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Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: mshred] #955863
03/22/11 05:18 PM
03/22/11 05:18 PM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 511
Temperance, MI
6
68 HEMI GTS Offline
mopar
68 HEMI GTS  Offline
mopar
6

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 511
Temperance, MI
Quote:

Quote:

build a bigger motor, leave the car alone




that would be ideal Nevin, but i barely have at the moment




Matt, removing the undercoating isn't a bad idea. the other stuff isn't gonna be worth it. you either gotta pony up and really cut the weight out of it (make it a race car), or just leave it alone (my sugestion). i think a few years down the road you'll be sorry that you cut up a beautiful car (if you do). there's plently of swiss cheese a-bodys out there already if you really need to go that fast. save your coin and build a stroker down the road. if the grudge races are that important, screw bigger jets into the Nitrous plate

I still have my backseat, and people use it!!

Last edited by 68 HEMI GTS; 03/22/11 05:20 PM.

68 Dart GTS "HEMI" 10.30 @ 131 pump gas street car 3780#
69 Roadrunner 511 six pack 10.92 drive to track street car
Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: 68 HEMI GTS] #955864
03/22/11 06:26 PM
03/22/11 06:26 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,295
U.S.
M
moparniac Offline
master
moparniac  Offline
master
M

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Posts: 6,295
U.S.
Im with the leave the car alone and build a bigger motor camp!


Mopar Performance
Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: moparniac] #955865
03/22/11 06:35 PM
03/22/11 06:35 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,210
robin hood country
deaks Offline
master
deaks  Offline
master

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Posts: 3,210
robin hood country
That's too nicer car to cut up, just use nos untill you get the money for more head or motor.


69 Dart GTS 440 mopar .590 cam, Edelbrock heads, 3200#
best et 6.45, 106.78, 10.14, 132.88 mph, 1.47 60ft
best 60ft 1.36
Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: deaks] #955866
03/22/11 10:22 PM
03/22/11 10:22 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,257
acworth / N. georgia - south e...
cheapstreetdustr Offline
master
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,257
acworth / N. georgia - south e...
you can make a jig for a drill press..
and drill out every body fastener bolt down the center with a 9/32 drill bit..you will still get the fasterners holding power but it will be hollow and it will all add up..
you could do it to just about every bolt every fastener holding hardware on the body of the car..
you said something thats free..and not really destroy the car...
its easy enough youll just need cutting fluid and lots of beer..
cheapst


365" Iron J heads,,3480lbs best 1.39 60ft on SS springs.10.54,124 mph ...6.67 1/8th et.average 60fts 1.46 w/ small cam &.063 no2 pill tagged & insured
[image][/image]
Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: cheapstreetdustr] #955867
03/22/11 10:27 PM
03/22/11 10:27 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
M
mshred Offline OP
master
mshred  Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
Hey everybody, thanks the opinions and compliments

I still don't know how some get their cars so light even when they are all steel iron headed cars, but whatever...its a streetcar, so its gotta have some level of comfort. The plan is for a BIG inch SB eventually so until then i'll have to pill it till i kill it lol

Can anybody help on the rear window regulator removal though? I was thinking about doing this regardless of the weight saving thing since i never use those windows. How can i keep the window up with the regulator gone?

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: mshred] #955868
03/22/11 11:00 PM
03/22/11 11:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,354
ohio
H
HEMIDARTS Offline
master
HEMIDARTS  Offline
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H

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,354
ohio
Quote:

Hey everybody, thanks the opinions and compliments

I still don't know how some get their cars so light even when they are all steel iron headed cars, but whatever...its a streetcar, so its gotta have some level of comfort. The plan is for a BIG inch SB eventually so until then i'll have to pill it till i kill it lol

Can anybody help on the rear window regulator removal though? I was thinking about doing this regardless of the weight saving thing since i never use those windows. How can i keep the window up with the regulator gone?




You could do the seatbelt trick that the 68 HEMI Darts did.
They did that on the door windows.
Wrap a belt around the window, put a fastener on the headliner.
Problem solved.

