Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: FuryBoy]
#769986
08/10/10 02:55 AM
08/10/10 02:55 AM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493 Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog
Striving for excellence
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Striving for excellence
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493
Granite Bay CA
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Quote:
imho...
Dyno numbers are BS. 1/4 mile times are the true judge...
My 493 in the Charger also had a surprisingly low number on the dyno. Its a 440 with the 4.15 stroke crank. 10.8 pistons, Edelbrock heads and the performer RPM intake. Barry Grant 850 and the MP '509 juice cam. It peaked at 361 HP at 5300 and 510 lbs of TQ at 3100. I expected more too, but this car runs like a raped ape!
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: FuryBoy]
#769987
08/10/10 04:14 AM
08/10/10 04:14 AM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 714 California
BigDaddy440
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 714
California
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Quote:
imho...
Dyno numbers are BS. 1/4 mile times are the true judge...
People who claim that dynos are BS are either uninformed or sour about their own dyno results.
Several years ago I built a 440 with edelbrock heads, a solid flat tappet cam, nice intake, big carb, nice exhaust etc. It only made 360rwhp, which is about 450 engine horse power. The car still ran great, 11.90s at 114mph in a b body.
On the same day, my friend brings his 440 powered b body which he had just finished building. Although he was a very experience Mopar racer, I thought I had him beat on the dyno with my new Edlelbrock heads. Our bottom-ends were nearly identical, but he had a solid-roller cam, home ported 906s and a six pack intake set up. He laid down 426rwhp, which is about 520 engine hp. I couldn't believe how much power he made. And sure enough, when he took it to the track, he had a full 5mph more trap speed than me too.
The point here is, its the total combination that has too work well together to make the impressive numbers. Like dynos or not, the more dyno power you make, the faster your car will / should go.
Btw, I've been around dynos quite a bit, and I've never seen results that are "fishy" or questionable. They always back up a car's track performance.
Most guys go away upset from the dyno because they're there to get a ego boost, and end up getting a reality check. I've been on both sides of the coin.
1969 A12 Roadrunner 1970 Plymouth Cuda 1968 Dodge Dart
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: BigDaddy440]
#769988
08/10/10 04:43 AM
08/10/10 04:43 AM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,173 CT
GTX MATT
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,173
CT
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Ditch the intake and carb, youve got an essentially stock intake and a very hard to tune carb.
Also who knows what cam is in it? Without knowing you're probably just playing guessing games. In my experience when someone doesnt know whats been done to an engine they either know and dont want to say or whoever they got it from told them that because they knew and didn't want to say. It was probably rebuilt with a cheap rebuild kit which usually has low compression pistons.
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: terzmo]
#769992
08/10/10 12:05 PM
08/10/10 12:05 PM
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,843 Arlington, Texas
bobby66
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,843
Arlington, Texas
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Quote:
reaction time is for heads up racing...the clock doesn't start till the car moves,including red lights. You get timed when you start.
440 6 pack cars, when new ran low 14's...new stock 426 hemis couldn't get into the 12's.
I don't think most Hemis made it in the 13s, stock.
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: 451Mopar]
#769993
08/10/10 12:57 PM
08/10/10 12:57 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,405 Pikes Peak Country
TC@HP2
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,405
Pikes Peak Country
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Quote:
need more info...
Were those numbers the uncorrected HP and torque, or were they SAE corrected numbers? If they were uncorrected numbers what Temperature, Humidity, and Altitude when tested? What were the RPM at peak HP and peak Torque?
Very important questions here for consideration of your combo before you just start changing things out.
Where I am at, physical altitude is 5500 ft. Density altitude can be 10,000 or more on any given day. I have seen many "500" horse big blocks strap on the chassis dyno and crank out a whopping 180-200 RWHP. There is nothing inherently wrong with any of their combos, but high altitude combined with warm, thin air will kill power in no time. The same combo at sea level with dry air is a whole 'nuther story.
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: TC@HP2]
#769994
08/10/10 01:13 PM
08/10/10 01:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 456 Santa Barbara, CA
HitIt
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 456
Santa Barbara, CA
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Did this dyno operator do any tuning to the timing or carb to squeeze a few more HP out of it, or did he just do a run and that was that?
A 440 engine that's just a little off on those could easily lose 50hp, and that's aside from tune up stuff like plugs, wires, fuel filter, points, coil etc if any of that stuff needs replaced. Something to consider.
very clever dinner. appetizing food fit neatly into interesting round pie.
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: FuryBoy]
#769998
08/10/10 05:18 PM
08/10/10 05:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest
MoparforLife
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,200
Upper Midwest
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Quote:
imho...
Dyno numbers are BS. 1/4 mile times are the true judge...
Fully agree. If you don't like a number go to another dyno till you find one that tells you what you want to hear. All a dyno is is a tool to help peak a combo for the day and conditions at the time of the pull.
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: MoparforLife]
#770000
08/10/10 05:31 PM
08/10/10 05:31 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 230 FL
shupe
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 230
FL
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Quote:
Quote:
imho...
