbers I think I will have a better direction for jetting




I'd think you need more rear jet. I ran 74/80 in a very mild 340 w/ 28 squirts... try 82's. I'd think that thing would need more than 78's. why is the PV so low, what's the vacuum at idle? I don't know much about AFR gauges, had one in a boosted car but never saw the need w/ a carb...just simple I guess.




Vacuum at idle is 6.5 (the cam is very rough). Stock jetting for this carburetor was 75p, 80s. Reason I jetted down was because I was getting 10.8 at WOT in 1st and 2nd gear on the street, which is way too rich. But until I can datalog this, I really can't truly monitor what its doing. I picked up the AFR gauge to try and tune my cruise a/f since this is a street car- plus it doesnt hurt to use it for tuning WOT and idle as well. Obviously I still need to read the plugs though

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: Dodgem] #1052039
08/13/11 12:42 PM
08/13/11 12:42 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
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mshred Offline OP
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Quote:

Well friday night at cayuga is not known for great traction especially after the street cars (especially front drives) have a couple hours to drag water up to the line!





yea, i know, but what can you do right? I wanted to go, and it was the only time I could. Today is an OSCA weekend, with qualifying starting at around 2, so i figured i'd get more runs in on a non even night than an event day. Going back next Friday probably, and possibly staying over for the saturday test and tune as well

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052040
08/13/11 12:43 PM
08/13/11 12:43 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 9,366
Lehigh Acres, Florida
rickstershemi Offline
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Hey Matt Congrats on getting in some track time....I agree, there's more in it....should be 12.2's at that mile per hr and your 60's are really not that far off either....tune...tune...tune

Rickster

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: rickstershemi] #1052041
08/13/11 01:29 PM
08/13/11 01:29 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,050
Shelby Twp. Mi
HardcoreB Offline
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Congrats! I'm sure you'll be real happy with the cars performance when done. Thanks for the update and lets see some pics!

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: HardcoreB] #1052042
08/13/11 01:31 PM
08/13/11 01:31 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
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mshred Offline OP
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Here are the vids...Don't mind my overly enthusiastic friend who can't video worth a damn LOL

Pass #4 here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPRTJ0L7spw

Pass #5 here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAnSYfS8D_o

Thanks for the support and any input on anything you guys see or think is greatly appreciated

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052043
08/13/11 01:58 PM
08/13/11 01:58 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Romeo MI
Right now your off about 1/2 a second for the ET to MPH...
as you seen with the increase in RPM your 60' was getting
better so continue in that direction and that should
take care of the bog(small block doesnt have a ton
of torque)... once you get the best 60' with RPM then
start changing the preload on the caltracs to tweek
it in more..... you slowed the 60' by dropping the tire
pressure so you know you went the wrong way, so start
going up..... also the jetting you have should be
higher on the secondaries (about 7 jet sizes bigger
than a PV jet setting)...... keep playing

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052044
08/13/11 01:58 PM
08/13/11 01:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,146
Now - Port Orange,Fla. Former...
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Now - Port Orange,Fla. Former...
CONGRATS and BEAUTIFUL Scamp!!!!

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: MIKES_DUSTER] #1052045
08/13/11 02:01 PM
08/13/11 02:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,050
Shelby Twp. Mi
HardcoreB Offline
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Sounds great...nice car.

Re: Finally got out to the track last night!!... [Re: mshred] #1052046
08/13/11 02:41 PM
08/13/11 02:41 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,204
Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline
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I would try putting in smaller squirters to get rid of the bog, smaller will squirt longer, bigger squirts shorter, with the same pressure stick shift cars eat parts,what are you ging to feed it But they sure are fun BTW, make sure the accelerator pump arms are adjusted properly also You should have .015 to .20 of clearance left in the travel at WOT on both arms to the adjusters, IE slip a feeler gauge in between them or use the calibrated finger feel


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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