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: mshred] #955869
03/22/11 11:04 PM
03/22/11 11:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 587
San Clemente, ca
enelson Offline
mopar addict
enelson  Offline
mopar addict

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 587
San Clemente, ca
I wouldn't worry about it too much, if you're into timeslips you'll likely need a bar added which is more weight...

I'm in the leave it camp, however I would do my best to lighten anything up that's acceptable in the front half of the car to get good weight transfer and lower your 60....

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: enelson] #955870
03/22/11 11:25 PM
03/22/11 11:25 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOrk ! Offline
The village idiot's idiot
dOrk !  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
If you are not willing to seriously consider AT LEAST a FG front bumper(you CAN get them "chromed" ... then you are just farding in-the-wind ... IMO.

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: dOrk !] #955871
03/22/11 11:30 PM
03/22/11 11:30 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
M
mshred Offline OP
master
mshred  Offline OP
master
M

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
Quote:

If you are not willing to seriously consider AT LEAST a FG front bumper(you CAN get them "chromed" ... then you are just farding in-the-wind ... IMO.




I'll stick with the farting then

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: mshred] #955872
03/23/11 12:36 AM
03/23/11 12:36 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,414
St. Croix, US Virgin Islands
D
David_in_St_Croi Offline
top fuel
David_in_St_Croi  Offline
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D

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,414
St. Croix, US Virgin Islands
A couple of thoughts here. First, your car really does look very nice.

The rear windows your best bet is to just remove the inner door panel and take a look. Take out the window regulator and see what kind of track arrangement there is. Push the windows all the way up. Then just put a screw or something through the front and rear tracks or to some thing in the body. Probably best to use some kind of fastener with a piece of fuel hose over it so you do not chip the glass and cause a crack. Our 70 RR is a post with flip out windows so don't really have more insight than that. I think the seat belt trick was for the door windows. It would be pretty cool if you could make it work for the front doors. I do believe the seat belt trick is an all up or all down option though.

Removing undercoating wouldn't bother me at all. At this age in our cars' lives the original undercoating is more likely to be semi lifted and holding water in.

The heater box with the air conditioning condenser in our 70 RR is probably 50 pounds. Plus you have got rid of the heater hose weight and the entrained water. Our's got the flick right away. Working under the dash is much easier. I then mounted the MSD 6AL on the firewall inside the passenger compartment so it is out of the weather and cooler, could not have done that with the heater box in place. Pull it out, make an aluminium cover plate and try it for the year. It is not irreversible, as opposed to hacking out the door beams. The weight you are removing is also farther forward than the door beams. If you don't like it, put it back in.

As far as the 727 versus A833 question, don't forget the weight of all the fluid in the torque converter, the lines to the cooler, the fluid in the lines, the cooler itself, the shield for the tranny (although that is still lighter than a Lakewood at 52 pounds according to the American Airlines baggage scale, at least that is big block weight).

When I was building racing sailboats we always cut off the fastener ends. Adds up remarkably quickly, and something you can do with little cost.

When the carpet dies in our RR I will just be removing it and painting the floorboards with a heavy duty paint. We like the minimalist interior anyway, and with no carpets it is not a big deal when rainwater gets in.

Not sure about small blocks but the factory iron intake manifolds on big blocks are brutally heavy. Replacing it with an aluminium intake manifold is a big saving. Of course, that is not free or low cost. you might also have already done it, I forget if your first post list mentioned that.

Go to the gym if you are not in shape.

Actually, this was a story told to me by another naval architect once. This couple was trying to decide whether to spend $30000 in materials to knock another 30 pounds off the boat they were having designed and built. The wife finally said "Go on a diet, join the gym, save the money. You are always on the boat, and you have been wanting to lose 30 pounds".