Dyno numbers are BS. 1/4 mile times are the true judge...
Fully agree. If you don't like a number go to another dyno till you find one that tells you what you want to hear. All a dyno is is a tool to help peak a combo for the day and conditions at the time of the pull.
Yet another who agrees. Before I start changing carbs or doing leakdowns I'd at least drive the car and get a 1/4 mile mph.
If you dyno'd the car because you drove it and it's a pig, that's another matter.
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: barracudabob]
#770001
08/10/10 06:03 PM
08/10/10 06:03 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,096 Irving, TX
feets
Senior Management
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Senior Management
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,096
Irving, TX
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Quote:
Quote:
imho...
Dyno numbers are BS. 1/4 mile times are the true judge...
I agree. Take it and get some timeslips, then start looking for more power.
You guys are full of crap. What should a 3800 lb car with 459 rwhp and 490 rwtq run? That puts it close to 600 hp at the crank.
How about a 12.49? Add a converter and it'd be a solid 11 car. The dyno won't see the converter.
We recently had a dyno day with our club. A couple mild 440s made similar power to the original post. In fact, a couple small blocks were in the same park with power but were lacking the torque.
The dyno can tell you a lot about your engine. In fact, Stumpy found that he needed to try a different shift point with his truck.
A dyno is a tool. It is not a competition. When used properly, it will help improve your drag strip experience.
When there is no drag strip close or if you're not a drag racer, dynos can come in handy for tuning your car.
We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind. - Stu Harmon
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: feets]
#770002
08/10/10 06:14 PM
08/10/10 06:14 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,481 Mesa, AZ
Pat_Whalen
super gas
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super gas
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,481
Mesa, AZ
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
imho...
Dyno numbers are BS. 1/4 mile times are the true judge...
I agree. Take it and get some timeslips, then start looking for more power.
You guys are full of crap. What should a 3800 lb car with 459 rwhp and 490 rwtq run? That puts it close to 600 hp at the crank.
How about a 12.49? Add a converter and it'd be a solid 11 car. The dyno won't see the converter.
We recently had a dyno day with our club. A couple mild 440s made similar power to the original post. In fact, a couple small blocks were in the same park with power but were lacking the torque.
The dyno can tell you a lot about your engine. In fact, Stumpy found that he needed to try a different shift point with his truck.
A dyno is a tool. It is not a competition. When used properly, it will help improve your drag strip experience.
When there is no drag strip close or if you're not a drag racer, dynos can come in handy for tuning your car.
Would it be fair to say that without needing a number to make you feel good about your engine and not being a drag racer, a wideband o2 sensor and a competent operator can be just as effect (and cheaper) than a tuning session on a dyno?
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: AndyF]
#770004
08/10/10 07:46 PM
08/10/10 07:46 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,185 Nanaimo, BC
NOrrTH
OP
super stock
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OP
super stock
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,185
Nanaimo, BC
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Again, thanks for all the excellent advice and comments. Some people say that the numbers are about where there should be given the limited info I have and that gives me the comfort I was looking for. Soooo.... it turns out I had a dead plug. Wouldn't that of shown up on the dyno's computer? Not sure how much a difference that would've made, but ya, there's some lost hp To answer some of the questions: The dyno numbers are uncorrected 83 deg F 33% humidity elevation 103 ft max hp at 4500 rpm max torque 3750 No the dyno guy didn't tune it, just fluids Air fuel line is almost flat after 3k rpm at 13.5 My cousin said "throw on some 906 heads, put 3.91's in it and that will wake that 440 up." The car goes pretty good, I'm not complaining but..another 75 or so hp would be nice
'71 GTX N96 auto 3:55
'74 Challenger 440+6 4spd 4:10
'71 Duster 340 auto 4:10
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Re: Dyno'd my 440 and was disappointed - Questions question
[Re: shupe]
#770005
08/10/10 08:13 PM
08/10/10 08:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,721 Eugene, OR
FuryBoy
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,721
Eugene, OR
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
imho...
Dyno numbers are BS. 1/4 mile times are the true judge...
Fully agree. If you don't like a number go to another dyno till you find one that tells you what you want to hear. All a dyno is is a tool to help peak a combo for the day and conditions at the time of the pull.
Yet another who agrees. Before I start changing carbs or doing leakdowns I'd at least drive the car and get a 1/4 mile mph.
If you dyno'd the car because you drove it and it's a pig, that's another matter.
This was my intention with my original statement.
Yes, a dyno can be a valuable tool for tuning and finding the best way to use your engines powerband. But to try and compare different dyno numbers, in different parts of the country is a little ridiculous.
And E/T is not what tells the story on horsepower, MPH is. You know that Feets...
And I have never been sour at a dyno when we've used one. My car itself has never been dynoed, but my dad laid down 375 RWHP in Reno about 5 years ago with a solid cammed, home ported 906 440. Absolutely smoked some blown small block chevys there that were only putting down 275 hp at the rear wheels. Not sure what happened to those cars...
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