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Proud member of the liberal scientific elite
Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: David_in_St_Croi] #955873
03/23/11 12:52 AM
03/23/11 12:52 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4 Offline
master
rowin4  Offline
master

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
Ok , after seeing a picture of your car your freeking nuts to start cutting it up, look at the picture below, this is my car, this you can cut up with no problem and I have some but all the window still work, all original glass , all metal and bondo, only the hood is fiberglass. Build a motor.


it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: David_in_St_Croi] #955874
03/23/11 12:58 AM
03/23/11 12:58 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,763
A collage of whims
topside Offline
Too Many Posts
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Posts: 20,763
A collage of whims
I don't think there's a gain in removing the rear regulators; in fact, I wouldn't remove any weight aft of the B-pillars. In front, on a street car, you can replace items with lighter ones, and also their mounting brackets and fasteners. Delete every part that you don't need. There's a few pounds in the fender splash pans. There's probably a much lighter aluminum heater core for another application that could replace your OEM one.
I agree with the others that (1) that's a pretty car, and (2) it'd be a shame to cut it up in a way that would damage it.

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: topside] #955875
03/23/11 04:10 AM
03/23/11 04:10 AM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,141
junction city oregon
V
viperblue72 Offline
top fuel
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V

Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,141
junction city oregon
Have you considered running without a hood? If its pretty enough under there it would look just fine. Just the hood alone is 55lbs. Then the hood hinges are probably another 10 or 15.

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: viperblue72] #955876
03/23/11 04:13 AM
03/23/11 04:13 AM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,141
junction city oregon
V
viperblue72 Offline
top fuel
viperblue72  Offline
top fuel
V

Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,141
junction city oregon
What front seats you running? I know my bench seat in my duster is HEAVY.

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: viperblue72] #955877
03/23/11 10:03 AM
03/23/11 10:03 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,466
malvern, ohio
3
3ddart Offline
pro stock
3ddart  Offline
pro stock
3

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,466
malvern, ohio
pick-up jim schild's "authenticity guide 1968 dart & barracuda hemi super stock" for info on makeing the rear qt windows stationary. mancini carries it. that is a real nice looking car so don't fudge it up! dave

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: David_in_St_Croi] #955878
03/23/11 11:14 AM
03/23/11 11:14 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
M
mshred Offline OP
master
mshred  Offline OP
master
M

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
Quote:

A couple of thoughts here. First, your car really does look very nice.

The rear windows your best bet is to just remove the inner door panel and take a look. Take out the window regulator and see what kind of track arrangement there is. Push the windows all the way up. Then just put a screw or something through the front and rear tracks or to some thing in the body. Probably best to use some kind of fastener with a piece of fuel hose over it so you do not chip the glass and cause a crack. Our 70 RR is a post with flip out windows so don't really have more insight than that. I think the seat belt trick was for the door windows. It would be pretty cool if you could make it work for the front doors. I do believe the seat belt trick is an all up or all down option though.

Removing undercoating wouldn't bother me at all. At this age in our cars' lives the original undercoating is more likely to be semi lifted and holding water in.

The heater box with the air conditioning condenser in our 70 RR is probably 50 pounds. Plus you have got rid of the heater hose weight and the entrained water. Our's got the flick right away. Working under the dash is much easier. I then mounted the MSD 6AL on the firewall inside the passenger compartment so it is out of the weather and cooler, could not have done that with the heater box in place. Pull it out, make an aluminium cover plate and try it for the year. It is not irreversible, as opposed to hacking out the door beams. The weight you are removing is also farther forward than the door beams. If you don't like it, put it back in.

As far as the 727 versus A833 question, don't forget the weight of all the fluid in the torque converter, the lines to the cooler, the fluid in the lines, the cooler itself, the shield for the tranny (although that is still lighter than a Lakewood at 52 pounds according to the American Airlines baggage scale, at least that is big block weight).

When I was building racing sailboats we always cut off the fastener ends. Adds up remarkably quickly, and something you can do with little cost.

When the carpet dies in our RR I will just be removing it and painting the floorboards with a heavy duty paint. We like the minimalist interior anyway, and with no carpets it is not a big deal when rainwater gets in.

Not sure about small blocks but the factory iron intake manifolds on big blocks are brutally heavy. Replacing it with an aluminium intake manifold is a big saving. Of course, that is not free or low cost. you might also have already done it, I forget if your first post list mentioned that.

Go to the gym if you are not in shape.

Actually, this was a story told to me by another naval architect once. This couple was trying to decide whether to spend $30000 in materials to knock another 30 pounds off the boat they were having designed and built. The wife finally said "Go on a diet, join the gym, save the money. You are always on the boat, and you have been wanting to lose 30 pounds".




Very informative post, thank you

I will look into your suggestions and see what I can implement with the car. When I say cutup the car, i think people assume im going to hack at it...but what I really mean is if there is anything I can remove without sacrificing streetability or ALOT of cash lol

and yes i am in shape, go to the gym religiously, although it seems almost impossible for me to lose weight (not that I want to though, then i'll look like a scronny beach model guy )

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: topside] #955879
03/23/11 11:15 AM
03/23/11 11:15 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
M
mshred Offline OP
master
mshred  Offline OP
master
M

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
Quote:

I don't think there's a gain in removing the rear regulators; in fact, I wouldn't remove any weight aft of the B-pillars. In front, on a street car, you can replace items with lighter ones, and also their mounting brackets and fasteners. Delete every part that you don't need. There's a few pounds in the fender splash pans. There's probably a much lighter aluminum heater core for another application that could replace your OEM one.
I agree with the others that (1) that's a pretty car, and (2) it'd be a shame to cut it up in a way that would damage it.




that would be interesting to know what heater core would interchange...

thank your for the compliment on the car

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: viperblue72] #955880
03/23/11 11:17 AM
03/23/11 11:17 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
M
mshred Offline OP
master
mshred  Offline OP
master
M

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
Quote:

What front seats you running? I know my bench seat in my duster is HEAVY.




Im going to keep the hood on my car since I think running with no hood looks quite goofy, plus i dont want to have to go cleaning under there more than i already do

Im running front buckets out of a Geo metro. I got them because they were light and comfy, but im wishing I had gone with a poly seat now or a kirkey. My buddy has the poly ones in his fox, and even after long rides in the passenger seat, they dont bother me at all, and im sure are a good deal lighter

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: 3ddart] #955881
03/23/11 11:19 AM
03/23/11 11:19 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
M
mshred Offline OP
master
mshred  Offline OP
master
M

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
Quote:

pick-up jim schild's "authenticity guide 1968 dart & barracuda hemi super stock" for info on makeing the rear qt windows stationary. mancini carries it. that is a real nice looking car so don't fudge it up! dave




thanks for the tip!

Once again, thanks all for the compliments on the car! I will not cut er up, not to worry. Ive never been a fan of hackjob cars (not sure anyone is really)

It seems like consensus is to be happy with what I have and just build more power in the future. That is plan, so I guess i'll keep it that way...now I just gotta figure out how to plant that money tree in the backyard (I'll let you guys know the secret if i ever figure it out lol)

Re: Shedding weight on an A-body [Re: mshred] #955882
03/29/11 07:09 AM
03/29/11 07:09 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,862
the frozen wastes...
Pale_Roader Offline
Swears too much
Pale_Roader  Offline
Swears too much

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,862
the frozen wastes...
Quote:


and yes i am in shape, go to the gym religiously, although it seems almost impossible for me to lose weight (not that I want to though, then i'll look like a scronny beach model guy )




Hah! No kidding. Real men go to the gym to gain weight. I'm up 50lbs since the last time i raced my car, and i'm a HUGE weight-reduction junkie.... OUCH.

Thats a damn nice looking car, and i'll also suggest you dont hack it, but there is a lot you can just unbolt in these cars, a lot more than people think. I wont go into all the fun ways to diet a car, i wrote an article about that in the last weight reduction thread i saw. I'd link it, but i forget what the title was...

Also, if you are really obsessed with weight, and if you haven't built/installed the Dana 60 yet, consider a Ford 8.8". Those things weigh (from what i've been told) slightly less than an 8 3/4", are quite a bit stronger, WAY cheaper and easy to find and in a plethora ov sizes/shapes/configurations and are fairly easy to squeeze in there if you have any fabrication skills. That would solve your problem, save you 50lbs, and save you a lot ov money.

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